Good thought! Let’s see if we can extract road names / references from these “first lines”:
V1
Fortress north
(road name? e.g. Castle St.?)
Cold as glass
Friendship south
(road name? e.g. Amity Blvd.?)
V2
At the place where jewels abound
(possible road reference? e.g. Ruby Ln.? See N.O. thread)
Fifteen rows down to the ground
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
V3
If Thucydides is
North of Xenophon
(hmm, references to roads? that would make a lot of sense)
Take five steps
In the area of his direction
V4
Beneath two countries
As the
road
curves
(Parkgate Ave. curves right around the Italian and Greek gardens)
(incidentally, MLK Jr. Dr. was still named Liberty Street in 1981, hence the “L bell” in P4; “Bellflower” is far away to the SE, and has nothing to do with it)
V5
Lane Two twenty two
(likely, but not necessarily, a road)
V6
Of all the romance retold
Men of tales and tunes
Cruel and bold
Seen here
By eyes of old
(Pirate Ave? Blackbeard Blvd?)
V7
At stone wall’s door
The air smells sweet
(this could be a road reference)
V8
View the three stories of Mitchell
As you walk
the beating of the world
(this could be a road reference)
At a distance in time
From three who lived there
(there are streets named after people who lived there)
V9
The first chapter
Written in water
Near men
With wind rose
(sorry, I’m just not seeing it with this verse)
V10
In the shadow
Of the grey giant
Find the arm that
Extends over the slender path
V11
Pass two friends of octave
In December
Ride the man of oz
To the land near the window
There’s a road
that leads to
(almost certainly Hwy. 64)
Dark forest
V12
Where M and B are set in stone
And to
Congress
, R is known
(Congress is the road)

digger7

Hey all,
Does anyone have a theory as to why Pics 1 & 12 are narrow with their tops arched while all the others are just rectangular?  Just thought I’d ask.
digger7

Proposed theory…. see Verazano and Golden Gate Bridges…
(when I say see, I mean look through them from the shore)
It is just a proposed reason.

St. Augustine in July.  It’s going to be hot!

Some of the paintings inside Coit Tower are similarly arched.

Egbert

St. Augustine in July.  It’s going to be hot!

I was there last week and it was hot – you have my pity…

Hey all,
Does anyone have a theory as to why Pics 1 & 12 are narrow with their tops arched while all the others are just rectangular?  Just thought I’d ask.
digger7

I reckon this would fall under general questions. Has anyone ever heard of the podcast “Rabbits”? I took the bait on an advertisement I heard because it sounded interesting and was half paying attention to the first episode when I heard “Byron Preiss” and quickly rewound a few minutes. Some serious Baader-Meinhof shit going on for some folks. That said, I remain skeptical but cautiously optimistic re: the new (newer?) wave of Secret enthusiasm means for actually find a cask
https://www.rabbitspodcast.com/episodes/
Start at 32:35 into Episode 1 if you want Secret related material. Overall, the first episode is interesting enough to give a full listen to see the connection. I don’t know if The Secret plays a larger role in episodes to come because I am new to this podcast, but it’s a creative angle nonetheless.
Disclaimer:
I would hope I’ve been around here long enough, but given the reactions to some recent media ventures I want to make it perfectly clear that this is a genuine inquiry and not some kind of advertisement. I am in no way, shape, or form associated with this podcast. I am, however, interested in hearing any thoughts people have if they want to give Rabbits a listen. The podcast is a docudrama but the info on The Secret I’ve heard thus far is mostly correct.

FB,
Thanks for putting those emails all in one location.  That was great.
digger

BP

“(From BPreiss)
Very impressive work esp since the book is 20 years old.  I think you deserve to  know that you are correct about st. Louid,but not correct about the location.thanks for all your excellent work.
“

johann

Yes, that is how the email from BP appeared.  It was obviously some time ago.
I would love to have us work hard on the St. Louis idea.  Honestly, I am stumped on St. Louis.  I originally thought it was in Tower Grove Park on Grand Blvd. in South St. Louis.  I pinpointed an exact patch of ground.  So, when BP told me it was not the correct location, did he mean not that patch of Tower Grove Park or not Tower Grove Park at all?  I don’t know.  I have worked much on a Forest Park theory, as outlined in a couple pic and verse threads, but my digging has turned up naught but dirt.  Alas.

wilhouse

In a message dated 5/18/04 12:06:52 PM, wilhouse writes:
<
thx wilhouse>>
there is a treasure in houston. that’s all i can tell you.

wilhouse

—– Original Message —–
From:
[email protected]
To:
[email protected]
Subject: Re: A final plea before it’s too late
Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2005 10:24:32 EDT
it might be there…it would not be a waste of time to dig there, but I cannot make any
guarantees whatsoever
<
in the children’s zoo, it will be destroyed and I will be heartbroken.
Can you at least confirm whether I am in the right location or not? We found the original article on the casque found in chicago
and noticed that you did originally advise the Chicago finders that they were right. If I am in the wrong location, then the clues to
the casque are gone and the hunt is over anyways. Any information that you would be willing to give up would be greatly appreciated.
regards,
wilhouse>>

sandpiper

Hello fellow treasure hunt people…  I too recieved an E-Mail from Mr. Priess today and here it is…
I wrote…
Hello,
I cannot believe what I just read on the site for your book The Secret.  I used to own one of the books and you had a page in the back that a person could submit if they knew where one was and could not get to retrive it.  That way it was availiable to everyone to play.  I personally thought that I found one and have submitted you several requests and now know that you are not accepting E-Mail’s or the page out of the book for answers to where we think one is.  We must have the actual casque.  That is so very wrong.  You never stated in your book that there was a time limit to find one or that we had to have the actual casque.
He responded…
I am truly sorry you are disappointed. When the book was published there was no internet, no email and no chat rooms. Many people are trying to participate by viewing (illegal) reproductions of the art on the internet, something never contemplated by the book when I wrote the treasure hunt. Nor did the book stipuliate EMAIL as a way of communicating with us. I am unaware of any other 22-year old treasure hunt that is still allowing people to participate. So I would say that we are being reasonable under the vastly changed circumstances of the 21st century.
This was his response to me asking about why E-Mail submitted answers were not allowed.  So…  get the shovels…  let’s dig up the world!
Hehehe…  seconds after I got this E-Mail he responded back with another one for me…
I wrote…
I understand…  it just comes down to now we have to be on the money and I personally cannot afford to fly all over the United States looking for a casque.  I hope you understand that I did not mean to come across rude… just upset that I am now out of the hunt for I cannot make it to the location I found.  Oh well…  I will wait to see if somebody else finds it there and if they do then I will just have to be satisfied with that.  One final question…  do you ever plan to make a second book and or reveal the remaining locations in the future if you discontinue the hunt for them?
He responded…
We don’t plan a second book. There is no restriction , by the way, on finding a person in another place to do the digging for you and splitting the jewel if you win…

I thought it would be neat to gather, in one place, all the correspondence we can definitely attribute to Byron Preiss.
Some time ago, fox dredged up this correspondence from BP to johann, who had sent him a location in St. Louis. Here it is, warts and all:
In response, johann replied:
johann – is there any way to pair BP’s reply to a specific P, V, or P/V pair? I’m guessing that you had a P/V pair in mind that led you to Tower Grove Park, so when BP said you were correct about St. Louis, was he implicitly confirming your P/V choice?
With respect to Houston, wilhouse reports:
and later…
On 9/27/2004, Sandpiper121pp reported:
So it seems there is no question about St. Louis or Houston. It doesn’t look like he was playing with words or trying to be tricky – he simply confirmed that there are/were casques in St. Louis and Houston.
Can others supply other quotes from BP?

I think we are close on St. Louis. It looks like it is in Forest Park and in the Pagoda Circle area. It sounds as though from the verse that the pagoda can be seen from the correct dig site. I hope to have this confirmed in the near future.
In another 4 to 6 weeks hopefully sooner I hope to go on a dig that will turn up more then dirt.

I have also just purchased The Clolck without a Face, but my heart is still with the Secret.  Alas, time to face reality though.  Too much time
has
passed, and the chance of finding any of these treasures is indeed remote.  Perhaps BP made it
too
hard to find the casques.  No criticism intended though.  The Secrect is truely a classic, mesmerizing, and addictive treasure hunt. Very challenging too.
Anyway, I sure learned a lot from this forum, including history, geography, logic, philosopy,art, as well as a great deal of other arcane subject matter too numerous to mention.  For this I thank all of
you
, because you made visiting this Secret site educational and entertaining. And also a lot of fun.  Everybody posting here has had terrific ideas, and the ensuing debates about those ideas often advanced viable pathways toward the solutions.
I will still continue to monitor this site, but I too am now going to devote more time toward the Clock without a Face enigma.   If I get any ideas about the casques I will post them, and I hope all of you will continue to do the same.
Once again, thanks to all for a great ride.

