So here’s something that’s occurred to me over the last few days.
If memory serves, BP has confirmed that there’s a casque in Canada and one in St. Louis.
Given that images 11 and 8 are the only ones we don’t have a definitive location for, and that all the other images point definitively to known locations (none of which are in Canada or St. Louis), wouldn’t that mean that images 11 and 8 could only refer to one of those two places?
If so, wouldn’t that rule out Boston as a casque location?

IMHO Image 9 is the only candidate for either of those locations, and the dogleg rules strongly in favour of Montreal, leaving the “casque in St Louis” as a cryptic hint for New Orleans; eg Louis Armstrong Park.
I’m not entirely happy with that, because if we can’t take the statement literally there’s no reason to take Canada literally either. But there’s better evidence for Boston than there is for either Montreal or St Louis. I think most Q4Ters would take Boston as incontrovertible.

jsp

So here’s something that’s occurred to me over the last few days.
If memory serves, BP has confirmed that there’s a casque in Canada and one in St. Louis.
Given that images 11 and 8 are the only ones we don’t have a definitive location for, and that all the other images point definitively to known locations (none of which are in Canada or St. Louis), wouldn’t that mean that images 11 and 8 could only refer to one of those two places?
If so, wouldn’t that rule out Boston as a casque location?

This was my thinking too for a long time but the evidence for Boston is compelling. I havn’t seen any evidence to support a  St. Louis casque. So either Preiss was mistaken or we are. To me, there are just too many coincidences to rule out Boston.

rookhunter

This was my thinking too for a long time but the evidence for Boston is compelling. I havn’t seen any evidence to support a  St. Louis casque. So either Preiss was mistaken or we are. To me, there are just too many coincidences to rule out Boston.

I’ve actually spent some time looking in St. Louis (Square) in Montreal… it’s a very interesting spot. You can also play with the “numbers” in the flower (I9) and come pretty close to a skyline of the European row of houses surrounding the Square.
I tend to agree with WR that the casque confirmed “in St. Louis” is more likely a play on words, like BP did with his verses. Additionally, it could be right outside St. Louis Cathedral in New Orleans.

He uploaded on Wiki. Here’s the link:
http://thesecret.pbworks.com/w/file/fet … asque1.pdf
Yay 1000 posts!
Going for 10,000!
Today… today… today… I consider myself… myself… myself… the luckiest one on the face of the earth… earth… earth…

What’re you referring to as stairs? This seems really incomplete at best. Also, what’s the Italian connection?

My goal has always been the SF casque, and I’m getting close. But to understand the SF painting, I have been looking at the Boston and NY paintings. I have never posted a theory, but after some research on Boston, I am actually going to post a Boston casque location theory. If you’re interested, you can download it here:
http://stevemargolis.com/…/uploads/2019/05/Boston-casque.pdf
It’s just a 5-page PDF, mostly pictures, but it’s a solid theory.

SteveMarg

My goal has always been the SF casque, and I’m getting close. But to understand the SF painting, I have been looking at the Boston and NY paintings. I have never posted a theory, but after some research on Boston, I am actually going to post a Boston casque location theory. If you’re interested, you can download it here:
http://stevemargolis.com/
…/uploads/2019/05/Boston-casque.pdf
It’s just a 5-page PDF, mostly pictures, but it’s a solid theory.

BAD LINK 404

Ah yes… I forgot about most of those mentions. Thanks for pointing them out. Your War Memorial year and street numbers interest me. Good to see that it is plausible for some zip numbers to appear in the boston image.

Image 4 has always reminded me of railway buffers, and the casque was very near a train line. (Wasn’t that the “rumble” of the verse…?) I don’t believe the 1881 plaque in Rue Drummond and its association with the Canadian Pacific Railway and George Stephen is a coincidence. I also suspect the 1929 across the top of the New Orleans clock is referencing the Municipal Auditorium in Louis Armstrong Park. We need more solves to support any of this though, and I suppose nothing will ever prove what BP was thinking. (All the same, if someone’s holding a casque, you gotta listen to them…
)

I wanted to take a healthy break from this hunt today but I had a rush of ideas and couldn’t resist piecing this image together with something that looks confirming when used with verse 3.
There is an area under an overpass just south of the bridge and west of what was the church of scientology on Beacon St.
Feel at home = “have a roof over your head” = underneath the overpass in a grass and tree setting facing a watery canal.
The upper right side of the oculus in this image has a small boxed area and an arcing line peeling off to the upper-right.  This line corresponds (matching north as up perspective) with an offramp onto Storrow Drive and the box would correspond to the intersection of W. Charlesgate and Beacon St.  The “green tower” is most recognizable in the face of the building or this large sign post in the direction of E. Charlesgate and Beacon St.
Under the overpass down a set of stairs next to the watery canal I saw several elements that looked familiar:  the shape above the green tower on the building looks like the woman’s hair outline above her forehead, the 3 globes are in similar perspective to the three large watery globes, the triangular shape on the woman’s wrist cuff, the flat square on the bottom left of the bird stoop, and the smaller cylinder sections connecting the globe the axis stand look like the connections between the top of the columns and the underside of the “roof” overpass.
I slapped this together quickly, hope it makes sense.

bolddigger

Hi everyone,
Has anyone in Boston found a good contact person, number or process for obtaining a permit to dig? I tried the online permit portal for the Department of Recreation and Conservation and they don’t have an option that fits. I’ve also tried calling the DRC office and so far the person directory assistance transferred us to hasn’t answered their phone and their voice mail box is full.
I’d be glad to get a COI, etc. and I’ve already visited the proposed dig spot. Just need the permit to take the next step.
Thanks in advance for any help. I know this is the most frustrating part of the process for most of us and appreciate the info.

The process isn’t as bad as people like complain about. What matters the most is to determine which agency pulls the strings for the area you are looking to dig. Calling DCR for an area that is governed by DPW is a waste of time. And vice versa.
Call the proper department religiously until you get a human on the phone. Mondays and Fridays or any day after a playoff game (we have a lot of those here in title town…) is probably a wasted effort.
Don’t be all secretive and overconfident. You won’t be the first or last person to call with absolute knowledge of the casque’s location. Give them actual evidence like an image match or a new exciting clue and give them the details at the location. Your implied brilliance will not impress them, nor will it help your cause. If they want an altered rendition of the wiki solution, they have access to google as well.
The best advice that I can give you is to be patient, polite, open, honest and if you have the ability to solve a 37 year old puzzle, you should be able to figure which department governs the area you are trying to search.
Best of Luck.

Hi everyone,
Has anyone in Boston found a good contact person, number or process for obtaining a permit to dig? I tried the online permit portal for the Department of Recreation and Conservation and they don’t have an option that fits. I’ve also tried calling the DRC office and so far the person directory assistance transferred us to hasn’t answered their phone and their voice mail box is full.
I’d be glad to get a COI, etc. and I’ve already visited the proposed dig spot. Just need the permit to take the next step.
Thanks in advance for any help. I know this is the most frustrating part of the process for most of us and appreciate the info.

Ignore this part of my previous post: “Remember that steps doesn’t necessarily mean stairs… it could just mean, walk five steps. “
I’ve long held a theory that the “take five steps” line might actually mean walk up five stairs/steps and confused myself
The shape of the Kelleher Rose garden is an EXACT match with the shape of the circle behind the lady, her dress and the “columns” hanging next to it, and that planter is right in the middle of it. Two visual markers –
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.3417484 … a=!3m1!1e3

Here is a picture of the bird. He is in liberty park in salt lake city

Wow, there are a lot of ideas on numbers! This number search reminds me of looking for shapes in clouds; everybody sees something different. No wonder this is a tough location to move forward. I will stick with Salt Lake City for my cloud formation
, for now, and see if I can dig up some matches.
Turtle
, although I don’t expect a perfect match, that bird is close to a dead ringer for the perched bird. Nice find!

I am really impressed with Fox’s “Litany Of The Jewels” post on Tweleve, and I wholeheartedly agree that this section of the story is meant to be used as a clue/confirmer to the location of the jewels. So many of them seem to fit perfectly (the Hellas/Greek connection in Cleveland, Milwaukee having a deep German heritage, etc).
That being said, this picture is supposed to be tied in with an Italian heritage, and Boston is one of the five cities with the highest number of Italian-Americans (along with Miami, Chicago, Philadelphia, and New York City).
I really feel this one is in Boston. Salt Lake City never felt right to me.
Just my two cents.

So the latitude and longitude of Boston is 42 & 72–we have the 42…is there some sort of confirmation for the 72 in the image?

The arrows point to highlighted #s.  71 and 91.  They really stand out if you invert the colors.
Boston is 42 22′ N and 71 2’W according to
http://www.bcca.org/misc/qiblih/latlong … SACHUSETTS
The 71 fits, but I don’t know about the 91.  I wonder if there is a store near Copely Square that has an address of 91.  I think that has been covered already.  As in some of the other images, you can switch these #s to make anything.  17 and 19?

Its in the smoke.
The top number is not ‘112’ becuase of the
bottom line of smoke that is at right angles to the two
verticle lines.  The ‘4’ is a L| style.

I think it says 42 and 22.  Just like the above coordinates  42 22″N.  Where is 71 91″W?

Actually, this is what I see: (and no, it’s not a valid zip code)

boogieman

I think it says 42 and 22.  Just like the above coordinates  42 22″N.  Where is 71 91″W?

I was just about to post the same thing. I have always seen it as 42 2, at least when I look at the picture in the book. I hadn’t noticed the other 2 in there before, but I see it now.
As for inverting the colors to see the numbers at the top of the page, why not count the first “1” in there, too?  Then it would read 17191. As Boogieman suggested, this could be an address.
Since we’re all looking for the matching coordinate (and we know how we can make anything fit if we try hard enough), we could see 72 in the sash hanging behind her right arm.  I’ll try attaching the pic.
If we are looking for 71 2′ , then we could re-think the wrist band on her left hand. As Shecrab pointed out, the numbers 7 and 1 were usually drawn in straight lines. The “4” that we think we see has the top corner of it cut off in the picture. Maybe it’s drawn that way because it’s a 7 and 1 overlapping, not a 4. Then the 2 beneath would make sense as 71 2′. It’s  a stretch, I know.
I’m happy to see new ideas and old ones revisited. This board has been so quiet lately.

Xieish

I dont know how familiar anyone is with four21’s Boston theory – if you’re aware of some of the other matches going on?
There is a string of Polaroids from the Storrow Memorial Compass all the way to the Hatch Shell. The shell is of course depicted in the bottom right of the image (the striped globe stand).
This is the latest in an unbroken line of matches in that park. I believe by “bench area” you mean the 30 benches surrounding the compass? There are tons of those benches on both sides of the Esplanade, they are not unique to 421’s spot, nor are they secluded by the compass. They are unique to the park though.
There are exactly 5 bridges on your left as you walk between the Compass and the Hatch Shell, walking in the direction of the BPL, and the direction Thicydides name faces on the side of the BPL as well. If you keep walking to the next bridge you reach the Longfellow…
Edit: to be a downer the entire hatch shell is currently torn up for lawn restoration :/

I am not being defensive of a theory here, only trying to clarify…
The bench spot next to the compass IS unqiue, this is the ONLY place in the park where the benches originally existed (the rest were added, and added mostly over the last 15 years). This is also the ONLY place where there is a group of benches, outside of a 2 or 3 in line. This is also the ONLY place where there is a group of exactly 30 benches in clean rows and columns.
Aside from that, by definition, if there is a line of confirmers in one direction, the same line of confirmers runs in the opposite direction. Which direction you want to take is up to you.

