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Re: image 1

Postby gManTexas » Mon Aug 12, 2019 7:44 pm

Only if you are an idiot. It's called using finesse.
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Re: image 1

Postby Choice » Mon Aug 12, 2019 8:09 pm

Yup, new season of Squidbillies has started!

Oooops, I wasn't supposed to feed the troll!
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Re: image 1

Postby renovator » Mon Aug 12, 2019 8:33 pm

Only if you are an idiot. It's called using finesse.

The truth is, you have no idea what's required. The Chicago group didn't probe, and there is plenty of evidence to conclude that while Andy did use a probe to find the Cleveland casque, it was already compromised. To what degree we will never know, but running a piece of rebar through it could not have helped its condition. These are fragile things, and the utmost care should be taken in their recovery IMO.
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Re: image 1

Postby gManTexas » Mon Aug 12, 2019 8:46 pm

renovator wrote:
Only if you are an idiot. It's called using finesse.

The truth is, you have no idea what's required. The Chicago group didn't probe, and there is plenty of evidence to conclude that while Andy did use a probe to find the Cleveland casque, it was already compromised. To what degree we will never know, but running a piece of rebar through it could not have helped its condition. These are fragile things, and the utmost care should be taken in their recovery IMO.


And your point is what?
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Re: image 1

Postby Choice » Mon Aug 12, 2019 8:53 pm

The obvious point is, unless you want to dig out a pile of plastic and ceramic shards you must not drill or poke and probe if you don't even know what depth the cask even is.
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Re: image 1

Postby renovator » Mon Aug 12, 2019 9:40 pm

And your point is what?

As someone who works with power tools all the time, I'm merely suggesting that using one to find a casque isn't the best idea. Not if you really care about preserving whatever condition it may be in after almost 40 years in the ground.
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Re: image 1

Postby gManTexas » Mon Aug 12, 2019 10:13 pm

renovator wrote:
And your point is what?

As someone who works with power tools all the time, I'm merely suggesting that using one to find a casque isn't the best idea. Not if you really care about preserving whatever condition it may be in after almost 40 years in the ground.


I disagree. With a good cordless drill you can adjust the speed and torque. Also, you can run the threaded rod into the ground as slow as you'd like. I say it's a much better method than jumping up and down on a probe.

Having said that, there is some risk of damage whether you probe or dig.
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Re: image 1

Postby renovator » Mon Aug 12, 2019 11:48 pm

I say it's a much better method than jumping up and down on a probe.

As methods go, this is about as dumb as it gets. Of course, most of my professional experience probing is for things that can, if not handled carefully, kill you. Or at the very least, seriously ruin your day. A probe has one function and that is to tell you that something is there, and approximately how deep down it is. If you want any more information than that, you usually have to dig...carefully.
Not for nothing, but I believe that BP probably used one before he buried these things. Probing the area first to make sure he would have no trouble digging makes a lot of sense, attracts almost no attention, and guarantees that he could get in and out quickly when it came time to actually dig the hole and bury the casque.
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Re: image 1

Postby gManTexas » Tue Aug 13, 2019 12:01 am

renovator wrote:
I say it's a much better method than jumping up and down on a probe.

As methods go, this is about as dumb as it gets. Of course, most of my professional experience probing is for things that can, if not handled carefully, kill you. Or at the very least, seriously ruin your day. A probe has one function and that is to tell you that something is there, and approximately how deep down it is. If you want any more information than that, you usually have to dig...carefully.


I'm not sure why you are stating the obvious here.

Anyway, you can do this experiment for yourself. It will cost you about $5 and a few minutes of your time.
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Re: image 1

Postby renovator » Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:10 am

I'm not sure why you are stating the obvious here.

And I'm not sure why you keep asking questions that you should know the answer to. But just to be clear (and keep things civil) I think the idea of using a drill and whatever is attached to it is about as dumb an idea as there is. We already have enough problems with the various Park's Departments. And that's without some well intentioned searcher hitting an underground utility that they have no idea exists until they rupture it because they lack the necessary finesse. You can get all the information you need with a probe, and some patience. A drill will speed up the process, no doubt. But at what cost?
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Re: image 1

Postby gManTexas » Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:12 am

renovator wrote:
I'm not sure why you are stating the obvious here.

And I'm not sure why you keep asking questions that you should know the answer to. But just to be clear (and keep things civil) I think the idea of using a drill and whatever is attached to it is about as dumb an idea as there is. We already have enough problems with the various Park's Departments. And that's without some well intentioned searcher hitting an underground utility that they have no idea exists until they rupture it because they lack the necessary finesse. You can get all the information you need with a probe, and some patience. A drill will speed up the process, no doubt. But at what cost?


Let's agree to disagree. You dig how you see fit.
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Re: image 1

Postby renovator » Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:25 am

You dig how you see fit.

If it's all the same to you GMan, I'll continue to search for these things in a responsible manner, and advise any one else in on the hunt to do the same. The "how you see fit" crowd has caused nothing but problems.
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Re: image 1

Postby phrabbott » Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:28 am

renovator wrote:
I'm not sure why you are stating the obvious here.

And I'm not sure why you keep asking questions that you should know the answer to. But just to be clear (and keep things civil) I think the idea of using a drill and whatever is attached to it is about as dumb an idea as there is. We already have enough problems with the various Park's Departments. And that's without some well intentioned searcher hitting an underground utility that they have no idea exists until they rupture it because they lack the necessary finesse. You can get all the information you need with a probe, and some patience. A drill will speed up the process, no doubt. But at what cost?


You really have to work to put a 3/4” bit through anything including a 6” plexiglass box. Oh right, not supposed to stating the obvious. As someone who works with power tools I’m surprised that you think even a complete Neanderthal could drill through a utility without knowing well beforehand.
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Re: image 1

Postby Choice » Tue Aug 13, 2019 2:07 am

How can one know the difference between drilling through a rock and a clay sewer pipe or PVC pipe or water pipe 3 feet deep? Call 811 to mark the lines for you!
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Re: image 1

Postby phrabbott » Tue Aug 13, 2019 2:58 am

Choice wrote:How can one know the difference between drilling through a rock and a clay sewer pipe or PVC pipe or water pipe 3 feet deep? Call 811 to mark the lines for you!


I would stop if I hit any of the above?


If you can drill through any of those like butter, please send me the bit you’re using!
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