Unknown

Unknown:
If as you say, It is the very purpose of this forum to try to SOLVE the riddles, releasing the answers would cheapen the process and kill the hunt, Even if you didn’t,  How would you know the next person didn’t cheat, a little or a lot…. If the answers became available, there would be a quick rush to go dig up the casques rather then continue to work on the puzzles…

Unknown

Unknown:
Monetarily valuable or not, broken or whole, the casques are a piece of literary history, all the locations would be dug up the day the locations were known… There would be some on ebay before the next day.

Unknown

Unknown:
You say they are worthless?, So if the St Louis casque was on ebay for 10$ you wouldn’t bid? I would, therefore they at least have a value of $10.00. Ask Eggbert how much he would sell his for… I bet I couldn’t afford it… They might be ugly, cheaply made, and broken but worthless? hardly… and the more effort we put into finding them the more it will be worth. If I found one I would never sell it, making it priceless, at least to me.

The point is really irrelevant.
The answers are up to us. Not Preiss. He can’t give them to us. I said I would look at them if they were available and I still say that–I don’t care what anyone else does or does not do–it does nothing to diminish any part of the puzzle for me to know the answers are available. I am a charter subscriber to Games Magazine–which has always had the answers to every puzzle it prints in the back. That has never stopped me from enjoying the process of uncovering them on my own. And I don’t cheat.
Nonsense. Outside of this forum, who cares?
I wouldn’t sell mine either, probably, but not because I wanted so badly to own it. They really ARE worthless, intrinsically–and that’s what I said—that they had NO
INTRINSIC
value.
1
I never said they weren’t worth a price beyond rubies to anyone else who wants them.  The casques were not the “prize” for this hunt–the jewels were. THOSE have intrinsic value.  But what is valued by one is not necessarily valued by another. I’ll bet the casques wouldn’t fetch a sou on eBay. Unless all the bidders were members of this forum.
That really doesn’t matter does it? [shrug]
1
in·trin·sic    (ĭn-trĭn’zĭk, -sĭk)  adj.
Of or relating to the essential nature of a thing; inherent.

I haven’t heard anything to date.
Here’s what I would like:  according to the book, if you think you know where the casque is, you can send the information to someone (Preiss at the time) and you can find out if you were correct.
Preiss gave that up and couldn’t help much as he couldn’t find the answers.
It’d be nice if someone took over that role.  Theoretically it could be the new publisher. Whether he has the answers will determine if there is a next step…
Right now I have not heard anything…
wilhouse

erexere

johann suggested Image10/Verse7 as the St. Louis solution when Preiss emailed the response that “st. louid” was correct but the location was not.

Hey Erexere, how did you know this…? Did you ask Johann…?

I read that in the forum. Something about that doesnt seem right though. I mustve misspoke. I thought it was image 9 / verse 2?

That’s what I thought, but I wish someone could confirm it…

I can confirm something. This treasure hunt is totally fun except for when you’re hungover.

So that’s where I’ve been going wrong.

See my post from Jun 28, 2008 in this thread. It’s a list of some (not all) correspondence from BP.

forest_blight

Some time ago, fox dredged up this correspondence from BP to johann, who had sent him a location in St. Louis. Here it is, warts and all:
In response, johann replied:
johann – is there any way to pair BP’s reply to a specific P, V, or P/V pair? I’m guessing that you had a P/V pair in mind that led you to Tower Grove Park, so when BP said you were correct about St. Louis, was he implicitly confirming your P/V choice?

Thanks for that…so no-one knows then…? I don’t suppose anyone has a contact for him…? He doesn’t answer PMs.

I liked johann’s cheery posts. I assume hes moved on.

johann’s last post was over 3 years ago. He’s one of the greats. Without him, the Cleveland casque might not have been located.

Unknown

Unknown:
He’s one of the greats. Without him, the Cleveland casque might not have been located.

I agree. I wonder if he is aware of the recent resurgence of interest, and could be convinced to re-engage? Does anyone know his real name, or have any contact information for him? I’m sure still thinks about it. The puzzle is insidious that way.

Good Luck shecrab!! are you doing it too malted?

Sure am…I’m just about exactly half-way. Just a few over 25K words. I should be able to finish up easily enough–though we’ve all heard of “famous last words.”
Mine may be “not famous and NO last words.” LOL…
It’s coming along pretty well, though. I had only the barest of plot points to start with, and now I’m totally immersed.
Wish me luck!

Wait Wait, December is National Novel Editing Month…..
January is National Novel Self Publishing Month

give us the link! I’d buy the ebook!!
wilhouse

Wow…thank you!
As soon as I get something set up, I’ll let you all know.

Nice to be back Mr. Wm House and others…even if it is for just an extended weekend for now.

Fenix! Welcome back!
I never visit the wiki — mostly garbage. Q4T is where it’s at.

Wilhouse’s contribution to the Secret effort puts anything on that wiki to shame.
I have a trip exclusively for researching a site planned next month. Sorry I have no details to share as it is only convincing enough for myself to go in for a closer look in person.
MKE is a really strange puzzle, but I have to say some big discoveries were made in the last few years.
I think NOLA’s casque will be recovered in the not too distant future.

Hmm. Sometime, not sure how long ago, we found that the circular symbol on the right side of P5 was a 100% match to an architectural detail in a building not too far from the Chicago site. Not very useful, but still interesting. Other than that, we haven’t made any progress because you left

and if all else fails, the Wilhouse Bulldozer method is an almost sure thing

LOL!!
wilhouse (have bulldozer, will travel!!)

Egbert

I think that half of the State is a bit of a stretch — you could probably find half of a State in almost any picture.  But one never knows, until the treasure is found!  I thought the Cleveland pic was Philly for quite some time, because of the Liberty Bell reference.  I also think that the Statue of Liberty “face” in Image 12 is also somewhat of a red herring, and that Image 12 is Vancouver.

Im curious why Egbert thought Image 12 was linked to Vancouver.

I’d like to bring a bottle of McCallen 18 to the party when the next casque is found. What would others here like to bring and what city and venue would be coolest?

I’ll bring the Devil’s lettuce and some loudmouth soup. Montreal of course. Pick your scenic view from atop Mount Royal.

I will buy a bottle of wine for the next person to unearth a casque.

You could do a trial run and bury a similar-sized piece of metal 3.5′ deep, and see if your detector can locate it.

oh I did that ages ago and posted about it, (no idea which thread)
the answer was no.
but then my key was just a key, I had no idea what kind of metal was used int the real one. Aluminum? steel, Copper?
I believe egbert described it as “pot” metal – which could be anything.
Also I didnt have a plexiglas box (I used a tupperware container. and a flower pot to simulate the box)
but that was just an experiment, it will be interesting to see if my experiment was accurate.

I think i get two points.
That Archaeological Resources Protections Act of 1979 is a real bugger…people should dig up everything and be done with it already so we can get on with our treasure huntery.

If anybody wants the answers to the trivia quiz let me know I will send them to you in a private message.

I own a White’s Coinmaster III metal detector and in an effort to ascertain once and for all if one can sense the casque,
I will scan the area before I dig.
as I understand it the key actually has a piece of metal in it to give it strength.
in the right circumstances it might be detecable if there is no other mineralization in the area.
however I believe it is buried against a cement retaining wall- The wall is probably re-inforced with steel rebar which would mask any smaller pieces of metal.