How many existed in 1981/1982 though? If the answer is “more than those 30” then we need to start ruling them out. There are also benches on the other side of the river, etc. Which while not a theory I have
strong
feelings about, if you walk
from
the Compass to the Hatch, you do then come upon the Longfellow, and there’s a clear Longfellow reference in the verse.
This is personal analysis: The fact that most of the other benches are isolated is in fact a good thing, and it’s possible that Preiss showed us 30 of them before leading us to a solo one. Especially if “feel at home” means not only take a seat, but harken back to the beginning of your quest. A lot of them would be way easier to dig at, I’ve looked at most of the benches (just casually), and some of them are super secluded.
I think the best thing to do is try to find any other ‘matches’ that can be found, particularly anything good for “All the letters…” from the Hatch to the Longfellow bridge (which is just a continuous straight line).

wk

Boston University
“All the letters Are here to see”

I found this before we even considered the esplanade as a site. It is another confirmer that you are in the correct place like the “look north ” in Roanoke.

Yeah, pretty close.  See my proposal on the V3 thread.  I have it starting at the BPL in Copley Square and moving north to the Charles River.
Pine

best of luck Pinetree.  Is the Charles River Esplanade anywhere near Copley Square?  well…i guess it is since isnt that where the BPL is?  I’m still stuck with Copley Sq.

An observation….I like the Park Plaza map that Shecrab posted today under verse 3. The “A” shapes by the triangular park reminded me of the As in the woman’s cuffs.

sorry whiterabbit, i’m not even through reading this whole thread but i’m still convinced it is in boston,
k, u boston guys this is my newest idea, tho i did have this “spot” long time ago, but rereading everything (still on p. 24), and i was looking at the
black falcon avenue
stuff, when i thought hmm, he’s sitting on the “T”, so i looked for the terminal (
black falcon terminal)
and it’s on 66 Summer Street.  and since the black falcon is opposite of the “jewel and “fairy”” in the image, if you go across from 66 summer street  you come right back to “
Boston Common
s” approximately right around the
“Soldier’s and Sailor’s monument
“…if you look at this monument in google earth……….l
ook at the circle around the statue.
……….sure looks like it to me!
Bclews are u still around?
i figure around the “navy”  or maybe “history”
“Bronze statues that formerly stood on the monument’s corners representing peace, history, the army and the navy have been placed in storage to prevent further deterioration and vandalism.”
also, if i’m remembering correctly, longfellow is on this monument also
the “feel at home” line could be pointing to the lady on top of the monument representing “
AMERICA
“
another thought that came to me as i was reading, since we thought the first lines of the verses related to roads……….the “I
f Thucydides is North of Xexonpho
n”  line might just mean
Historic roa
d (since they were historians………so start at the “
Freedom Tr
ail” going TOWARD
Horace Mann
(in front of the State House)
boogieman?  what do you think? look at the MONUMENT thru google earth!
if you walk “
FIVE
”  blocks east you are at boston commons

i know i said i would try to be more organized this time but………….
i’ve always thought this picture was more Norse looking than italian…………….and we have the leif ericson statue at commonwealth mall………..and i know you guys are gonna kill me but………..just looking him up
it said this:
“Lief Ericson, first European discoverer of Newfoundland, sculpted by Anne Whitney. 1887. Commissioned by Eben Norton Horsford, t
he inventor of baking powde
r, this statue was originally sited at the Massachusetts Avenue end of this block, but was moved to Charlesgate in 1917″
then in the book p. 74:   (the only Norse fair folk)
Household Unfamiliars: spotter’s tips………….in the fridge…in the rest of the house.
http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=lief+ericson+boston
http://www.flickr.com/photos/verdammelt … otostream/
i can’t get a close up from google earth…..
don’t you guys wish u could still “smite” me

[posted emptied because phpBB won’t let me delete it]

Trapezoid that was an amazing post. I really love how you put pictures in there to show exactly where you were talking about

Here is the “hidden map” I found in Image 11. It is looking into Boston Victory Gardens from the North to the South. The bottom of Erin’s dress has 3 squares covered in vines. The top two squares under the large backward “S” are the Boston Victory Gardens and the bottom square represents JBO, John Boyle O’Reilly statue and Boylston Street Bridge.
The four yellow arrows coming from the “blank” leaves show the entrances to the VG. I believe the casque is buried in Compost Area 2. That is the only leaf on this layout that has a vine running thru it. And keep in mind, Bingo pointed out before that the “letters” have nothing to do with the paths of the Gardens today. Those weren’t added until the late 80s to early 90s. All the letters are here to see refers to the Massachusetts Historical society (masshist.org)
which is across the street from the John Boyle O’Reilly statue at the corner of Boylston and Fenway.
Face the water
– Muddy River
Your back to the stairs
– Fenway Park stairs in the Stadium
Feel at home
– Victory Gardens, these rented gardens are used by people who don’t have gardens at home due to being in an apartment or properties without much land to build a garden. Makes you “Feel at home” when you’re in your garden.
All the letters
– Massachusetts Historical Society, historical letters and documents
Are here to see
– Not only can you see the MHS building from Compost Area 2 but this can also be a clever play on words. My thought….”to see”, as in 2C….2nd Compost Area.
I know this area would be easy to dig or probe but I wonder if some of the gardeners may have dug deep enough when turning over compost, or burying waste, to have inadvertently dug up a treasure they were unaware of? Thoughts? Bingo, Strike13 have you guys searched in and around 2C?

the gardens are also passed down through the family, as an inheritance. i do not think its there.

Anybody in Boston interested in digging a hole?

erexere

Didnt Preiss say he had to sneak over a fence once to bury a box?

he did and that would be the perfect description of St. Augustine and the grounds of the FOY

Glossiphoniidae

Anybody in Boston interested in digging a hole?

… Still lookin’ for a digger.

I just don’t believe the Copley Square theory anymore. The only reason it was considered in the first place was the presence of T and X on the BPL facade, but Thucydides is NOT north of Xenophon there, which rules out that particular instance of T and X in my mind. The lack of other area confirmers, the lack of diggable space, and the wide-open public aspect of the Square make it highly unlikely, IMHO.
Surely we can find other instances of Thucydides and Xenophon. I mean, heck – their names were also chiseled on stone
within feet
of the Cleveland casque, remember? Those guys got around.
Question: What are two Greek dudes doing in the Italian verse, anyway? Weird.

There is a round stone-looking fountain in Prado/Paul Revere Mall.
If we could find a photo looking at a close-up of the rim, it might
have markings to look like image 11 stone-ring.
There is also a “Moon Street” in the North End district…like the moon in image 11.
Looking for the nearby  “5 steps and water” of verse 3.
AP

I saw that fountain while in Boston. The inscription names George Robert White.

Forest,
I take it you had a close look at the fountain and did not see
any markings that would make you think of the stone-ring…pity…
Still, what about the fairy/girl statue similarity in the Peace Garden of St Leonard’s Church?
AP

Erm…..
I think you’ve forgotten these pictures. Bclews, a person who posted a lot here previously, took a lot of photos of the area in Boston. And you can see confirmers for the scrollwork (two different ones) and the stairs, and the water, and a lot of things. These are worth looking at before going off on other tangents–and they still confirm Copley Square for me, IMHO.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bclews/
Particularly—look at page two, top middle photo, and the scrollwork over the BPL window. The fountain depicted is too young to have been BP’s fountain or “water”, but the photos are priceless for anyone searching around here.

Shecrab,
Copley Square is an “obvious” choice of location.
Until someone can find a spot and dig the casque out,
I am still just searching for the places that inspired JJP
to add so many details in his painting.  If those details
lead us to another area of Boston, then I will look
around there, too.
It is not a “tangent”.  It is another idea.
Personally, I cannot see BP pulling out his shovel in
Copley Square…It is a very public place.  It seems that
his previous casque location choices are more off-the-beaten-path.
Sometimes I feel like a “truffle-hunting” pig…with my nose to
the ground…sniffing out the treasure.
AP

I don’t mean to insult anyone’s efforts–searching is an ongoing process, and will necessarily include other ideas. However, it seems that so much of this thread has been rehashed from efforts that have already been put forth. We have the ideas–what we don’t have are the diggers. It’s my opinion that instead of looking for more confirmation we should be sending someone over there to actually raise some sod.
I think we have plenty of confirmation that the casque is in Copley Square somewhere. Yet no one has even probed there. (have they?) Why look elsewhere until all the possibilities have been completely exhausted at Copley? That’s the tangent I’m talking about–that the best location we’ve confirmed so far is simply ignored when it comes time to actually dig.
We have looked in other areas of Boston–the North end in particular.
And
Harvard.
And
MIT. And nothing MORE has been uncovered than what we’ve gotten from Copley. In Copley we have the architecture of Trinity Church, the stairs, the water, the details of the woman’s dress–(the A-A and the patterns on the stole) the Subway stop (the “T” that the bird perches on) the rounded window details, the Greeks–even “all the letters” (in the Library.) So what else do we need to find? The rest of the painting simply says “Boston” and these details pinpoint it more to Copley than anywhere else.
I don’t mind new ideas, but we haven’t
had
any new ideas. We’re only rehashing
old
ideas again. That’s why I posted the link to bclews’ pictures–we have already found the scrollwork, the patterns, etc.
If I lived nearer, I’d be up there in a heartbeat with a long probe and a shovel before the weather froze it over.
BTW: Bryant Park in Chicago was right downtown at the intersection of two very busy streets. BP not only dug there, the finders did also. I don’t think we can necessarily count on any of his locations being out of the way, or off the beaten path.

In chicago, While the park is right there in the middle of town,
The location of the casque , was in a very out of the way corner of the park,
the road is right next to it but raised above. and the railroad tracks to the other side are below ground level.
very secluded and out of sight of casual park goers.
The cleveland site was hidden behind a wall, also very secluded and  out of sight…

Okay, while we wait for others to dig, I will keep
looking….quietly…not drawing attention from Copley….
not taking away any would-be diggers from the
most obvious location….You won’t even know I am
in Boston.
AP

shecrab

I think we have plenty of confirmation that the casque is in Copley Square somewhere. Yet no one has even probed there. (have they?) Why look elsewhere until all the possibilities have been completely exhausted at Copley? That’s the tangent I’m talking about–that the best location we’ve confirmed so far is simply ignored when it comes time to actually dig.

Until recently Copley Square was covered mostly in pavement, concrete, etc. except for a featureless grassy lawn on the library side. When I was there a few weeks ago, much of the square was under construction, with bulldozers and stretches of turned earth. If the casque was buried in the Square in the early 1980s, you can bet it has been pulverized by now.

forest_blight

Until recently Copley Square was covered mostly in pavement, concrete, etc. except for a featureless grassy lawn on the library side. When I was there a few weeks ago, much of the square was under construction, with bulldozers and stretches of turned earth. If the casque was buried in the Square in the early 1980s, you can bet it has been pulverized by now.

Forest,
I am afraid this is the most probable scenario.
That is one reason I won’t give up on Boston
until the North End is searched…especially in
the “isolated corners”…Because Copley Sq. has
been the subject of numerous dig-ups and re-do’s in the
last 26 years.
AP

Unknown

Unknown:
If the casque was buried in the Square in the early 1980s, you can bet it has been pulverized by now.

Unknown

Unknown:
That is one reason I won’t give up on Boston
until the North End is searched….