Eric, I was actually thinking about this too. I was hesitant because I know certain types of soil affects the readings, and anything in the ground could look like a casque I suppose. Anyone on here have any experience with reading GPR scans and is this a viable rabbit hole to go down?
I’m for it if we can gain something from it. Just don’t know how well the data would be interpreted without an ‘expert’…I know it’s been thrown around before, but it might be worth a serious discussion.

whew! i’m glad someone knew, thanks cw!
i did a search on this board but couldn’t find where i’d read about roosevelt park.
bigmatty’s right, the presidents are everywhere, just like columbus……but there is roosevelt mall in storyland too

always wondered how he picked the parks, the  president park theme, seems as likely as any
slappy good idea worth looking in to, but then we have N.O. that park has Ben F. so maybe its
not just only a park named for a president, but something in the park as well
in battery park, there is an  EISENHOWER MALL
http://www.nycgovparks.org/sub_newsroom … p?id=14978

If you look at major parks in major cities in the US, a good percentage of them will be named after former presidents and statesmen.  So it’s pretty likely that some of the casques will be buried in parks named after presidents.

cw0909

always wondered how he picked the parks,

Ole Lakesy…
that is tooo darn funny.  I like this line of thought…not because it is right but because it is something brand new.  I have to agree though…I think that a lot of major parks are named after Presidents/Statesmen…
I am more inclined to believe that he chose his cities first and foremost…possibly following the immigration theme, and then found a nice park with several visual confirmers located within.

FYI:
Boylston Buys Preiss Assets
J. Boylston & Company, Publishers has acquired the assets of the various
companies and imprints owned by the late Byron Preiss. The Preiss
properties were put into Chapter 7 bankruptcy earlier this year. Boylston,
owned by John Colby and home to the Brick Tower Press imprint, paid
$125,000 for the assets, which include more than 500 titles published under
the iBooks, Milk & Cookies Press and Byron Preiss Visual Publications
names. Colby plans to start publishing new titles next year.

I noticed Sean Kelly is listed as the author.  Does anyone know is that the same guy who does lots of Dungeons and Dragons publishing?

Not the same. The Secret’s Sean Kelly did a lot of publishing but not in that field. He also worked for National Lampoon magazine and other concerns, and currently works in children’s television and publishing.

Well, he knew a FEW of the locations. Otherwise he couldn’t have painted the map of Ohio in P4, Roanoke in P3, Charleston in P2, etc.
Ringo – on asking JJP about P5, you do as you see fit (it’s a free country), but personally I wouldn’t want to get even a shadow of a smidgin of a hint from him on anything Secret-related. Consider that if he reveals anything not already known about the Chicago and Cleveland finds, those details could inadvertantly clue us in on the thought process behind the others. Once it’s all over, of course, and we dig up all 12 of these bad boys
I suggest we throw one hell of a party, invite JJP, and talk all night with him over some pitchers.
And as for P5 being for sale, who’s to say the other ones aren’t for sale too? Or sold already? I think we looked into this once, and discovered that the originals far exceeded any of our lifetime earnings. Sure would be nice to own one, though.

Forrest:
I’m not talking about an original.  I would expect those to be in the tens of thousands.  MAYBE more.  I’ve seen original art for sale from artists in the same field before and know what to expect of a price.  Way more than I can afford.
I’m talking about prints.  I have bought only two prints of artwork.  The first was a Bob Eggleton piece used for a Lovecraft inspired anthology and is up Cthulhu.  It is my second favorite piece of Cthulhu art, my favorite is another Eggleton piece, which as far as I know was not made into prints.  That one I saw the original at a show where it was sold at silent auction.  I don’t know the final price, I didn’t place a bid because I knew I couldn’t afford close to what it would go for.  The only other print I’ve ever bought was the painting used on the cover of the SF Book Club omnibus of McCaffrey’s “Harper Hall Trilogy.”  I liked that one because if shows Mneolly and Pieter on a rock reading books with Dragonets flying over their heads.  McCaffrey is my favorite author.  I want to someday own my own used bookstore and it’s a piece I would want to hand in the store I hope to one day have.  The connection between art and literature and my favorite author meant that although I don’t know anything else by that artist I HAD to have that print and get it framed.  I cost me around $50 and in my opinion was worth it [it came matted].  Michael Weehlan did most of the other Dragonrider books, this was a different artist as it was a book club and not the trade editions.
Prints done in a small number to make them limited and collectible would be much more affordable for the consumer, but may not be worth the time of JPP.  Especially if there is not much interest in those particular pieces outside of those of us here.  Like I said Image #11 is the only one I would personally buy a print of if one became available.  I have looked at prints of artists I’ve liked before, but I need to see something that I can say I would honestly invest in a quality frame for and acctually hang on a wall or I pass.
–Ringo

slappybuns

gad you’re feeling better ck,  you were missed, it was so quiet around here.   ;D
was hoping you were on a hunt

Ho!! Glad to hear someone misses me when I’m gone! Thanks!!
The only hunt I’ve been on is for more people to lift boxes! Anyone wanna help?
(not really, of course. I’m nearly finished.)

forest_blight

I know it was probably suggested in jest, but I for one would be extremely disappointed if this hunt ended any other way than by using our noggins to figure out where the casques were buried. Asking JJP for the answers just isn’t cricket.

Yes, I was in jest. I would not want the hunt to end that way at all. I enjoy this research, even if there is nothing at the end of it but an extensive knowledge of the dusty corners of America and a lot of miscellaneous info. Remember, I told you I used to do the Conde Nast “Where are You?” contests every month? I’d still be doing them if the Secret hadn’t come along and eclipsed them; they are my favorite kind of puzzle to do.
I have no desire to bother Preiss’s family either. I think that would be tacky in the extreme. But I don’t see much wrong with talking to JJP about his involvement. His artwork fascinates me, and I’d like to understand him better–how he thinks, what he uses, the media he employs, how long it takes, etc. I’m also a painter, (or used to be,) and I have interests that way. If I ran into him at a con, which is unlikely as I don’t attend them, I’d ask questions. I don’t think he or anyone else “owes” us anything. I would never think to ask him directly for information, however.

As I stated earlier JJP should write down everything he knows and put it in a safe deposit box that will only be accessed should he die or become incapacitated.
JJP likely knows all 12 cities and likely atleast 8 of the 12 parks. He may not know the exact locations though.
He should then tell the parks that have a casque that they do have a casque and as much detail about its location as possible. The park would then be told not to tell us of the location unless construction/renovation that would make it impossible to retreive the casque (i.e. concreteing over the site). He would have to be very careful who he talked to at each park. None of us want the park to dig up a casque except as stated above.
If the park knew for sure they had a casque they would be more inclined to let us dig, provide us information such as the location of a line of trees no longer there and let us jackhammer up a small amount of concrete to retreive a casque (we would have to realy know a location before we did that).
BP’s wishes would remain in tact as none of us would know any more then we did before and in fact BP’s wishes may even be enhanced as our chances of finding things would actually increase.

I think we’ll just have to agree to disagree on this. To my mind, the fewer people who know, the better. Contacting parks could be a disaster, because it depends on the park administration (a) not rushing out to dig it up themselves and (b) wanting to honor the spirit of the hunt and play fair. We can’t count on the latter, and the former is a distinct danger. There is no guarantee that all the casques are in public parks.
Providing information about missing trees, when the party imparting that information is privy to the location of the casque, would be too much help in my opinion. And yes, we certainly *would* know more than we did before, and that would be unfair. Feels too much like cheating. I say let the chips fall where they may. Some casques are probably destroyed by now, and that’s okay (sad, but okay). We can use our brains and find the ones that are left. I prefer to pretend that the hunt operates today exactly as it did in 1982, and that the rules still apply. Once we start running to the teacher to find out answers to the quiz, it kinda misses the whole point.
Not that I can speak for him, but I really do think BP would prefer it if someone deciphered the clues exactly as he intended – without help or hints from anyone who knows the true locations.

scottrocks7

JJP likely knows all 12 cities and likely at least 8 of the 12 parks. He may not know the exact locations though.

I agree with forest on this one.  The puzzles are the puzzles and if we can’t figure them out that is not BP’s problem or JJP’s.  Neither of them owe us anything more than they have already given.
scott, I can see why you might think that JJP would know all 12 cities and some of the parks but I am not sure that is true.  BP could have just given him certain elements of the puzzles to put in the paintings and not told him what they were.  Remember according to BP’s wife he wouldn’t even tell her where these casques are located.  Although I am curious why you think he knows all 12 cities but only 8 of the parks.
In fact, there is nothing in the rules of this hunt that says that there even are 12 different cities.  For all we really know all the casques could be hidden in Chicago and Cleveland.  I am not saying that I believe this but it is possible.

Not saying its right but St Louis has a pretty solid tie in with Jackson Square.

I have another general question:
Has anyone deciphered the writing in the fence and on the shovel-holding fay sitting on the plinth?
I’m just plain bad at this sort of thing.
ck

This is kind of a nice summary of some of the work done here.  It is by a guy named Ben Glover.  Not sure who he is.
http://www.secrettreasure.co.uk/Boston.pdf

Lol…c’est moi. (Four21thrasher has trounced that Boston theory though.)