Hmmm…Boston becomes Houston. (sigh) Why do we even bother?
Because the casque might have
migrated
to the North End because of the construction in Copley…..
Okaaaay….

Shecrab,
You have such a sense of humor….
The high-traffic, very public profile of Copley
actually makes it less likely a location…But
because of the presence of Thucydides
and Xenophon, it “seems” obvious…
Can you say…”red herring”?
AP

I’m still here… have just been lurking while my summer spun out of control….
Have camera, will travel.
Now that my busy summer is behind me (thank goodness) I have ample free time to take photos on weekends etc… I work in Central Square now, but don’t have a problem jetting around the city on image hunting trips.
It seems bclews has gotten a lot done, but if there is anything else that needs pictures taken of it, post and I will jump on it. I’m going over old posts now, so will do some thinking on it all.
In the meantime, holler if you need anything.
amymisha

That is a nice little find AP.  Yes, I’m sure someone will reply that there are domes like that everywhere…but with all of the smaller things being found {dome being last one} around the same area of Beantown..I am thinking it is hard for this P to be anything but Boston.

Image 11 lady has an interestingly shaped cuff on her sleeve.
Does anyone else think it looks like the dome shape that you can
see from Copley Square in front of the Boston Library?
(next to the Old South church)

Nice find! I actually like that one.

ap nice i had noticed, but couldnt find it, and looked at that
pic like 10 xs, and still didnt see it

Quoted from:
http://www.fundinguniverse.com/company- … c-history/
“The first Jillian’s was opened in Boston, Massachusetts, by Stephen Foster. Foster, a 1978 graduate of Boston University Law School, had been working in New York as a corporate lawyer when he noticed people roller skating to pop music in Central Park. Inspired to create a club where people could do this indoors, he quit his job and sought help from his father, a Newton, Massachusetts judge. The elder Foster mortgaged his home to provide funds for the venture, which would be located in Boston on the top floor of an old brick stable building. In August 1979, after installing 10,000 square feet of maple flooring, the skating club was opened. Called Spinoff, it did well for a few years until the roller disco craze faded; the venture folded in 1987. In the meantime Foster had founded another new business, an oil brokerage firm called United Fuels International.”
I skated at Spinoff a few times, and in 1988, Spinoff reopened as Jillian’s, with pool tables installed on the skating floor, which was already level and solid, a big plus for billiards. I played pool and snooker there for a while (they had Boston’s only public snooker table for a long time).
Trends change and it’s now redecorated and renamed Lucky Strike, with some bowling lanes added to the billiards and arcade games.

By mirroring the silversmithed area you can see a large S on top of large L in cursive writing.
The leaf at the tip of the “S” looks kinda like a swan head.
Swan Lake?
I colorized the rest of the contiguous lines.
Note the directional arrow on top of the red line.

Choice

By mirroring the silversmithed area you can see a large S on top of large L in cursive writing.
The leaf at the tip of the “S” looks kinda like a swan head.
Swan Lake?
I colorized the rest of the contiguous lines.
Note the directional arrow on top of the red line.

huh?

scottrocks7

Washington DC sounds very likely. I think one of the Smithsonian buildings looks similer to the box image.

The Castle at the Smithsonian bears a
very slight
resemblance, as do all castles, to the box castle. That said, I have not seen any ONE castle that nails it, so maybe there isn’t one. A castle would be something that isn’t easy to change or disguise, and probably wouldn’t disappear even in 30 years.
The more I think about it, the more I think it isn’t
supposed
to nail the box image–but only
suggest
that there is a castle nearby. And that leaves us open for a lot more interpretation.

2fast4u2c,
i think Preiss told someone there wasn’t one in Pa.

Top of image 11 is similar to top of the alcove Channing’s Statue is at:
http://g.tinyurl.com/yxzl2233
http://g.tinyurl.com/yxrdozzd

BINGO

Who says the 5 steps are instructions from the starting point?
I personally feel they are more likely to be instructions near the dig site. What can’t they actually be 5 steps or 5 stairs? Seems like a more logical scenario to me.
Here is an example from a past theory that I got sucked into.
I was standing in the Prado in front of Revere’s statue. There were granite stairs behind me, a water fountain in front of me and a giant statue of Paul pointing almost behind himself.
I thought of “take five steps in the area of his direction”. Paul was pointing (giving us direction). The tree planter in line with his hand was 5 steps away.
I’m not saying that is the solution, I’m just describing a general interpretation of what I think is far more logical explanation. Again, I’m not advocating the Prado is the location, but experiencing that moment made me rethink how the puzzle should be viewed. Once you have a similar realization, the BPL and the myriad of other wiki biased opinions become less attractive.

Are the steps you are talking about the ones next to the Old North Church? I’ve arrived at the same spot, ironically from starting at the BPL, though I think in a different planter…

Cristov9000

Are the steps you are talking about the ones next to the Old North Church? I’ve arrived at the same spot, ironically from starting at the BPL, though I think in a different planter…

No, in the Prado

.
No, in the Prado
Sorry, “Paul Revere Mall” to you non locals. There is no “prado” on googlemaps

Flower beds are excluded in the book. However raised planters maybe fair game.
https://tinyurl.com/yy3n6ddm

Choice

Flower beds are excluded in the book. However raised planters maybe fair game.
https://tinyurl.com/yy3n6ddm

How did we move from the Prado to the ONC courtyard? They are different entities you know.

Cristov mentioned steps at ONC. But if we’re looking for random 5 steps this is a nice one:
https://tinyurl.com/y5n85rjq

strike13

How did we move from the Prado to the ONC courtyard? They are different entities you know.

ONC is across the street and there is a particular planter that is mostly dirt where you can have you back to the stairs, facing water, the statue of paul revere on horseback is is sight and the planter is lit by gas lamp. I can’t confirm what it looked like in the 80’s though.

Sorry for being dense, but could you clarify where you see the tree in the cloak.  I have been wondering for awhile about these image-verse links (columns; fence & fixture), but I haven’t been sure about the link to verse 8 for this image.
Frishkie

I shared this before, but I have renewed interest given the discovery that the double S, section sign symbol, or § is also called a “hurricane”. Unfortunately, I don’t really know when such a nickname for the symbol came into fashion. Maybe someone could help out. *cough* Maltedfalcon?
I like the way the woman’s red hair is being lifted as if by a force of wind. I also like the way the line “feel at home” might support the popular Oz reference, “there’s no place like home…there’s no place like home.” Character name Dorothy Gale, meaning strong wind, and the story where she’s transported away by a tornado is mildly compelling. Here’s the Denslow art from an early book, I think has a similarity with the woman standing in front of the large circle,
So the twist of theme here could be, § or hurricane/double S of Somerset gate, combined with the tornado/Dorothy Gale/Oz and the cyclone fencing along Charlesgate.

“those that pass the coliseum”–
“Those” meaning the streets–the streets that pass the coliseum;
“Coliseum” meaning the Park Square Coliseum (no longer there);
So “those” would be Arlington St., Boylston St., Charles St., and Beacon St.
These are the boundaries of
Boston Public Gardens
.

strike13

Current situation…
https://imgur.com/UnLepMM

Next step, ask constuction guys if they found any weird plexiglass box…

wk

I like that planter. good find.

Just kicking some stuff around…
It’s a possibility. The closest so far I think, though still not as close as I’d like. But unfortunately Preiss and Palencar were basically a bit cr@p at puzzle books, so most of the time you really can’t tell what’s a clue and what isn’t. (Someone had to say it.)
Revisiting the rose garden then, if you made your way there, I guess the closest steps are at the war memorial.
If you looked towards the water and the Victory Gardens from there, you’d be looking at the Agassiz bridge. (
Agassiz
was a Geologist who hung out at Boston’s
Saturday Club
with the likes of Holmes and Longfellow.)
Here’s the rose garden by the memorial (circled bottom), 2C (circled top), and bridge in the middle.
On the bridge…
I think that temple ‘peace’ bell is somewhere around the rose/memorial area, though I’m not sure exactly where.

I checked out Fisher College today and couldn’t find how old the athletics is, so I called them up. Turns out, only 14 years.
How about this… the falcon is often called a duck hawk. This is important because it helps us identify the “mallard” in the bird’s claw (turn image 90 degrees counterclockwise). Mr. and Mrs. Mallard flew all over Boston trying to find a place to have ducklings, from the Commons to the Longfellow Bridge, and finally settled on the island next to Hatch Shell. It won the ’42 Caldecott. It was written by McCloskey (i.e., close key). Maybe the falcon is just a city confirmer?

Everything you said seems plausible,
except your third premise.
the two S’s look nothing at all like $ signs.
not even somewhat. I don’t think that is even close
plus are you sure those gates with that symbol was in place in 1980/81?

I admit I don’t know if the gate was there in 81/82.
I don’t think they look like $$ either, because there’s the contrast of gold SS on vertical black bars “||”. Conceptually they are the $$ by merging the two. So my premise isn’t that they LOOK like $$, it’s an actuality that an “S” composed with a vertical line “|” is actually what makes the symbol “$”.
I’m also drawing from the Litany of the Jewels. “Peridot of Old Italy: antique, and olivine, and rich.” RICH = $$, seems like a very nice assumption.
AFAIK, the existence of any of these points of reference in 1981 is unverified. Maybe someone can help with verification, it would be preferable before jumping in there with a shovel.
Was the black cyclone fencing there for Byron to perceive as a metal wall?
Was the SS gate there?
Was the light tower there? (Not the newer Green one, but the older one as depicted in my 2007 Google street view image)

Actually, I never would have found Walpole either, except that I was going through the back posts on the thread, and saw that the quote was TO Horace Mann, not ABOUT Horace Mann–and thought I ought to find out who said it inc case it was important. That’s how the Walpole thing got started.
1.) saw quote, saw it was from a letter (thought hey–another connection)
2.) saw author
3.) researched author
4.) found Walpole Mass–saw it was NORTH of Boston (thought hey–another connection)
5.) found Walpole lived in castle (thought hey–another connection)
6.) Saw castle was similiar–but not nearly exact–to box castle (thought hey–another connection)
That’s how it worked. Seems perfectly logical to me. I dont’ think this is tenuous, I think it’s just a series more items that confirm the location. That’s all I ever said, in fact…just more confirmation through a lot of word play.  Anyone who began researching Walpole, no matter how they did it, (i.e., before the internet, like Preiss would have) would find out about Strawberry Hill since he was famous for it. I think if I had said only that Strawberry HILL = Beacon HILL, therefore it’s Boston, then THAT would have been tenuous.
Heck, the entire premise of this solution was made without the image at all until recently–now that’s tenuous!

What do you think about this as a possible match?

Here’s another.

Some of the buildings in the area like the one I posted are northen italian architecture,k could that be the italy connection? I posted a few more things on tweleve.org about image 11 verse 3.

I recognize the location of the photos.
Good luck putting the pieces together.
I never visited, but would have trouble thinking its on the
grounds proper, so it may be across the street at some
vanatge point to see the references.
Helpful hutning tip:  Look for the Greek/Latin Alphabet
to fulfill:  ‘All the letters”
Gods’ speed.

This sits in front of the BPL and reminds of the blue orbsin image 11

Thank you for the tip Trohn, I plan on visiting there Saturday, hopefully the snow will have melted by then.

forest_blight

Why are you considering a castle that is in the wrong hemisphere?