Happy New Year to One and All
!

Does anyone have any evidence so far that one pace is approximately 1 meter as far as Byron’s applications in this treasure hunt?

erexere

Does anyone have any evidence so far that one pace is approximately 1 meter as far as Byron’s applications in this treasure hunt?

No.

Unknown

Unknown:
Does anyone have any evidence so far that one pace is approximately 1 meter as far as Byron’s applications in this treasure hunt?

My guess would be about 30″ based on the “walk 100 paces Southeast” and the fact that the distance from below the north Lion Bridge to the edge of the clearing along Lincoln Memorial Drive is about 250′ (if we account for twists and turns in the path-“rock and soil”). It’s not really relevant for Verse 8, since we are being directed to an identifiable object (the first young birch), but it may inform Verse 5 which is the only other time Preiss uses the word “pace”, and where the meaning of the direction is less clear.

fox

6)  {this one is a little cryptic}
Re: The SECRET‏
From:
[email protected]
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Sent: Sun 5/30/04 10:08 PM
To:
[email protected]
In a message dated 5/28/04 1:19:59 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
[email protected]
writes: << p;
I can not begin to tell you how excited I am that interest has been revised in this hunt and that a 2nd casque was finally located. Only 10 more to go. My concern, and I believe it to be a valid one, is this. It seems quite obvious by one of the pictures that a casque is buried somewhere in New York City, unfortunately we are still floundering with the correct verse. A wacky theory of mine puts it very close to the tragedy of the Twin Towers. If this is the case, all remains of the casque would have been lost with the countless innocent lives……
>
*** not so. ***

What was the message from BP about there not being a casque in central park?? did that say anything more about NY?

i’m glad you are starting to see the light. Image 12 is very strongly indicateing New York. In fact I think we have it as a definate because we found all the numbers in the image and they matched the lat and long of NYC.
Thus the only way for Image 11 to be Boston is if Image 3 is not Roanoke/Kill Devil Hills. I am open to that idea.
Theirfore we need to get Image 3 nailed down as soon as possible. If we can definately get Image 3 connected to the Kill Devil Hills area then we know Image 11 has to go to Canada and it looks like Ottawa is now the most likely place if that turns out to be the case.

erexere

Someone wants to sell a casque. How do they prove it’s the real thing, and how should it be sold to the highest bidder?
I should clarify that they want to remain anonymous and they don’t want to divulge the location it’s from or their methods for finding it. For all we know, they used one of the theories on the pbwiki…

Take a picture of it to prove it’s real, and put it on ebay to sell it.

Someone wants to sell a casque. How do they prove it’s the real thing, and how should it be sold to the highest bidder?
I should clarify that they want to remain anonymous and they don’t want to divulge the location it’s from or their methods for finding it. For all we know, they used one of the theories on the pbwiki…

This idea may be a little late in the game, but I was thinking, to better determine a process of elimination and for adding confirmers, forming new threads based on
location
.  I like the idea that there is already a St. Loius thread newly formed by Spinner and a Louisville thread started by Trohn.  I see a better clarification that way.  There are also Chicago and Cleveland threads for even further “beating a dead horse” to extract clues for the remaining digs.
(
Dead horse
not referring to Louiville. LOL)
Example threads:
Houston-verse1-image8
North Carolina
Cleveland-verse4-image4-facts
Chicago-verse12-image5-facts
Boston
Canada/Vancouver/Niagara
NY/NJ
New Orleans
Charleston
St Louis
San Francisco
Milwaulkee
Florida
Louisville
Salt Lake City
Take Boston, there may be 1 or 2 threads depending on images and verses seriously being considered until one has been eliminated.
Again, these are examples and anyone may make a new thread in the event a new location arises.  But I think we have them all here.
If I forgot one that someone has in mind, my apologies.  Everyone on this board so far has an inclination as to where they think a casque is and that is mostly due to geological proximity to where they reside, I surmise.  Maybe that is the best way for the purpose of recon.
I think that, for me anyway, so many ideas thrown into one thread becomes a deterant in some way.  An idea worth concidering.

I think the inclination has been to limit new threads unless absolutely necessary. I like the St. Louis and GPR threads that have recently appeared, but I think new threads should be made only if necessary.
Look what happened in the Menagerie(r) forum. Absolutely insane. “The Secret” forum is a model of organization and simplicity.

It’s a good thought Boogieman, but I have to agree with FB.  Think about this:  Let’s say we start a thread called “New York,” and think it’s Image 9 (the gnome) and Verse 6 (the “Edwin and Edwina” verse).  We can start talking about the Dutch connection, posting links to Dutch things, and we do the same thing with Edwin Forrest (or whatever his name is) and have a very long discussion of same.  Then, someone else starts a Salt Lake City thread, and they think that Verse 6 goes with SLC.  Do we repost every Edwin Forrest link and discussion in that thread?  Also, what happens if someone else thinks that a different Verse or Image goes with New York?  It can get very messy, and would have a lot of duplication.

Well, this is really the only experience I have with forums so I will trust you guys with your knowledge of the others.  My thinking on the previous post was try to better weed out any wrong direction we may go in, but it isn’t going that bad as it is.  Going pretty good now, to tell the truth.  Thanks for your input.
Boog

The only way to really eliminate locations is to pull
up the casques.
Until then, all else is fair game.
Edwin and Edwina still has a connection to
Phillie.
If we use what we have and stick to interpretting
the image and verse clues, the locations should
reveal themselves.  (as was done with the Fort)
I think the next one that is close to closure through
inspection is the Lost Colony.  ( getting to the stage that
Milwaukee and Fort Moultrie and Houston City Zoo are in)
The arguments have essentially ended for these, just the exhuming
are needed.  The best asset on here is the groups common goal
(as opposed to a competition)
Remember the motto:  Carpe Dig’um – Seive the Dirt.

Thanks for the explanation…

forest,
i think:
V11
Pass two friends of octave
In December                                            ………………….is NC 12
Ride the man of oz
To the land near the window
There’s a road that leads to (almost certainly Hwy. 64)
Dark forest
i noticed long ago that in the solved ones, in the first lines there was a play on words to mean a road.

forest_blight

The 74 in the water argues for NYC. I believe you were the first point out the latitude/longitude clues, fox

touche
but…P12 seems to me to be the most logical P for Canada…especially Niagra Falls area….. w/ all of the water in the P and the vacinity to NY.

I have to chime in here and say to me image 11 points strongly to Salt Lake City. You have 111 and 41 on top of the arc. 112 in the flowers and 42 on the shirt cuff. The lat-long points to the Salt Lake City area.
In my opinion the weakest links are:
1) NY
2) Boston
3) tie – New Orleans and SF

Is anyone else in or near St. Louis?

I will be moving to Lawrence, KS in early August. I expect that when the need for civilization hits me (shouldn’t take too long), I will drive to Missouri.

FB-
Too bad no image has a Jayhawk.
Lawrence is actually halfway liveable.

Clearly, there is a casque in Kansas:

I wonder whatever became of the original 12 paintings. Does Palencar still have them? The Preiss family? Privately owned? Do they even still exist?
Do you suppose large prints are available?

I have an answer for that one too.  I spoke with John Jude Palencar after the Cleveland find.  Palencar lives in Cleveland, and the place for burying that casque was his idea.  He has the Cleveland painting — it is actually not that large (I think he said it was about 2 feet high), and it is more of a sketch than a painting.  He still has that drawing, because it was one of his first.  He would sell it to me, but at a steep price, so I could not afford to buy it.  I hope to be able to buy it one day, but right now I have a wife and kids to support.  He said that he believes most of the other drawings are in a warehouse in NYC — Byron Preiss owned several warehouses in NYC where he kept all sorts of interesting things.  I did not ask him specifically, but it seemed to me from the conversation that Palencar probably has a few of the other drawings.  However, they would probably be just as pricey.

Egbert-
If you still have contact with him or can forward
me his information, I would love to know if he has
image 9.
I am sure the price isn’t too steep to buy just one.
Thanks.  Let me know.

His drawings and paintings sell for many 1000s of $.  That is not a misprint.

Interesting that the paintings are worth more than the jewels. I’d rather have a painting!

One of a kind originals
of a pioneer.
I assumed they would be a few
thousand.
I am still interested in
the jockey/gnome.

Interesting question indeed.  I would love to get my hands on one of those…..

I can’t wait for the Chicago trip. The trouble will be convincing my girlfriend that it’s worth the 1.5-hour (each way) side-trip to Milwaukee…
johann – the lecture topic is advanced uses of multiple regression analysis. I would elaborate, but it’s slightly off-topic!

The only significance in knowing the month that I could figure out was that it helped in identifying the jewel itself–because as you can see by examining the images, there is no clear way to determine what some of them are. Ruby, turquoise, garnet, opal–sure–but amethyst? Topaz? in the images they are both blue, and that just isn’t the way most people think of amethysts and topazes. Also, it’s hard to tell the difference between March’s aquamarine and April’s diamond. Is that green one emerald or peridot? The month tells you.
From the jewel, you can determine the “nationality” associated with the images, and therefore the locations likely they are hidden.
Example: March–>Aquamarine–>Greek–>Cleveland’s Greek cultural gardens, where the casque was found.

Can anyone explain the significance of the month associated with each picture, and how this may be significant in reaching a solution?

No postings on the Secret site since April 1?  Did everybody loose intrest?  Anybody out there?

yeah… i noticed that fox hasn’t been around lately…  say somethin’ fox!!!

I e-mailed fox several weeks ago threatening to visit Albuquerque, but got no response. Hope he’s okay!

shecrab

This is a test—there has been no activity for over a week, and I just wanted to see if everything was still working!!

PUNCH DRUNK phase.  It happens.  One good idea and we’re back in the saddle.  I just don’t have any yet.  Anybody else?
Hey, where’s Fox?

as far as I know, everything is working fine.
digger7

wilhouse

more like this
“The confirmer images were right here…I swear!”

guys, I am going from memory here, but if you do some searches you will find the posts.
Fox (I believe) communicated with Preiss and he did state that one was in Canada.
Johann (again, I believe) communicated with Preiss and (I believe) he confirmed that there was one in St. Louis.
Look, Preiss and I communicated over a period of 2 years.  He was cryptic by nature. Rarely did he give direct answers.  Sometimes, even his direct answers didn’t make sense.  But I am pretty sure his agreement with Canada was clear.  The St. Louis one I am less sure of.
Fox and Johann will have to confirm…
wilhouse

I have just noticed Fox was in the forum.  Are you hiding in the bush Fox?

no bush
hiding here…just trying to get caught up on the past 4 months of missed posts.  some quick comments:
I really really like the progress on the Milwaukee casque…
I am really not too sure about the SLC theory…
Still intrigued about the Washington Sq theory but….asphalt?…seems unlikely…besides the “other” Edwin & Edwina sure fit more nicely
Whew…think I may have gotten caught up…nice to be at the inlaws for the extended weekend with internet access
Now to what I was asked here….YES I will confirm that the email of BP I posted some time ago was authentic and YES, he came right out and stated that there was a Canadian Casque.  I also remember Johann speaking of the St Louis casque and may even have an email confirming this as well.
It sure is nice to be back amongst friends
even if it is only for an extended weekend…..

I can imagine it now: “Sure, you found this fancy flowerpot doohickey down in Florida, but that doesn’t mean we give you permission to dig on Liberty Island. This is New York City here, we got standards!”

Posted on: Yesterday at 06:45:12 pmPosted by: wilhouse
Insert Quote
http://www.bricktowerpress.com/
note the link for BPVP.
maybe we ought to contact him to look through the stuff for the secret folder!
wilhouse
check that, I did!
————————————————————————————–
Re: General Questions
« Reply #281 on: Today at 04:01:32 pm »
——————————————————————————–
That would utterly spoil the fun.
————————————————————————————–
im with fb if someone does get the soultions i would rather not know the answers
i asked because since it is maybe now owned, by these folks
i was just wondering what, they would do say if someone found it and
tried to turn it in for prize
or would they maybe try to make a few $$$ off it somehow
they being the co. that may own it

wilhouse

maybe we ought to contact him to look through the stuff for the secret folder!

I have a question for everyone.  If the solutions were made available would you want them?  I personally would but that is just me.

wilhouse

check that, I did!

You did what?  Contact them?  Can’t wait to hear their reply.  Be careful though, you may just get all of the answers to the hunt…do you want that?

That would utterly spoil the fun.

I’m not sure why your posts aren’t showing up. No moderators on this board — try posting again?

Pure speculation here but if you read through the book it talks about a second edition of The Secret. This was never published likely due to lack of interest in the original version. But I think what he was going to do was go around the world and hide the keys once the keys were found they could be used to unlock a grand prize or prehaps additional clues to what he thought would be the few unfound casques. The theam of the next edition of the secret was likely going to be the mystery of the keys.

I think you are 100% correct.
NC12 starts at Kitty Hawk, and heads south.
This explains the december reference and starts us at kitty hawk and takes us past it heading south
along the Virginia dare highway…
This fits in excellently with the solved solutions.

slappybuns

Pass two friends of octave

I don’t think this refers to a person.  Everytime BP mentions a real person in any of the verses he always capitalizes the first letter of the word as you should with a proper noun.  octave isn’t capitalized so despite the fact that the WB had a friend named Octavius I don’t think this is what it refers to.

I really like the NC12 theory. Nice one.
Also, Chanute’s name was literally “Octave,” not “Octavius.”

Here is the revised “road” list, with slappybuns’ addition:
V1
Fortress north
(road name? e.g. Castle St.?)
Cold as glass
Friendship south
(road name? e.g. Amity Blvd.?)
V2
At the place where jewels abound
(possible road reference? e.g. Ruby Ln.? See N.O. thread)
Fifteen rows down to the ground
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
V3
If Thucydides is
North of Xenophon
(hmm, references to roads? that would make a lot of sense)
Take five steps
In the area of his direction
V4
Beneath two countries
As the road curves
(Parkgate Ave. curves right around the Italian and Greek gardens)
(incidentally, MLK Jr. Dr. was still named Liberty Street in 1981, hence the “L bell” in P4; “Bellflower” is far away to the SE, and has nothing to do with it)
V5
Lane Two twenty two
(2/22… Washington’s Birthday? Washington Lane??)
V6
Of all the romance retold
Men of tales and tunes
Cruel and bold
Seen here
By eyes of old
(Pirate Ave? Blackbeard Blvd?)
V7
At stone wall’s door
The air smells sweet
(this could be a road reference)
V8
View the three stories of Mitchell
As you walk the beating of the world
(this could be a road reference)
At a distance in time
From three who lived there
(there are streets named after people who lived there)
V9
The first chapter
Written in water
Near men
With wind rose
(sorry, I’m just not seeing it with this verse)
V10
In the shadow
Of the grey giant
Find the arm that
Extends over the slender path
V11
Pass two friends of octave
In December
(NC 12)
Ride the man of oz
To the land near the window
There’s a road that leads to
(almost certainly Hwy. 64)
Dark forest
V12
Where M and B are set in stone
And to Congress, R is known
(Congress is the road)

digger7

I don’t think this refers to a person.  Everytime BP mentions a real person in any of the verses he always capitalizes the first letter of the word as you should with a proper noun.  octave isn’t capitalized so despite the fact that the WB had a friend named Octavius I don’t think this is what it refers to.

Careful with generalizations, 2 known verses only have mention 3 names by name, one name Lincoln, is merely mentioned by initial (capitalized, thats true)
It could be a red herring, and octave could allude to music, but with the very elegant road solution = nc12
(known verses refer to a road in the first few lines…)
it sure resolves nicely…

Splumer, great pics and nice work retracing some of the steps of the Cleveland find. Which of the other puzzles are you most interested in?
All, I liked that Vice Magazine article by Zach Brook. Looks like decibalnyc, animalpainter and other Milwaukee folks have been having a lot of fun.

sorry

Would anyone be willing to create and post a local map showing the known hint locations for each of the two that were found?

mindydaile

Can you enlighten us please on who this forum member is? The only email from Preiss I can find on this forum that references St. Louis was the email response to Johann where he’d proposed a dig site in Forest Park (St. Louis, MO).
Which forum member received a letter after submitting a dig site in New Orleans?

You are correct that there was a proposed dig in Forest Park by the author

“st. louid” was from that response about Forrest Park in St. Louis, but which verse and image pair were in effect for that derivation?
I think it was Image 9 with Verse 2.
If Verse 2 is truly linked to Image 7(imho,NOLA) then Preiss’ response implicates a St. Louis connection to NOLA.