FB: please read my posts under Image 3, or whereever they are!! I said that this castle belonged to Horace
Walpole
. WALPOLE is the author of the quote about Thucydides at Boston/Xenophon at New York—and that wasn’t brought out in the original ideas that ORIGINALLY fixed the location at Boston!! That’s the connection–not the actual location of the castle! The connection is WALPOLE. The fact that he
lived in a castle
(and that it SLIGHTLY resembled the one on the box!) is just a confirmation that it’s the right
IDEA
. No more than that! I’m not considering it as a location.  I see that there are these double plays on words throughout the entire book!
Just to vent:
You know, it sort of irritates me a bit that when I joined this forum, you all said “read the back posts!” so I did! Every last one of them. And you guys never do!
LOL…

Trohn

I recognize the location of the photos.
Good luck putting the pieces together.
I never visited, but would have trouble thinking its on the
grounds proper, so it may be across the street at some
vanatge point to see the references.
Helpful hutning tip:  Look for the Greek/Latin Alphabet
to fulfill:  ‘All the letters”
Gods’ speed.

Not to belabor a point here, but is there a complete collection of
Horace Walpole’s letters
in the Boston Public Library?

shecrab

Not to belabor a point here, but is there a complete collection of
Horace Walpole’s letters
in the Boston Public Library?
Very good idea shecrab
I’m going to look into it as well as some Revere family letters. I do know that down the street a bit at the Ma. Historical Society they have Revere letters but I’m not sure about Walpole…..but as for the BPL I’m not sure about the collections they may have.

Yeah, maybe the library, but definitely not Walpole. The Walpole collection is at Yale University. They have everything there. I just went through the entire BPL website, and they have extensive collections, lots and lots of letters, but nothing that would point to our verse (IMHO.)
Here’s a tidbit:
The
Boston News-Letter
was the first newspaper in the country–and is the first continuously published newspaper in the country. It was forst published by the Postmaster, John Campbell.
http://www.earlyamerica.com/review/2005_winter_spring/john_campbell.htm
Maybe these are the “letters?”

Wow, I never knew we had the first newspaper here. To bad it doesn’t say where the office was.

don’t forget the 71  41  built into the arch above the female’s head.
wilhouse

The “112” in the image…..I think this is a reversed 211……the tower at trinity church is 211 ft high.

Unknown

Unknown:
Just to vent: You know, it sort of irritates me a bit that when I joined this forum, you all said “read the back posts!” so I did! Every last one of them. And you guys never do! LOL…

I understand how you made the Walpole connection, and it’s cool that he lived in a castle. It’s just that I see the connection as more tenuous than you do (I think). All the other identifiable places we’ve spotted in these paintings have been in the vicinity (at least in the same city) as the casque.
For this theory to be true, it strikes me that BP would have to have planned on one of two thought sequences occurring to the solver:
1. There’s a castle in P11.
Hey, wait, Horace Walpole lived in a castle!
What was that Walpole quote I heard once…
Oh yeah: Thucydides, Xenophon, Boston…
Bingo! It’s in Boston.
2. Thucydides, Xenophon…
Hey, didn’t I hear a quote about that once?
Oh yeah, Horace Walpole wrote that, about Boston!
And Horace Walpole lived in a castle!
Bingo! It’s in Boston.
I understand that the second sequence is a little more likely than the first, but it still seems pretty far-fetched to me. I’m not denying a possible link to Walpole, but the idea that the castle in P11 refers to Strawberry Hill seems pretty far-fetched to me. But what do I know, I haven’t dug one of these bad boys up!

Cool. If anyone in Boston wants to earn something extra checking a spot nearby, let me know. I definately want someone who’s willing to be on site for the GPR work needed to first verify the spot for accuracy. I’ll pay for the GPR and throw in an 18 year single malt for good measure.

http://tinypic.com/r/21mulxf/9
http://tinypic.com/r/2q3q1oj/9
I had my digger use survey flags which are essentially 2 foot needles to poke into the ground in and around the entire lot behind the pump building. We chose to dig this specific spot in the 2C area because of these verses “your back to the stairs” and “face the water” and many image references from the picture. We poked these into our hole after we dug reaching around 4 feet in depth. We also inserted our survey flags sideways into the hole to check the surrounding 2 foot radius around our hole. We considered the grey boxes in the image to be an direct reference (like the columns from image 4) to the grey electrical boxes in the very same lot we dug. We are still feel confident the casque is in the area, happy hunting.

Trohn

Boogie-
Here is another thing for you to loose sleep over…
“Near those who pass the coliseum”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harvard_Stadium
(maybe pass is a play on words – football, law school)

I don’t have my book yet, just looking into this hunt, trying to read everything first, but since i hadn’t seen this mentioned until now,, but on the right of the castle turret looks like a football helmet to me

boogieman

I cant see it but probably is something there….

Maybe this will help illustrate better what I think I see inside the bird.  It appears much clearer when the colors are inverted.
http://image60.webshots.com/660/9/26/7/ … nCS_fs.jpg
I haven’t found a match yet for it, but did run across this lawn sculpture and thought it would be a good illustration for what I think we are looking for.

Well I looked all around and found nothing. The library was closed so I couldn’t go inside, the churches had masses going on so I couldn’t investigate inside of them very well either. You’d think it would have ocurred to me me on a sunday wasn’t the greatest idea. After Copley I walked through Commonwealth park down to the public garden and then through boston common. From there we went up berkely street down to kings chapel and then to granary burying ground and then back through everything a second time. I saw birds, orbs and arches everywhere but none seemed to be ours. I looked at the Edward Evrette Hale statue “man of letters” but nothing was around him to go with any other clues. I went to the start of the freedom trail and to see paul reveres grave, nothing there either. Orbs were everywhere on top of cement posts all around Copley and all around the public garden and boston common…..some of the orbs had birds on them. Trinity Church had these same birds on it too. I checked around the other sides of the library to see if T & X were on the other sides as well but they were not. On the sidewalk in front of T & X was a cement thing with a bird on it. From the sidewalk to the wall of the BPL where T & X are there are 5 steps. There are also 5 steps at Trinity church. It was a good day anyway….I haven’t went sight seeing around Boston in a long time. The highlight was on the way back through Boston Common we bought roasted nuts from a street vendor so my BF could feed them to the squirrels…they are everywhere and very friendly….my BF picked the only one with people problems to feed and got his hand mauled lol

2fast4u2c

…Does anyone else see in the shading an eagle or some other bird perched atop a building or statue?

I’ve also been studying the bird.  It seems strange to me that the bird’s wing has no feather details.  JJP is a talented painter and I would think he was capable of painting feathers, but he painted it to look smooth.  Kind of looks like a whale.
Any significance?  New England Aquarium?  There are bubbles and a viewing window in the image.  Hmmm…
Just a thought.

I just can’t seem to shake the idea that the castle on the box is too obvious and that if there is a building confirmer, it is hidden in the image better.  I have been looking this image over with a fine tooth comb, playing with outlines and shading and such to see if i can find anything.  I think I may have found something…take a look at this:
Does anyone else see in the shading an eagle or some other bird perched atop a building or statue?  I didn’t notice it until I inverted the colors in Paint.  There appears to me to be enough of an image that it can be used as a visual confirmer.  Can we match this up with something in Boston or Salt Lake City?

this is a pic of the bird in front of the BPL panels

and another one of those birds above and right of the panels

another one on trinity church
Even though it doesn’t look like our bird, I’m wondering why there are so many in the area

I cant see it but probably is something there….

And another one on the sidewalk on the other side of the library

The more I look at it the more the bird reminds me of the Maltese Falcon
http://www.answers.com/topic/falconanalysis-jpg

FWIW (nothing new)
Wildlife species that are doing well are adapting to their changing setting. Coyote, White-tailed Deer, Raccoon, and Wild Turkey are now found in suburbs of major cities and are increasing in population. Black Bear continue to thrive in many of the state forests of western Massachusetts, and moose have repopulated a portion of north-central Mass. Peregrine Falcon can now be found nesting on artificial platforms on many of the state’s tallest buildings in larges cities such as Boston, Worcester and Springfield.

Hey guys I hope you do not mind me asking but I am doing a research paper on The Secret and was wondering if you guys Know of any places to find some research I’m using this website as one but I need more.
thanks kasey

Kasey

Hey guys I hope you do not mind me asking but I am doing a research paper on The Secret and was wondering if you guys Know of any places to find some research I’m using this website as one but I need more.
thanks kasey

Kasey –
There’s the wiki
http://thesecret.pbworks.com/w/page/22148559/FrontPage
and a bunch of other forums, but the wiki + q4t IMO is pretty much the sum of collective available human knowledge in regards the secret. There’s also a podcast
http://12treasures.com/
a pretty good episode on the secret recently by Expedition Unknown tv show and an upcoming documentary by James Renner that might be good for research purposes.
Also this thread specifically used for discussion of image 11, please maybe create a new thread for questions like this
Welcome to the hunt!

Here is a spot for someone to research, if so inclined: Fort Revere.
Fort Revere is in Hull, Massachusetts, and once guarded the entrance to Boston Harbor. It is quite close to Boston, and bears an obvious connection to Paul Revere (whose midnight ride is reflected in V3). It would have been very easy to dig there at night. There is even a tower on the grounds that bears a superficial resemblance to the one on “Pandora’s” box in P11.
Worth pursuing?

cool looking place, definitely worth pursuing if the Revere idea gels better.
I like to check out the architecture of libraries that might be in the vicinity.  I think BP was into places with books…
This looks like an iconic kind of place, the Hull Public Library:

Except, wasn’t using the names to start at the BPL the only way you got to Charlesgate in the first place?

That’s the common belief.  I think that there’s enough information to get you to the Somerset first and then begin hashing out the particulars.

I think it’s important to contend with either possibility.  I see no reason to be so certain that any of our common beliefs are correct.  If you jump to the Landlord’s Tale first and obsess over it as I have, then you’ll be planting yourself right at that spot as soon as you see the big green light tower.

This is why I find the Boston theory very unconvincing… it just got out of hand like a runaway train… someone said that the names are on the BPL and there is a quote that includes the names (T+X) and Boston and then everything else has been dependent on one of those two facts or both of them together. I don’t think either of those make sense so everything flowing from those starting points doesn’t make sense to me either.
the revere quote makes sense but it doesn’t give any type of starting point… If I had to guess a starting point based on the revere quote it would be the north end…this is the “little italy” area… it is also where revere’s house is and where the old north church (one if by land, two if by sea) is but i can’t think of a single dig-able place in the north end. there is a city named Revere nearby…and a town called somerset and countless other references to those names too but jumping from “revere” to “somerset” is as easy as jumping from revere to longfellow…or dawes, lexington, concord… these names are all over the place in the boston area and boston is small so lots of these places are right next to each other.
For example: The somerset club is nearby on Beacon st… uses a similar symbol like the Hotel Somerset… also has a copley reference (he owned the land originally)…etc. The longfellow bridge is also right there basically and i think would make one of the better landmarks to choose (maybe the “revere” reference is actually a “longfellow” reference, etc.

and i obviously don’t have a better theory i’m just hoping that people will broaden their perspective here and realize that there is very little tying this puzzle to Boston or even this image and verse together at all.
there have only been a small handful of people to offer this argument in the past 100+ pages of comments and i think that they are generally the ones that are actually from Boston…. Boston is a remarkably small city and even though boston has changed a great deal, it is very good at preserving history (although sometimes reshaping it… as done with copley square)
still happy to do some digging once the time comes but I’m not really a believer in that location (boy will i feel foolish if i find the casque)

Good points.  Very good.  I chose to focus heavily on Thucydides and what major facts may apply to him.  Historian, naval leader, exiled, lived in Thrace, and then reading the Landlords Tale brings only a few references to similar facets, such as the Somerset or the threat of imprisonment.