Technically You are only allowed to post your correspondence with BP anything else would be a copyright infringement.
and also technically any text or images in any form, from the book is illegal (as bp pointed out).
So basically this whole thread is an infringement, so whats a little more…

maltedfalcon

Technically You are only allowed to post your correspondence with BP anything else would be a copyright infringement.
and also technically any text or images in any form, from the book is illegal (as bp pointed out).
So basically this whole thread is an infringement, so whats a little more…

If necessary, we can utilize the lawyers that ATT uses

I simply reproduce (quoted) material from other forum users. Quoting a quote of something someone said, with proper citations, hardly constitutes a crime. You can quote me on that.

Still if the base quote was infringing, reposting it is just as infringing.
however many times it was quoted…

dumb question FB, are we allowed to post correspondence from BP?  there isn’t a chance for any legal ramifications is there?

Sorry to hear that.
He will be missed.

I’m sorry to have to post this, but one of our regular hunters, Paul Skoda, (Adoks53) passed away very suddenly and unexpectedly on Saturday, June 30, 2007. I received word today from his oldest daughter, Shannon. Paul was on his way home from a laundromat when he simply dropped to the ground. Gone in an instant, literally.
He was a fantastic artist–I posted his “Dig Here” picture here for everyone–he wanted you all to share it. And he had a wonderful wacky sense of humor, though not much computer savvy. Paul had his own theories about the Secret, and what the text of the book revealed–we had many lively discussions about aspects of it, and he sent me photos of his journey to Oregon when he was working the puzzle “Treasure: In Search of the Golden Horse”.  I received almost daily emails from him, mostly small talk and chatter–he made me happy every day of the week by simply saying “good morning, shecrab!”
His artwork hangs in a special place in my house. And his memory will forever hang in a special place in my life. Sometimes the people we meet on forums become our friends, and that is a good thing, always.
Christin Keck

*Damn*  Didn’t he always say ‘Just having fun’

Indeed he did.  I didn’t know Adoks53 very well – just from his posts on The Secret board, but his posts were always upbeat and cheerful.  I don’t think I ever saw a negative post from him.  Sad news.

Oh my!  My sincere condolences to you Shecrab, and to Paul’s entire family.  He will be missed here, along with his subtle sense of humor.

I still like P9 as our Canadian P…

boogieman

Yup.  no matter how tight we try to keep the forum, something always gets mixed up.  Inevitable?
Scotty, in general, what about the dog leg in image9 clues you into the 1904 World’s fair in St Louis?

searching dogtown :
http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=n … own+st+lou
found this site in the search, wow! dogtown it is,Bob Corbett is the man
http://www.webster.edu/~corbetre/dogtow … html#links
looked at a couple of links, cant make date out on the pics here, 1966/76
http://www.usgennet.org/usa/mo/county/s … splate.htm
this man Bob Corbett, is the local historian on dogtown
http://www.webster.edu/~corbetre/dogtow … patch.html
will move this to p-9 also
forgot to mention this seems to dump my therory on v-2, oh well nothing like starting over

But it’s not a dog eating the leg. It’s probably a lion. And the leg always has a hoof, so that can’t be a dog either. This isn’t just an opinion – we established it a long time ago by researching the origins of that lamp base from Montreal (which is a 100% match).
Speaking of which, we had a series of messages in the Image 9 thread back in April/May 2007 where I reported tons of research to discover who manufactured the lamppost in Montreal, looking for clues that might lead us to other such lamps in diggable places. If anyone here lives near Philadelphia, PA, Winterthur, DE, or Washington, DC and wouldn’t mind making a run to a library to look through some dusty tomes in search of hidden treasure, please let me know. I have call numbers for J. W. Fiske catalogs that may provide more clues to the purchasers of similar lamps. THAT, in turn can lead us to a city and maybe even a square foot with a big “X” on it, if you know what I mean.

Thanks Egbert.
Sounds like it was a hoot to create this.

I spoke with John Palencar just a few minutes ago.  He reminisced about Byron Preiss for quite awhile, and how they used to send packages of stuff to each other with “The Secret” stamp emblazoned in wax on them for the seal.  He would receive from Byron pictures and notes on a “need to know” basis, so he only knew of the exact locations of “only about 2 sites.”  I mentioned to him that the original article on the book mentions that there is a contingency in the event of BP’s death, but John did not know what it was.  Other than BP’s wife (with whom I already spoke, as you know), John would be the only other person who would have any important connection to The Secret.
Here is the interesting part.  John said that BP’s estate is probably still winding up BP’s affairs, since it is probably a large estate.  He said that he wouldn’t rule out just yet that he may get some type of envelope in the mail with instructions, but he does doubt that it would happen.  Nevertheless, because he feels that he is still under contract, he is sworn to secrecy, and he cannot talk about any of the sites (including Houston — sorry Wilhouse).  He says that as directed, he burned all of the photos and notes a long time ago when the book was published, and thus he does not have any of the solutions.  However, he gave me his email address, and perhaps I can check in with him again in a few months, to see if he received anything from BP’s estate.
So, this does not look promising.  One final avenue which I have not yet pursued, and perhaps someone else would like to try, is to contact Bantam Books, the publishing company.  Bantam supposedly is the owner of the solutions (and the jewels), so perhaps the company has something on what would happen in the event of BP’s death.  Just a thought.

From the solves we have,  all of the lines in the verses
have literal and solid references to key off of
(or in Byron’s case, to photograph)
Cases solved:  M and B in stone (on the building)
Socrates, etc… (on the monument)
So if we have likely casque sites, we should see known
references in physical form.
Case in point: the kitty Hawk monumnet quote
(while not at the casque site, it is a physical reference to
the last line of the verse – due south of)
Signs to locate at the site:
-checkerboard dome (a sign (highway?) reference)
– eighteenth day, tweleveth hour (plaque indicating where Paul Reverse was at midnight)
– May 1913  (a building cornerstone, a statue dedication)
Any other known references where a Physical/Literal representation would narrow
down a larger area??

well… if you read my idea on manhattan, theres the 2 washington statues on the arch at the entrance to washington square park, but i don’t believe it’s near a race track! just havin’ fun!!!

Trohn:  You are absoultely correct about looking and seeing known references in physical form(s) near the casque sites.  Images 4 and 5 bear this out, as both have many discernable “landmarks” within them that link to physical forms near the casque sites.  That much is clear.
However, the Roanoke/ Kitty Hawk casque, which many here agree is linked to Image 3/verse 11, is a complete paradox.  The verse
does
seem to clearly lead to Roanoke Island and the Fort Raleigh National Historic Site.  The verse can bring you right onto the beach, where you can then look north at the “wing.”
The problem is this: There don’t seem to be any forms from Image 3 that correspond to any physical forms in the National Historic Site, or the “dark” maritime forrest.  I have been to the site many times looking for the casque ( and am going again in late August), but have not been able to link even one aspect in the Image with a physical form anywhere on Roanoke Island, or specifically the Fort Raleigh National Historic Site.  This is very preplexing, because the verse is most definately pointing to this location. Why can’t anyone find a physical connection to the Image?   If it is under a tree, as the verse may be infering, how does one determine from Image 3 which tree (in a forrest of thousands) is the correct casque location?
I
do
have a specific idea of what can be” last touched or first seen standing,”  but with no nexus between Image 3 and a physical form in the forrest, there is no way to be sure.  When you go into the forrest and follow the sandy paths to the sea, nothing at all suggests a physical form from Image 3, nor does anything from the visitors center.  As I said, a complete paradox.

I found this pattern on a bench in the Elizabethan Gardens:
Close, but not exact…

FB:  As you say, it is very close. And it is a great find. The problem I have is that the renderings in Images 4 and 5 are quiet specific to the actual physical “landmarks” found at or near the casque sites.  For instance, the fence post in Image 5 is identical to the actual fence post at the location in Grant Park. And that is only one example. I am, like everyone else, using the clues in Images 4 and 5 as blueprints for locating the other casque locations.  Thus, for Image 3/verse 11, there has to be (as there are in Images 4 and 5)  physical “landmarks”  that are also in and around the casque location.  Yet the maritime forrest on Roanoke Island is just that: thousands of trees, sand, and driftwood.  The other images
clearly
show landmarks that are acurately depicted as they appear at the actual casque locations.  They may be jumbled together in the artwork of the Image, but they are physically at the casque locations and look the same as the rendering in the Image.  Trust me, I want to find the Roanoke casque and will keep trying.

yes thats why i went looking around close by,
and found the park, another park not far from st louis,
is mt royal, has a pond, and trails. link to park and the pdfs
http://www.lemontroyal.qc.ca/en_carte/index.html
on the trail map upper right corner, kinda looks like the nose
and neck line. not enough though just kinda

did anybody notice in the photo of the legeater
the building in the background (niche, included) lines up with the wierd object (not counting the umbrella shapes)

forest_blight

Too true, fox. Maybe the other 10 are all buried in Jackson Square! That certainly would make our task easier…

In that case, everyone grab a digging utensil and meet me in N.O.

If their is then I need to ask about Forest Park and Pagoda Circle.

Well, we now know it wasn’t Heaven for sure.
BTW: I’ve posted a summary idea under the thread for Verse 5, if any of you care to read and comment.

Has anyone had the inclination to study the verses in terms of the verb usages?

boogieman

Egbert, reply honestly with no regards to offending.  I really would like your opinion on this, being a Jersey guy yourself.

I think that half of the State is a bit of a stretch — you could probably find half of a State in almost any picture.  But one never knows, until the treasure is found!  I thought the Cleveland pic was Philly for quite some time, because of the Liberty Bell reference.  I also think that the Statue of Liberty “face” in Image 12 is also somewhat of a red herring, and that Image 12 is Vancouver.

With these ongoing discussions on finding
and fine tuning casque sites, is there any
enthusiasm remaining for Milwaukee?
Is there anything to indicate anything?

Trohn

years, what if when asked about St Louis
he was mistakingly thinking of a
Louisville site.
I believe he did say “Johanna was looking
at the wrong place.”

I think that is a huge Longshot (just keeping in your theory).  Even after 20+ yrs, I do not see how one can mistake St. Louis with Louisville.  I think BP graciously said that S.L. is the right city Johann…you just have the wrong park.
Of course I could be wrong but, in this case, I highly doubt it.

Discernable buildings are apparent, and have been identified in Images 4, 5, and 10:
Image 4: Upside down silhouette of the Terminal Tower in Cleveland
Image 5: Chicago Water Tower ( plus turret from Chicago Water Works across the street)
Image 10:  Top spires of the Milwaukee City Hall
Aside from the odd rectangular renderding in Image 12, which may or may not represent an actual building, are there any other buildings or  parts of buildings (or infastructure) apparent to anyone in any of the other images that help to narrow the locations?

Image 9.
Above left shoulder. (right side of image)
White impression on the
tan background.
I see a two spired roof.

Good observation Trohn, I hadn’t noticed that before.  Any ideas on the building(s) or location?

*Laugh*  Kato…..
ask anyone what I think this is….

Trohn’s 2 spired building….

I’ll miss you by about 2 months–actually I’ll be in Milwaukee over this weekend at a conference and hope to poke around a bit.  Will be fun to compare notes later. Hopefully the weather will hold up.  I’ll be looking for confirmers for the true starting place of V8 (if this goes with the Milwaukee pix) and checking out other suspected hot spots.  Have fun in Chicago.  I’ve seen the pictures from someone elses trek there–pretty cool.  Talk with you after.

Forest Blight–
Being from Chicago, now living in St. Louis, I have traced the path to the casque.  I hope you feel the same excitement I did.  BTW, what is your lecture topic?  I would like to see a thread in which we can share info about what we all do for a living.  We would probably discover some interesting professions.

WhiteRabbit

Thanks for that…so no-one knows then…? I don’t suppose anyone has a contact for him…? He doesn’t answer PMs.

That’s the modern map of the Montreal electoral district known as “Westmount-Saint Louis”. Granted the borders have changed over the years and I’m working on it, but according to my research (i.e. Wikipedia), this district was formed in 1994 from parts of Saint-Louis, Westmount and Sainte-Anne districts. From 1966 to 1994, the district was simply “St. Louis”. Until I can find the exact map of the old 1966-1994 St. Louis district, I’ll assume it is the areas of this map not clearly labeled “Westmount” (bottom left) or “Sainte-Anne” (sliver at bottom center). Works for me.

i’m here, computer was sick, listening to everything you all say just getting lost in the fair folks guide.

I just watched an episode of Mega Movers and they were showing an episode where they were moving the 982 locomotive from Hermann Park to MinuteMaid Stadium.  I thought I saw one of the workers kick aside a small plexiglass box.   No, just kidding but it was pretty cool watching them move the train.

Unknown

Unknown:
I thought I saw one of the workers kick aside a small plexiglass box.

You kidder. Can you imagine??

It looks like the forum got hacked. Did you see all the crap posts in the Menagerie threads?

animal painter

Cormac,
I put it down to Post-election Syndrome
…
AP

Hey MF!!!! What’s your handle on NANO? I’ll add you as a writing buddy!
You can add me too…shecrab.
GOOD LUCK TO YOU!! I hope you make it! I’m rootin’ for ya!

animal painter

Shecrab,
Just read your excerpt…You are indeed talented.

Ditto!!!
Go Go Go!
I too am nanowrimoing,
I think this is my 4th or 5th year  This time I will make it!!!!
I have been so busy writing I havent updated my count yet….  trying not to look…

maltedfalcon
23500

can someone tell me how to resize photos so that they are small enough to be posted on the tweleve website.  I took a few pics over the summer that I want to post but they are more than 1 Mb in size and I believe that in order to post them to the tweleve website they can only be 240 kb.
thanks for the help.
digger7

digger, what would be better for all is to open an account on a photohosting site, such as Flickr or Photobucket or Imageshack. Then you upload your images, and they resize them for you, and give you code so you can embed them into your posts. All these hosting sites are free. I use Imageshack. It’s pretty simple. Yahoo.com uses Flickr, and depending on your browser/IP service, you might be able to get one as part of that.
An alternative is to open the picture file in Windows Paint or Microsoft Photo Viewer and open the image for editing. If you use Paint, on the toolbar above is a selection called “Image” and under that will be a drop-down menu to resize (shrink/skew) the image. You can simply put in the percentage of original size you want it to be, say, 50% of original, until you get the size you want. By right-clicking your mouse on the image and highlighting properties, you can find out how many bytes your pic is after re-sizing.
If you have any other photo-viewing/editing software, there will be an option to resize your photo there, as well.

Irfanview is anive piece of free software.
http://www.irfanview.com/
Mark

erexere

Splumer, great pics and nice work retracing some of the steps of the Cleveland find. Which of the other puzzles are you most interested in?

Thanks! I’m most interested in the verse 11/image 33 combo, which is believed to be Roanoke Island, NC. We’ve vacationed there a couple of times, and my niece lives in Salvo, which is a bit south of there. We’re thinking of going down again next summer.

forest_blight

“Hard” I agree is weird to capitalize (so is “Vols.”), but I think he capitalized “Fair” because of the special role the Fair Folk play in
The Secret
. It’s also capitalized in V12. So “Fair remuneration” might mean “Fair Folks’ treasure.”

True enough…but he used it in other places UNcapitalized. Ah well–it’s probably useless to try to figure this out.
I’m beginning to think–no I take that back—I’ve been thinking this for a while now–that Preiss was probably writing these off the cuff a lot of times. I remind myself that he got his start at the Harvard Lampoon—and I have only recently bought a whole bunch of old National Lampoon magazines from the 70’s, when some of the contributors to the Secret were on the staff or contributing. I forgot how utterly clever they used to be then–and how obscurely humorous at times. No doubt this was pretty much Preiss’s demeanor too.