Unknown

Unknown:
Listen, my children, and you shall hear
Of the midnight ride of Paul Revere,
On the eighteenth of April, in Seventy-five;
Hardly a man is now alive
Who remembers that famous day and year.

Unknown

Unknown:
Just as the moon rose over the bay,
Where swinging wide at her moorings lay
The Somerset, British man-of-war;

I’ve organized my thoughts to a degree by sorting things into some cultural relevance.
Peridot of old Italy:
Antique, and olivine, and rich.
I expect that Preiss used the basic birthstone list and then expanded on it.  I’d be interested in exactly what is said in the National Audubon Society Field Guide on Rocks and Minerals (1979).  Does anyone here possess a copy?  We know peridot is the gem quality form of olivine, which is chemically made up of Magnesium, Iron, and Silicate.  I read that lunar rocks and meteorites are often containing olivine, which might be a detail supportive of any kind of moon motif.
I’m curious about the use of the word old, antique, and rich.  Antiques are defined as old and collectible things.  Rich is defined as abundant or wealthy.  Does Boston make a good fit because it’s considerably old as a town?  Is Boston known for it’s antique shops or something?  The Italian link is something that may work, but I’ve been most eager to see a Celtic theme.  I read that the Roman’s referred to South Italy as Magna Graecia (Great Greece) because it was highly populated with Greeks.  Perhaps the word “great” is synonymous with “old” and so Old Italy = Great Greece.  It certainly plays well with the introductory line “If Thucydides is”, since he was an ancient Greek historian.  Do any other verses begin with a Greek specific line?  Verse 4 definately embodies the Hellenistic culture, but it’s first line simply says “Beneath two countries,” which serves a more specific purpose of defining the theme of BOUNDARIES, those rivers, walls, or imaginary lines that are what separate one country from another.  I think the Thucydides and Xenophon lines, the use of the word “coliseum”, “all the letters are here to see” as well as the visually prominent oculus and the falcon in image 11 serve to construct the gist of “looking, viewing, spectacle, observation”.  Those ancient Greek historians observed and wrote down events.  A coliseum is a very large place to gather and observe events.  I’d like to think that all the letters are here to see is a simple reference to an eye chart.  Oculi, meaning ‘eye’, were ancient architectural motifs designed for viewing or letting in the light of the sun, moon and stars.  The falcon is a bird which is often used to epitomize keen sight.  So, what to make of all these meandering facts?  I think it forms a simple basis to factor in certain themes.  This hints of an act of keen observation, which is why I’m really interested in the exact spot where you move from seeing to not seeing the CITGO sign.  You’ll notice that is almost precisely at a spot across from the Double SS entry gate to the Somerset.
In answer to you’re interest in my explanation on why pair this verse and image, I’m mostly convinced by the familiar words of the Landlord’s Tale,
Although I’m interested in the idea of starting at the BPL, I’m not convinced that’s a good enough reason to think it’s Boston.  I noticed Thucydides and Xenophon written on the outer walls of the Multnomah County Library in my hometown of Portland.  I think the more relevant reason for their mention is to bring focus on observing events relating to a time of war.  In terms of Paul Revere, that’s an easy thing to recognize, since the events of the Midnight Ride is precisely about the conflict between American and British colonies.  A pivotal moment in that story involves,

A few rambling thoughts….
I like your logic with the verse being Greco-Roman themed (although verse 4 kinda was too like you mentioned)…and I do find that the Paul Revere reference alone is enough to put Boston into question for the verse… but i still have trouble seeing how it relates to this image more so than some of the other images. There are greco-roman aspects of about half of the images maybe more… also many of the images have moons in them so I’d be cautious about looking too much into a moon theme in any one in particular. from what i’ve seen in this book, the author has a certain style (as puzzle creators/solvers tend to have…) he focuses a lot on castles and check board patterns and moons and other cryptic images… some of these i think are just style and not meant to be actual clues. I’m almost certain that the castle on the box is one of these style things… it’s not meant to represent an actual castle but more likely a play on words or just a reference to the word castle (the only one i can think of for boston would be castle island)
where did the quote about “Old, antique, rich” etc come from? is that from a part of the book i haven’t seen? Boston is an old city obviously but i’ve never heard it as known for it antiques… also, many east coast cities are pretty old. New York/New Amsterdam… Pretty sure that technically the oldest is probably St. Augustine, FL (which I know is already being looked at for another verse/image combo…), Jamestown, VA… Providence and Hartford and Salem…
I have been trying to figure out how the two verse/image combos that have been solved were paired up and can hardly find any information on that.
To me, it looks like a good way to start both of them would be by identifying the state using the image (both had a rough outline of the state) and then using coordinates to pinpoint a city and a few key identifiers from the city…(although after looking, I can’t find any state outlines in any other images really unless you count the shape of Wyoming or Colorado which are basically just squares/rectangles). then I guess just trying to figure out which verse makes any sense from that area…and then using the verse as the final guide to the dig site. I have real trouble finding connections between most of the verses/images but i think that it is because i don’t have the book and i’m missing something about how there is a theme to each hunt which somehow relates to the stone and a birth month, etc.
From the author’s point of view… I’m thinking that he already knew the cities that he was going to bury the treasures in and maybe had most of the images done before he even did the burying… then he would use the verse to be the real map to the location, and maybe add a few identifiers to the image when he could… some people noted that certain parts of images look like they were added after the fact (sometimes they seem to have a glow around them, etc) and sometimes the perspective is odd like something is in front of/behind something for unknown reasons (but maybe that is part of the puzzle.
If i had to name an italian city in this area I would definitely lean more towards Providence… or even NY… I think you’re right that Boston is more of an celtic/irish city but all of them have greco-roman architecture, etc. Our world has a big focus on greco-roman architecture/art. I will also say that I know a lot of red headed italian people which is something i didn’t really know was a thing until recently because most would associate red hair with irish/scottish. But i think that the author’s style shows a big focus on arches and columns, etc. so it is difficult to name any one image the “greco-roman” image… although I do agree that this verse has numerous greco-roman references.
by the way, it’s funny you mention the library in Portland because Portland was almost named “boston” as I’m sure you’re aware… I honestly think that there have got to be other locations where both of these names exist together but wouldn’t necessarily show up on an internet search… No one has been able to make any real sense out of the line from the verse and the names on the library (the whole “if T is North of X, take 5 steps in the area of his direction”) very little of that makes sense when you use the BPL as the clue… I’m not sure if anyone here is a student of logic, but if you say “If x, then y” (x = thucydides is north of xenophobe; y = take 5 steps in the area of his direction) and someone says “not x” it would not be logical to say “then do the opposite of y (and take 5 steps in the opposite direction)” that doesn’t make sense. The real logical result would just be “not y” (don’t take 5 steps in the area of his direction… aka… stand still)

Really the only way the Thucydides/Xenophone line makes sense to me is if (1) sometimes T is north of X and sometimes T isn’t north of X (meaning one of them moves); or, (2) There are more than one T so to clarify which T you’re looking for, it is located with X being the reference point.
I find it interesting that sometimes the author refers to names using the first letter (off the top of my head i think Mozart, Beethoven, and Roosevelt were all referred to as M, B, and R…) but here, he spells out the names, which makes me think that it isn’t really about the names but it is either about the letters T and X or those are meant to describe the shape of something maybe…. one image that pops into my head are road intersections but it could also be something smaller like planters or garden shapes or something, etc.

The Litany of the Jewels, see the thread of the same title, it’s a section of the book preceding the images and verses along with an interesting tale of the Fair Folks Migration and how they mingled with the Natives briefly and then disappeared with the coming of the White Man.  The LotJ is a 30 line verse that basically outlines each of the gem types and couples each with a culture.  I theorize that Preiss uses very particular word choices as a way to convey the tiniest hint as to where or how each Fair Folk hid their jewel.
I’m not absolutely sure on how Thucydides and Xenophon work here.  I’d like to think it means start at library and go five steps (blocks) down Boyleston to the Fens, but I don’t like saying steps are anything other than taking one human step.  I’m uncomfortable with a lot of switcheroo tactics.  Metaphor is a difficult thing to manage when it comes to the multitude of situations we might reconstruct.  If I were to adhere to just that area of Charlesgate and say the whole verse applies only to that area then I’d be tempted to say Thucydides and Xenophon ARE metaphors for lamp posts.  Pretend that the ancient Greek historians are like “eyes”, describing the events of the past.  Eyes can’t see without light, in fact that is the very nature in how eyes work, they use light to translate the visual information to the optic nerve; the most eye like thing in the area are those big white globes.  Thucydides was in exile first.  Xenophon in Athens was later exiled.  I’d like to think the lamp post inside the fenced in plot of dirt and shrubs is Thucydides and Xenophon is the lamp post seen most directly nearest to the south and outside the fence.  What happens AS you take five steps south, starting at the northmost lamp post.  How do the letters of the CITGO sign or the letters of the SS line up or change in the perspective?

maltedfalcon

also since that person and the church are English, I guess that equals italian somehow.

The Old North Church and its lanterns are still firmly planted in the heart of the North End in Boston. Paul Revere’s “home” is still firmly planted on North St/North Square in the North End as well.
The North End is where the majority of Italian immigrants settled and sold their goods and services. Many are still there to this day. Some people (except for locals) call this area “Little Italy”. Many tourists and history buffs walk a brick lined path through the city called the Freedom Trail. These and many other historical places are official stops on the path. Know anyone who might be a fan of a good walking path theory Matt?
I am simply trying to explore an idea that the LOTJ immigration assignments may have a connection to the ACTUAL BURIAL SITES. Roman influences in the Greek image has nothing to do with this discussion. The Greek casque being buried in the Greek Gardens is the focus. The Irish casque being buried in a city and park with strong Irish connections is less direct, but still on a similar path.
Everyone has their theories and few are universally accepted. I’m ok with that. I’m just interested in seeing if there is any meat on this bone.

gManTexas

Does anyone believe that there is a strong Asian connection for the SF puzzle, e.g. the casque is buried in Chinatown

I’ll answer your question with another question. Do you or anyone know where the SF casque is buried? There are hundreds of pages in this forum that list dozens of solves for dozens of locations.
You definitely can’t dismiss anything without knowing that one little important detail.
Chinatown offers the same evidence and results that the portals of the past has produced to date.
Missed the second part added to your comment. The Children’s zoo in Houston was fairly well searched and I do believe that the evidence pointed there. If I remember correctly, there were different continents represented in the hot search zone. I’m not positive that Asia (the Arab continent) was represented there, but if it was, it would be a pretty interesting place to search.
This doesn’t seem to be all that radical of a thought process. Kind of surprised by the close mindedness.

SF cask could very well be in St. Mary’s Square near Dragon’s Gate, hence her cradle position of her arms.
Merry Christmas everyone!

BINGO

I’ll answer your question with another question. Do you or anyone know where the SF casque is buried? There are hundreds of pages in this forum that list dozens of solves for dozens of locations.
You definitely can’t dismiss anything without knowing that one little important detail.
Chinatown offers the same evidence and results that the portals of the past has produced to date.
Missed the second part added to your comment. The Children’s zoo in Houston was fairly well searched and I do believe that the evidence pointed there. If I remember correctly, there were different continents represented in the hot search zone. I’m not positive that Asia (the Arab continent) was represented there, but if it was, it would be a pretty interesting place to search.
This doesn’t seem to be all that radical of a thought process. Kind of surprised by the close mindedness.

Not being close minded at all, actually the opposite, since if we pigeon-hole ourselves into assuming that the casque locations have to be in a location where the immigration theme matches then we are in fact limiting ourselves. I am not saying that you are incorrect at all BINGO, just that I have not seen a whole lot of evidence, both with the found casques and the other physical locations (parks, etc.) to fully support the theory.
BTW, as much as I love the Portals theory that I came up with, I have abandoned GGP altogether, along with Mother’s Rest in the Fens. The clues don’t really support it.
Asia was represented in the Children’s Zoo, although I am not a proponent of that area of Hermann Park. Even if it was there, it is a real stretch to say that matches an Araby immigration theme. This is why I believe the concept is more generalized. Just like Lake Park in Milwaukee is generically German, only because Germans settled in the area. Or Montreal, only because some early Dutch explorers visited.

Just drop it. You don’t buy it. It’s ok. At this point everyone is speculating on both sides of the discussion. The only thing that may help move the discussion forward or kill it completely would be a new casque. I’ll keep my fingers crossed, but I won’t hold my breathe.
Happy holidays.

BINGO

So you are saying that Cleveland being the Greek puzzle and the casque being located in the Greek cultural gardens is merely coincidence? I’ll grant you (pun for fun)) Chicago is less obvious, but the Irish ties are strong and difficult for me to ignore.
If Preiss and Palencar are known for stressing the importance of immigration, I find it difficult to simply dismiss it. You’ve been hunting much longer than I have on this, so I’ll just leave it as respectful disagreement.
Ever give any thought as to why the 18th day/12hour line in verse 3 is pointing us to Boston? If so, you probably already know that the person and the church connected to that line are located within the Italian district/community in Boston? Probably just another coincidence and should be ignored.

Well considering the image is basically purely roman imagery the greek connection is a bit of a surprise.
also since that person and the church are English, I guess that equals italian somehow.
But yes lots of immigration imagery and connections – nobody has any ideas at all that make it into something like a clue.

Hi Everybody,
My first post here. I just learned about this treasure hunt about 3 months ago and was following it on the PBWorks page. I was going back and forth about the 2C area with someone and decided to try digging in the depression that was between the two circles.
I didn’t find the treasure, but i did find a lot of trash. I was not the first to dig this spot. Someone dug here sometime between October 2002 and December 2014, and when they backfilled they filled in a ton of litter that must have been all over the ground at the time. There must have been 20 liquor and beer bottles, plasitc bags, rusted tin cans, etc. I found 2 AOL 8.0 free trial CDs which is how I got the date of October 2002. I dug a wide enough hole to know that I reached the extend of the trash fill. I dug a deep enough hole that I reached the Clay bottom. The clay was really hard stuff and very moist, there was no mixing of the top soil or trash in the clay so I don’t think anyone it dug up to bury something in it. Here are some photos of the dig. I got cut short by Boston and State Police, and state department of parks and recs. All 5 officers were really cool about the whole thing and were hoping I found something but asked me to stop digging and fill in the hole.
I still think this area could be the spot. Maybe someone found it already, maybe someone tried this hole and missed before me.
Photos:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/42ng47gpak61 … -WpUa?dl=0
JimmyJames

Having visited this spot… I like it. A lot. Glad you decided to dig on the water side!

I think maybe we should look at portals and tunnels.  The window in this image looks similar to the tubes my trains run through under the Hudson River.
http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?47404
Any tunnels in Boston like this?  Would have to be an entrance I imagine…

Such as these?
http://www.abandonedsubwaytunnels.com/subwaysite/parkst/parkst_thumbs.html

More like this.  Not a tunnel, but something like what I am looking for.
http://www.abandonedsubwaytunnels.com/o … /cm13.html

yes, I saw that one. Since it was a waste-water outlet I didn’t consider it.
If you go through some of the pics on that site, you’ll find a couple of windows that look similar, but I don’t think this is the way to go, really.
Sometimes a window is just a window. Round or otherwise.

jch16

Sorry if I missed the joke. I wasn’t trying to discredit your theory. All theories are viable until proven otherwise by having the actual casque in hand. So I’m sorry if my comment came across as trying to discredit you.

No problem – sarcasm and typing rarely go hand in hand for the inexperienced wordsmith like me… so really no worries. I wish everyone luck in this search .. I am eternally fascinated. Thanks.

I was pretty much under the impression defintley in boston
But so far the best translation I have ever seen is @ the mothers rest park

dosethree

I wanted to talk a little bit about the Columbus statue that Bingo brought up in the Methodology thread because I’m personally interested in the statue and want to hear others thought’s/ideas on what it could mean.
For me (I have visited this in person) The nose look very close and confirms it for me. The mouth is also close, especially the corners. And they both feature similar prominent cheek bones. The eyes and the eyebrows look reasonably close as well.
The whole “it doesn’t look like it in person” argument doesn’t really fly for me because Palencar made the paintings based off photos provided to him by Byron (and it doesn’t look any different to me in person anyways).
Also the rest of the facts about the statue fit pretty well for me – Columbus is Italian, and was specifically called out by name in the beginning of the book. The statue was a recently installed before 1981 and was a prominent feature in 1981. The location also makes sense – its not like it’s out in the middle of nowhere – it’s located right in the heart of Boston, in the Italian section to boot and close to the freedom trail + Paul revere house. It’s location in a waterfront park may also hold some significance as the painting seems martime-themed to me (maritime flags, sailor dress, etc…). None of these really mean anything (except maybe him being called out by name in the book), but it definitely is on theme with the puzzle.
The other thing that is crazy to me is, I think this is the only image match in all of Boston that personally for me is confirmed. To me there really aren’t that many contenders for legit image matches we have found so far – I tend to think that 2c isn’t a strong match and there isn’t enough surrounding evidenced/significance to the area for me.
That said, what does it mean to the hunt? Image matches are interesting and awesome when they aren’t debatable like this one. The buildings in Cleveland and Chicago weren’t close to the casque and I tend to think they were just city confirmers. We can all agree in image 12 it’s the Statue of liberty, but that hasn’t really helped with that search.
As far as where this statue might lead us if it is truly a match, I have definitely tried to match “His direction” to be the direction of Columbus’s statue (mostly because I don’t have any good matches at all for what ” T&X or His direction” means and a statue’s direction fits the best for me, the line is so ambiguous). But, unfortunately Columbus is is staring off to into the harbor/tip of long warf. I don’t think the statue has moved since 1981 but would love more pictures of the park from that time period if anyone has them.
edit: spelling

Fair enough. I completely disagree with your take on the statue and the 50 or so random people who I have shown image 11 to while standing in front of it also disagree. Unanimously. I honestly think that people who are exposed to the suggestion (specifically from the wiki) of a match, are the people who see it the most. It’s ok though, we don’t have to agree. I’m cool with that.
On the other hand, I am a huge fan of the North End and everything it has to offer this puzzle. There is a ton of circumstantial evidence that could lead to that area, but nothing rock solid to my knowledge that could pinpoint an actual dig site. I wish it was different, ask Strike13, I’m constantly wandering around that area begging for clues.
That waterfront park was completely overhauled at some point. The wooden arches didn’t exist, the statue was in a completely different location and everything was very different from what you see today. I believe the 1977 aerial photo on mapjunction.com shows the old configuration. The 1983 aerial photo that is still being updated should give us a much better idea of the park layout at the time of publication. That 1983 photo is slowly being added to and it gets better every time they update it. Recently found a small area on the esplanade that I never knew existed. Hopefully that aerial helps unlock more tidbits of lost information.
Call me simple, (like Choice says I am) but attempting to decode the verse without standing near some type of solid image match, is an excercise in chasing your tail. Again, my opinion. Others disagree and I’m good with that.

BINGO

If you ever come to visit Boston, look me up and ill take you to look at the Columbus Statue in person. It’s not even remotely close.

I wanted to talk a little bit about the Columbus statue that Bingo brought up in the Methodology thread because I’m personally interested in the statue and want to hear others thought’s/ideas on what it could mean.
For me (I have visited this in person) The nose look very close and confirms it for me. The mouth is also close, especially the corners. And they both feature similar prominent cheek bones. The eyes and the eyebrows look reasonably close as well.
The whole “it doesn’t look like it in person” argument doesn’t really fly for me because Palencar made the paintings based off photos provided to him by Byron (and it doesn’t look any different to me in person anyways).
Also the rest of the facts about the statue fit pretty well for me – Columbus is Italian, and was specifically called out by name in the beginning of the book. The statue was a recently installed before 1981 and was a prominent feature in 1981. The location also makes sense – its not like it’s out in the middle of nowhere – it’s located right in the heart of Boston, in the Italian section to boot and close to the freedom trail + Paul revere house. It’s location in a waterfront park may also hold some significance as the painting seems martime-themed to me (maritime flags, sailor dress, etc…). None of these really mean anything (except maybe him being called out by name in the book), but it definitely is on theme with the puzzle.
The other thing that is crazy to me is, I think this is the only image match in all of Boston that personally for me is confirmed. To me there really aren’t that many contenders for legit image matches we have found so far – I tend to think that 2c isn’t a strong match and there isn’t enough surrounding evidenced/significance to the area for me.
That said, what does it mean to the hunt? Image matches are interesting and awesome when they aren’t debatable like this one. The buildings in Cleveland and Chicago weren’t close to the casque and I tend to think they were just city confirmers. We can all agree in image 12 it’s the Statue of liberty, but that hasn’t really helped with that search.
As far as where this statue might lead us if it is truly a match, I have definitely tried to match “His direction” to be the direction of Columbus’s statue (mostly because I don’t have any good matches at all for what ” T&X or His direction” means and a statue’s direction fits the best for me, the line is so ambiguous). But, unfortunately Columbus is is staring off to into the harbor/tip of long warf. I don’t think the statue has moved since 1981 but would love more pictures of the park from that time period if anyone has them.
edit: spelling

dosethree

I wanted to talk a little bit about the Columbus statue that Bingo brought up in the Methodology thread because I’m personally interested in the statue and want to hear others thought’s/ideas on what it could mean.
For me (I have visited this in person) The noses look very close and confirms it for me. The mouth is also close, especially the corners. And they both feature similar prominent cheek bones. The eyes and the eyebrows look reasonably close as well.
The whole “it doesn’t look like it in person” argument doesn’t really fly for me because Palencar made the paintings based off photos provided to him by Byron (and it doesn’t look any different to me in person anyways).
Also the rest of the facts about the statue fit pretty well for me – Columbus is Italian, and was specifically called out by name in the beginning of the book. The statue was a recently installed before 1981 and was a prominent feature in 1981. The location also makes sense – its not like it’s out in the middle of nowhere – it’s located right in the heart of Boston, in the Italian section to boot and close to the freedom trail + Paul revere house. It’s location in a waterfront park may also hold some significance as the painting seems martime-themed to me (maritime flags, sailor dress, etc…). None of these really mean anything (except maybe him being called out by name in the book), but it definitely is on theme with the puzzle.
The other thing that is crazy to me is, I think this is the only image match in all of Boston that personally for me is confirmed. To me there really aren’t that many contenders for legit image matches we have found so far – I tend to think that 2c isn’t a strong match and there isn’t enough surrounding evidenced/significance to the area for me.
That said, what does it mean to the hunt? Image matches are interesting and awesome when they aren’t debatable like this one. The buildings in Cleveland and Chicago weren’t close to the casque and I tend to think they were just city confirmers. We can all agree in image 12 it’s the Statue of liberty, but that hasn’t really helped with that search.
As far as where this statue might lead us if it is truly a match, I have definitely tried to match “His direction” to be the direction of Columbus’s statue (mostly because I don’t have any good matches at all for what ” T&X or His direction” means and a statue’s direction fits the best for me, the line is so ambiguous). But, unfortunately Columbus is is stairing off to into the harbor/tip of long warf. I don’t think the statue has moved since 1981 but would love more pictures of the park from that time period if anyone has them.