Unknown

National Lampoon magazines from the 70’s, when some of the contributors to the Secret were on the staff or contributing. I forgot how utterly clever they used to be then–and how obscurely humorous at times. No doubt this was pretty much Preiss’s demeanor too.
funny i thought about something, along the lines of, MJ talking to HERB about BUD, is why some things
in the verses seem off, just because of that National Lampoon connection, about a week or so ago
ahh nothing just that generation time thought thingy

Unknown

Unknown:
areful with generalizations, 2 known verses only have mention 3 names by name, one name Lincoln, is merely mentioned by initial (capitalized, thats true)

Only 2 verses…
??
Huh???
All the names are capitalized–when they’re names. That’s not a generalization at all!
To wit:
Verse 1: December
Verse 2: (no names)
Verse 3: Thucydides, Xenophon
Verse 4: Socrates, Pindar, Apelles
Verse 5: (no names)
Verse 6: Edwin, Edwina, May — and also the word *Fair* (hmmm…..the “Fair remuneration?” Something from a Fair maybe?)
Verse 7: Twain
Verse 8: Mitchell
Verse 9: (no names)
Verse 10: Indies, Hard, B
Verse 11: December, July, August—-but not oz!! and not octave either!
Why NOT?
Verse 12: M, B, Congress, R, L,  Fair Folks’
Preiss was an editor and publisher–he would be conditioned to print a proper noun properly capitalized. I wonder why he did NOT print octave and oz with caps–and why
hard
and
fair
were. This seems more than just generalized convention–it seems significant.
I think I found why hard was–because it was extremely significant in the description of the person (IMO, Jacques Cartier); but why ‘fair’ ?
Octave means ‘range of eight.’ that can be eight of anything. Eight music notes, sure–but eight shoe sizes, or eight fenceposts, or eight graduated-size widgets. Why use December to mean 12  and not octave to mean 8?

shecrab – My theory for why “octave” was not capitalized is that, if BP *had* capitalized it, that would be a sure giveaway that we should be looking for someone
named
“Octave.” Leaving it in lowercase provides a little misdirection. Avoiding the obvious interpretation (group of eight) is the leap of intellect the reader has to perform to get it right. That’s my theory, anyway.

in other cases when he wanted to obscure a name he just used the first letter of the name: M=Mozart, B=Beethoven, L=Lincoln, and isle of B=?????
If he meant Octavius here why wouldn’t he do the same thing?

Probably because it would be too obscure.

And you would be correct, probably. (If that’s what it is.) But why not capitalize Oz, then?

Ah, now that’s a good question! Perhaps for the same reason, but there is less ambiguity about what “oz” means than about “octave.” “Ounce,” maybe, but you’d (a) expect it to have a period after it or (b) need “Man of… ounce(?)” to mean something for the double meaning to cause misdirection. But there’s really only one clear interpretation of “oz,” and that’s the land across the Nonestic Ocean. Maybe the double-meaning he intended (if that is the case) was to get people thinking “wizard,” because he’s probably the first “man of oz” to leap to mind, but then you’d expect him to have capitalized it.
I don’t know about that one.

Unknown

Unknown:
Preiss was an editor and publisher–he would be conditioned to print a proper noun properly capitalized. I wonder why he did NOT print octave and oz with caps–and why hard and fair were. This seems more than just generalized convention–it seems significant.
I think I found why hard was–because it was extremely significant in the description of the person (IMO, Jacques Cartier); but why ‘fair’ ?

“Hard” I agree is weird to capitalize (so is “Vols.”), but I think he capitalized “Fair” because of the special role the Fair Folk play in
The Secret
. It’s also capitalized in V12. So “Fair remuneration” might mean “Fair Folks’ treasure.”

shecrab

Only 2 verses…
??
Huh???
All the names are capitalized–when they’re names. That’s not a generalization at all!
To wit:

Yup, only 2 verses that you know have names that refer to people.
until you solve a pix/verse and find another casque, you are merely surmising that the names in the other verses are names of people and not some other kind of clue…
For example in verse 7 Twain is capitalized and probably means Mark Twain, Unless it means two figures on the totem pole, or is some other obscure reference. To assume (at this point) capitalization means Person is generalizing and could lead to making an erroneous conclusion.
I think BP was clever enough to mislead by red herrings on purpose, including mis-capitalizations.

Seems they left sometime over the weekend.
(I am keeping track on the side.)
I haven’t seen any posts go, but anthing’s possible.

home depot sells a sprinkler pipe tool that is a long spike with a handle.  usually near the sprinkler stuff.
wilhouse

Hey, what happened to the APPLAUD & SMITE options?  Anyone know?  Some posts have dissappeared as well.

Will be probing for the Roanoke casque at the end of this month.  Can anyone reccomend a specific tool and/ or commercial probe that can be used?

I have used a type of plant stake available in the lawncare/gardening section of a hardware store.  I probed by tapping it into the ground with a hammer.

The Secret, A treasure Hunt
Trivia quiz.
No peeking,
1. Who is/are the authors of “The Secret, A treasure Hunt.
A. Byron Preiss
B. John Jude Palencar
C. Sean Kelly/ Ted Mann
D. Overton Loyd/ John Pierard
2. What exactly is the secret?
3. Who arrived last to the new world?
4. Why didn’t the Viking elves bring a jewel?
5. Prince Yi, His Wang Mu and Tsao-shen brought something with them, that the fairies thought they  would never see again, what was it?
6. How many Nations of Fairy arrived in the New World?
7. What year was “The Secret, A treasure hunt “ published?
8. Who was Yo-rib of the Yar-on?
8. Vincent helped design the book and cover, who was he?
how many did you get before you looked?

The cultural gardens has many small gardens in roosevelt park

the chicago find was in Grant Park (grant, 18th president), and the cleveland find was in roosevelt park, right? (franklin, 32nd president, theodore, 26th)
could this be a link, that it will be a park named after a president?

slappybuns

the chicago find was in Grant Park (grant, 18th president), and the cleveland find was in roosevelt park, right? (franklin, 32nd president, theodore, 26th)
could this be a link, that it will be a park named after a president?

I like that – the SF casque could then be possibly in lincoln park…
but what about houston, and the canadian casque….

slappybuns

the chicago find was in Grant Park (grant, 18th president), and the cleveland find was in roosevelt park, right? (franklin, 32nd president, theodore, 26th)
could this be a link, that it will be a park named after a president?

Houston’s is (was) in Hermann Park — named, of course, after our 18 1/2th president, Winchester P. Hermann III.  Milwaukee’s is most certainly in Lake Park, which, incidentally, was not named after a president, but America’s first Native American god-king, Fearsome Bear of Raging Lake.  The natives called him “Ol’ Lakesy” for short.

slappybuns

the chicago find was in Grant Park (grant, 18th president), and the cleveland find was in roosevelt park, right? (franklin, 32nd president, theodore, 26th)
could this be a link, that it will be a park named after a president?

I thought the Cleveland find was in the Cleveland Cultural Gardens.  Never heard of it being the Roosevelt Park….

hmmm, i just read that somewhere about roosevelt park, i think it was during a search, i’ll look again, try to find it….
lol, bigmatty!
i’m sorry guys,  i just write things that pop in my head without thinking them through.

yes the Cleveland Cultural Gardens is in  Roosevelt Park, the park covers both sides of MLK blvd
i think our severance hall is in the park also, you might want to check that though
great idea about the parks named after a president

Boogie:
You hit on the point that I was sure I had already read elsewhere.  Even JJP did not know the actual locations.  I do agree that it would be NICE to know some clues on the places that have changed.  However, that may be part of the fun.  The internet wasn’t around back then, to it’s possible to do research involving photos from 25 years ago.  It’s certainly not easy, but POSSIBLE, and the mystery is certainly fun.

forest_blight

I know it was probably suggested in jest, but I for one would be extremely disappointed if this hunt ended any other way than by using our noggins to figure out where the casques were buried. Asking JJP for the answers just isn’t cricket.

I would be disappointed if the hunt ended that way, too. I was just thinking that it would be nice if JJP could say something like, “Oh that castle on the box is based on a building in Boston” or something that would let us know that we’re on the right track.
But alas, I guess we’re on our own.

Don’t have much time to write but JJP sohuld write down everything he does know and put it in a safe deposit box. This information would only be accessed should he die or become incapicated. I will elaborate more on this later.

turtle123456

how do we get ahold of priess widow. i need to know this when i pull one out of the ground in the next few months

Stick to your guns turtle.  Back to NY again or out to S.F.?

If you found a casque, you were to contact Preiss. Not the publisher.You sent it directly to his company,
Visual Publications, Inc., Box 5329 FDR Station, New York, NY 10150.
And it’s been stated that the solutions are in the possession of Preiss’s widow, in his papers, or as part of his estate, and the jewels in a safe deposit box somewhere.

The last time I heard, BP couldn’t find the solutions. They were supposed to be in the safe deposit box with the jewels, but weren’t there when Eg’s jewel was fetched.

I think I remember that someone approached Palencar about possible clues in the images and he responded that he was still under contract with Preiss’ company so he couldn’t say anything. Since then, I believe BP’s assets have been liquidated and his company dissolved. Technically, Palencar wouldn’t be under contract any more. Has anyone tried to contact him since?  I know that he doesn’t know the location of the casques but he may be able to identify some of the buildings and clues in the images.