I disagree with the Columbus statue as well. Was even trying to make him fit something yesterday…
https://imgur.com/a/mcPpfRy
However, I obviously love the North End/waterfront area for this. For Paul revere, for the italian connection, for the connection to the old north church, for many other reasons too. I am just having a problem with likening the woman in the image to Columbus, as a match.
That being said, I will look for some old pics of the park

The woman in Image 11 looks more like the statue than the statue looks like Columbus.

gManTexas

The woman in Image 11 looks more like the statue than the statue looks like Columbus.

and dolly

strike13

and dolly

LOL, I wish that was the connection that unravelled this puzzle.

strike13

… dolly

I like Donna Summer with big hair

In Truth be free
In logic, True is T.
“In T” always put me in mind of “Tin”, and the fairy flying out of the tin in the pic.
I just noticed that the sign near the spot where I think the casque is…
…has the symbol for Tin.

T for Truth sounds good.   ‘In T’ for ‘Sn’ (Stannous) doesnt work so well.  In for Indium works, but I dont see anything pertaining to that element.  Is this the T north of X?
‘Free’ in the chemestry sense generally comes about when discussing an electron or a radical.
It never occured to me to consider 2 C could be a pair of Carbons…going deeper in the layers there, better watch out…Maybe we are looking at an Ethyl radical where the removal of a Hydrogen from Ethane leaves us with a free electron to bond with.
Notice the other side of the little house has a big electric panel.  Maybe that spot next to the stair is our spot.  Id rather someone take five steps from there and see if it brings a familiar alighnment into perspective before recommending a dig next to an electric panel.

maltedfalcon

No, no one does. I’ll believe it when I see it.
The notion that all casques are within a “reasonable drive of each other” is pure salesmanship. There’s no way you can posittion 12 casques and have every city in the continental U.S. be within, say, 500 miles of at least one.

I guess that depends on what your definition of “reasonable” is.

Interestingly, though I can’t say it means anything, the distance from the start point (the compass on the Esplanade) to the site xieish is talking about and the distance from the start point to the BU castle that was recently pointed out is almost exactly the same distance: 4815 ft vs 4820 ft according to the best Google Earth trace I could make.
It’s close enough that a map and compass (the circle drawing kind of compass) in 1980 is totally plausible. I tried making sense out of that and anything else, sweeping the arc for other landmarks in Boston, but I couldn’t find anything. If someone could double check, e.g., the angle to the BPL and a few other sites against the circular opening’s markings in the image, maybe there’s something to it? It seemed like such a close hit that it couldn’t be coincidence if this all comes together.
Sure hope I can come along with a shovel to help! This is so exciting!

hey guys i just read that they used to have lamppost mailboxes in boston!! are there any still around? and if so…any in copley square?
!
that would have the letters lit by lamplight!

here’s one :
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl= … l%26sa%3DN

I still don’t see anything, but here’s the closeup.

look at the shape of boston common on this map:
http://www.thefreedomtrail.org/maps/pdf … ps-map.pdf
isn’t that the shape on her right wrist cuff?
it looks like from copley you’d go about 5 blocks to boston common… i have no idea if you’d be moving north
and is the arch of the information center the other shape in her cuff? the design around the arch.
http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/t/x/t … inning.JPG
this fairy is cultural right? ugh all of boston is cultural or historic.

shecrab

Do you mean here? ‘Cos if you do, then no, sorry.
Here is another interesting feature:
NAA or ANA?  (sheesh–this is beginning to resemble Dar….everyone
RUN
!
)
These were really hard to see in the original pics, but when I enlarged them, they were easier.

That panel below the ‘ANA’ one,
that is a representaton of the BPL courtyard (square surronded by another square with a dot (fountain)
in the middle)

I believe Copley Square was originally two triangles.  They closed the diagonal street to form a square.
I don’t know if it has anything to do with the ANA symbol, but it is an interesting coincidence.

bclews

I believe Copley Square was originally two triangles.  They closed the diagonal street to form a square.

That’s correct, from friendsofcopleysquare.com/history.html
“1966 The City proposed closing off Huntington to join the existing triangles into a “square.” The result was a sunken park, which would be less noisy and offer seclusion from busy street life.”
But since this change happened before BP wrote the book, I don’t know if he would have represented Copley Square that way.

do the bruins and celtics play at the same arena? don’t those orbs in the picture look like basketballs?

in this picture the bus stop looks like right in front of the church…..
http://www.panoramamagazine.com/panoram … y%20Front/
(i think that’s a bus stop)
maybe the “18th day, 12th hour” is just talking about “time”…LOL, it is becoming DAR, ck
isn’t there a clock by that church? or a sundial?

look! there’s some vent thing (fan) right there in that picture!! lol

slappybuns

do the bruins and celtics play at the same arena? don’t those orbs in the picture look like basketballs?

Yes…and yes they do.

Trapezoid

I’ve seen the red ones, can’t recall any blue ones still around anywhere. You can find blue police equivalents on GIS but they all have a small, caged lightbulb on top, no globes.
My first thought was the campus police call boxes colleges have. I know I’ve seen versions of them around Harvard. I’m not sure when colleges started using these, but maybe they used Gamewell-style streetlamps in the past.

I will add that the blue one here is muuuuch bigger of a sphere in circumference than any of those red ones. Totally different in size, not just a difference in color. And, as Bong just said, totally different in the way they are colored, the red vs. the blue.

Found this light at the Police Department in the center of town. I asked a Boston Police officer (a secret hunter and enthusiast) if he knew about this light. According to him it was one of many police emergency call boxes scattered throughout the city. I could not get any more information from the officer and he has now made it clear that he has no interest in sharing what he knows.
I grew up here and I have no memory of these boxes. I have spoken to other Boston locals and they have no memory of the lights/call boxes either. Myself and Strike13 have walked the city and scoured the internet for the last week looking for any information. No luck. Any locals have a recollection of these lights/boxes?
There are still plenty of similar Fire Department call boxes throughout the city with red Globes. I am assuming that the Police boxes were similar with a blue globe. Any insights are welcome.
Fire Department Call Box

BINGO

Found this light at the Police Department in the center of town. I asked a Boston Police officer (a secret hunter and enthusiast) if he knew about this light. According to him it was one of many police emergency call boxes scattered throughout the city. I could not get any more information from the officer and he has now made it clear that he has no interest in sharing what he knows.
I grew up here and I have no memory of these boxes. I have spoken to other Boston locals and they have no memory of the lights/call boxes either. Myself and Strike13 have walked the city and scoured the internet for the last week looking for any information. No luck. Any locals have a recollection of these lights/boxes?
There are still plenty of similar Fire Department call boxes throughout the city with red Globes. I am assuming that the Police boxes were similar with a blue globe. Any insights are welcome.
Fire Department Call Box

Nice find! Are there any marking or the mfg. name on the fixture?

I didn’t see anything on the front/sides. Ill give it another look tomorrow morning to see if I can find anything on the back. There has to be something.

I’ve seen the red ones, can’t recall any blue ones still around anywhere. You can find blue police equivalents on GIS but they all have a small, caged lightbulb on top, no globes.
My first thought was the campus police call boxes colleges have. I know I’ve seen versions of them around Harvard. I’m not sure when colleges started using these, but maybe they used Gamewell-style streetlamps in the past.

BINGO, if
this is the light
you’re talking about, I don’t think it’s from a call box. There are
similar globe streetlights
in the area, and the police department probably just painted theirs blue.

Trapezoid

BINGO, if
this is the light
you’re talking about, I don’t think it’s from a call box. There are
similar globe streetlights
in the area, and the police department probably just painted theirs blue.

That is the light and it’s definitely not a call box. The call box discussion came directly from the police officer that I spoke with. I’ve been trying to verify if they actually ever existed like he claimed. And if they did, where were/are they?
I know this guy very well and he is very trustworthy, so I don’t think he telling me a tale.
That Globe isn’t just painted blue, it has a crystal like pattern throughout the glass. I don’t believe the fire call box globes are just painted red either. I think the glass itself is red throughout. The clear and white Globe lights are all over the place in the city. I think this was obviously a style that the city used for decades. It’s very possible that the fire and potential police lights were mimicking this style.
This all could just be coincidence, but if those lights/call boxes really did exist, it would be a very good explanation of what the blue globes in the image might really be. I don’t have the answers, I’m just looking for help trying to find them. Good or bad.

strike13

I will add that the blue one here is muuuuch bigger of a sphere in circumference than any of those red ones. Totally different in size, not just a difference in color. And, as Bong just said, totally different in the way they are colored, the red vs. the blue.

Bingo, not Bong.
Although nada wrong w a bong…

BINGO

I didn’t see anything on the front/sides. Ill give it another look tomorrow morning to see if I can find anything on the back. There has to be something.

If this is the one I’m seeing on Street View, it does not appear to be a call box at all, just a blue globe that was often used at police stations to identify it as a P.D.
There is also some evidence that there were call boxes in the early 1900s that had blue lights and the fire boxes were red. Maybe the fire boxes outlived the police call boxes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Call_box

gManTexas

If this is the one I’m seeing on Street View, it does not appear to be a call box at all, just a blue globe that was often used at police stations to identify it as a P.D.
There is also some evidence that there were call boxes in the early 1900s that had blue lights and the fire boxes were red. Maybe the fire boxes outlived the police call boxes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Call_box

The fire call boxes in Boston are rather historic. I doubt the city would want to take them down. The firefighters would push back really hard against their removal too.

Unknown

Unknown:
what if…thucydides and xenophon just mean “greek”

I wondered about this too, but then I thought–why say two obscure greek names, instead of two easily recognizable ones?
Why not just say “Plato and Socrates?” or Feta Cheese and Ouzo? (LOL)…
I do however think they could mean TH and X, or Theta and Xi.

i thought that too, or even something with “ex”…….like exeter street

good picture of christopher columbus park:
http://abostonvignette.blogspot.com/200 … -park.html

large
compass
on harborwalk…18th day, 12th hour?
http://www.bostonharborwalk.com/dbuploads/long4.jpg

large compass on harborwalk…18th day, 12th hour?
http://www.bostonharborwalk.com/dbuploads/long4.jpg

playing with words…
boston’s green line
green tower of lights
“he
GREEN
Line is made up of 5 lines serving central Boston on N. America’s oldest subway. Four of the lines operate as traditional streetcar lines outside of the subway. The Riverside line operates on an old Steam railroad right-of-way converted in the 1950’s. This line is often called the first
LIGHT
rail line in the US before the phrase was even coined.
metal–silver
silver line

I sent a letter to my distant relative that has lived in Boston for about 55 years a few days ago. He should be getting it today. I included links to the Wikki and to this site along with a brief sumation of why all of you think this is Boston and why I think this is Toronto. I do not know what he will do with this but I hope it helps all of you.

what if…thucydides and xenophon just mean “greek”
he used m and b for men and beast…
what if the greek is the “boston athenaean”
http://www.storyofboston.com/articles/b … um_plaque/
http://www.newenglandtravelplanner.com/ … um2583.jpg
http://flickr.com/photos/get_it_while_y … 184558796/

scottrocks, please ask him to check out the boston public library courtyard and everything around copley square!
i sure hope he gets hooked and can help us out!

This blog has a couple of interesting pictures.
2.The standard view of the bridge as seen in numerous postcards BUT white paint on the wall under the trees.
4. A high resolution picture if you click on it of the granite stonework. Notice the cracks on the bottom stone. These are very similar to the cracks in the stone to the right of the gem in the image.
So having identified the location I think that what is needed is to look at the stones for imperfections that match something in the image.
http://pierrelouiss.blogspot.com/2010/0 … -fens.html

The white paint is grafitti, as this is a park you don’t want to be in after dark. The pictures are also from the north side of the bridge looking south. I think the site is on the other side of the bridge. I’ve also found what I believe is the crack and the stone pattern a while back, and you commented on it earlier. Do you not believe this to be the correct block/crack?

WhiteRabbit

Boston seems to have a lot of towers like this, but…go on then, where is it? (I was wondering about the same globe match for the lamppost…)
“With metal walls” still bugs me a bit. And much as I like MF’s quotation match for “In truth be free”, it doesn’t actually seem to help much. But if you want to jump on a plane and take a look at that wall, I won’t try and stop you…
Go already!

The building was a funeral home (JS Waterman & Son…
face the water
) from 1921 until recently @ 493 Commonwealth (thus, for erexere’s theory, as he is all over the Commonwealth slant). It’s the type of match that made me think the box may contain 4 separate pieces. Either way, it makes me more confident the image “confirmers” are confirming nothing more that the city and/or area, but do not directly
lead
on a path or to the site.
In 1981, this could be seen quite easily from both the funeral home and the HHR Bridge:
My theory on the last and/or second to last lines is that that they mean nothing more than “
Dig
!” Most of the verses seem to end to that effect (i.e., you already have been directed to the site and should stay there, or here the treasure sits.) For examples, “
Hush
,” “
Your goal
,” “
Years pass, rain falls
,” “
The treasure waits
,” “
To the place the casque is kept
,” “
Get permission to dig out
(i know you objections to including this one),” “
A whistle sounds
,” etc. They all seem to be a simple clue that you are where you should be.
I agree that MF’s Leftly quote doesn’t do much for my proposed site. I think it’s great, though, that we are quickly building a library of obscure quotes stamped into the verses. I think the board had been previously confused as to if BP really expected us to find them, let alone use them as clues (at least i was); but, the more we collect, the more we can evaluate if they are important to the solve or not.
“
With metal walls
” has bugged me too… If you take the “
five steps
” to the Turnpike overpass as I proposed, you could easily jump down to the
train
tracks, follow them to Ipswich and Charlesgate, and “
face the water
” with “
your back to the stairs
” there. I shied away from that idea as there was no “
feel at home
” or “
all the letters.
“

With me, tall walls (with metal walls)
How’s that for altered meaning?

Totally awesome.

and that star lines up too.  !!
Maybe you have to stand away from the wall to see the light from the lamp post. I was thinking that the 9 shape was what you would see on the other side of the wall. That is, a small block to the left of the large block with the post protruding behind.
Anyway, this is only meant as a helpful comment and in no way taking away your credit for an amazing discovery.
Now you need to find the stone with that small crater mark on it.

Glossiphoniidae

wow… this one is almost exact…

So where is that one?

wk

and that star lines up too.
Maybe you have to stand away from the wall to see the light from the lamp post.

Wk

Now you need to find the stone with that small crater mark on it.

This is an amazing idea because you surely need to back up to see the actual bulb.
I was thinking I showed it.

bigmattyh

So where is that one?

the address on an OLD postcard is 1 Raleigh St (Kenmore Square), and also gives the name of the owner. i can’t find it in streetview, and i know addresses have changed.

a couple of shots of MRplay area
the.. lite by lamplight…,could shine right on the dig spot,or could shine on
one of the stones
thurs i have more time to search,ill see if i can find,if a light at the stairs
and the wall was replaced or moved,taken out,during construction lights
tend to get moved by a few feet sometimes,and sometimes completely
removed,i know a horrible thought,after such a great find on the alpha
MRplay area
http://www.waymarking.com/gallery/defau … dd08&gid=2
http://encgreenteam.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/mr2.png

erexere

TJ, thanks for that info. Once I have a rep in Boston, I would plan to hire a GPR service.
Alternatively, I’m thinking of purchasing a GPR. Once I’m done with it, I can loan it out to searchers in other cities.
As for which GPR to buy, any suggestions?

Eric-that would be awesome. This is something I think that (if the data was interpreted correctly, and that we got lucky in a couple of locations with the soil) could really help in producing a casque.
Which to buy? I have no idea…I’d have to do some research, but I would check CL/eBay too, depending on your budget.
Funny, I thought starting a crowdfunding for something like a GPR would be fun…we just wouldn’t’ have a way to control who has it/how long/care of it…

WhiteRabbit

I still like the 2C a lot, with its proximity to “all the letters” of the Victory Gardens.
It seems people have dug around the central “nook” and behind the steps of the pump house. I guess a couple of other places I’d be interested in looking would be here:
The corner area appeals because it corresponds with facing the water, your back to stairs, lit by lamplight, and aligns with the flower in the image.
A spot beside the wall alongside the other lamp could also work with the “lit by lamplight” reference.
It would be nice to get some photos/video of this area showing the angles that can’t be accessed on Google; behind the pump house, and by the river beyond the 2C.

That left “x” in your last picture is solid IMO. That whole plot from the stairs to the lamp post would be fair game if I was digging it.
And digging trenches work well too, depending on what clues you are digging to. (e.g. if you are digging in front of something narrow, but don’t know how close/far to dig to that object)
“Lit by lamplight” does seem to imply that he hid them (or this one at least) at night. Or the casque is buried in the light (not shady area) of the lamp. Any photos of this spot at night?

tjgrey

“Lit by lamplight” does seem to imply that he hid them (or this one at least) at night. Or the casque is buried in the light (not shady area) of the lamp. Any photos of this spot at night?

Interesting point. It had occurred to me that the dazzle on the sphere in the above pic could indicate the throw of light on the area.

I’ve changed my thinking on this since finding it makes more sense to dig somewhere to the north if that box and globe.

People have often had this “which side of this thing do you dig” problem, which is one of the original reasons I liked the pump-house steps. Face the water, your back to the stairs, see the fence, job done. But the nature of the nook also defines a fairly definite spot.

I’d previously thought the globe lined up with the 2C like this…
But given the distinctive shape of this section…
I reckon I had it upside-down, so it should actually look like this.
For instance, that would put the gladiolus between the 2C and the pump-house.
I quite like the idea of standing “inside” the globe as a bit like standing inside the Mapparium, which has also been discussed as a possible match. I’m coming round to the “all the letters are here 2 C” in general, especially as BP also used a “2 C” idea in the Milwaukee puzzle with the grand staircase.
Re: twelfth hour, certainly a Revere reference, but also wondering whether there might be a clock aspect to this in finding the right point around the edge of the circle. Could the gladiolus be said to be at 12pm? Or maybe 8pm = August.
The bird pecking the bubble could also be a point-on-the-perimiter hint.
Perhaps the shape of the nook is hinted at in features like the woman’s nose and eyebrows.

Glossiphoniidae

It seems a whole lot has to be forced and/or unaccounted for. It leaves me with need for the heimlich.

I don’t think it’s all that bad. There’s stuff that’s forced and unaccounted for with MR too, like heading west instead of north from the starting point.
The main things I like about this are:
a)
Beacon St. I don’t think these puzzles only work in a mathematically precise way. Some aspects of them are more allusive. Eg:
The verse has a “tower of lights” and “lit by lamplight”.
Eighteenth day
Twelfth hour
Lit by lamplight
Revere is buried at the Granary Burying Ground at the end of Beacon St. It’s got to be an obvious connection to make for someone tackling this puzzle.
Near those
Who pass the coliseum
The Rome Marathon ends at the Coliseum. The Boston Marathon goes down Beacon St.
Longfellow and Copley lived on Beacon St.
The Charlesgate Hotel, Boston’s most haunted building, is on Beacon St. Erexere has been plugging this place for ages for its green tower and hair-matching qualities, and it’s a ringer for the box castle.
b)
The image match with the globe and the CC.
c)
Face the water
Your back to the stairs
At this location, you can find at least one precise spot from these instructions (eg beside that fence behind the steps). At the bridge, it could be anywhere, and to narrow it down you’re relying on counting arbitrary units using numbers pulled randomly out of the verse.
The most obvious “letters” aren’t right here, but as others have pointed out, the verses don’t work in strict order. “The sounds of rumble brush and music” takes a step back to provide an overview after the casque site has been identified.
At the end of the day, it’s got to be worth a go if the bridge doesn’t work out.  😉

For all we know, that dump truck will soon be the home of that casque.
Ignore the orange line with the two red dots on the image section, but see the orange line that intersects the purple line.  I’m thinking the globes are out of order in relative size but they are placed in the right spots so imagine they are as numbered from the perspective of standing next to the “green light tower”.  I think the intersection point between that line and the back to stairs next to lamp post spot facing the water is the right spot whether it’s five steps or not.

I agree… the interpretation is very tempting. I have to add though, after examining the exactness of the Cleveland and Chicago “visual confirmers” (the wall, columns, fence, buildings), I no longer believe the 2 C’s to be a match. I don’t know if I’d consider the Hotel a ringer, either.

Glossiphoniidae

I have to add though, after examining the exactness of the Cleveland and Chicago “visual confirmers” (the wall, columns, fence, buildings), I no longer believe the 2 C’s to be a match.

That’s absurd; it’s like the “Ponce isn’t on horseback” argument.
But I don’t care whether you believe it or not, as long as you don’t leave Boston without trying it…

Don’t forget the Citgo sign and you might want to consider the 461 Charlesgate address as a ringer for the box face.  It has the most precise match to three points, skinnier short shape to the left and gable to the lower right of main tower.  It’s there, just hard to see with trees in way and it only shows that way from a 20 degree angle which is only maximized at the 2C site, (surprise!).  The box itself looks like the gap roofed structure adjacent to the 2C’s.
The Charlesgate Hotel is now only to match the top of woman’s brow shape.  That one characteristic diminishes the other interpretations, so I think green Tower is something else.
All that really matters now is our confidence grows and our over confidence shrinks, then our shovels will find that sweet spot…
I’ve been training with the shovel lately.  Listening to the BeeGees and moving 3 tons of earth with a spade has been a real inspiration.  There will be casques!

erexere

All that really matters now is our confidence grows and our over confidence shrinks, then our shovels will find that sweet spot…

+1

WhiteRabbit

That’s absurd; it’s like the “Ponce isn’t on horseback” argument.
But I don’t care whether you believe it or not, as long as you don’t leave Boston without trying it…

To be fair… the Cleveland and Chicago sites were found next to thier respective exact visual confirmers. Ponce is not exact, and we really don’t expect the site to be next to him. Perhaps the more exact the confirmer, the closer to the site? The two C’s are in no way exact. Also, somebody I know believes the Ponce image to be Oregon.
On another note, Boston will never have irrigation problems again when I leave.