Thanks! Not sure if this angle has already been visited

I also like the connection to verse 10
an indies native is Alexander Hamilton.. (Federal Hall?) or I was thinking maybe a connection to Fort Hamilton? On the Brooklyn side of the Verazanno Bridge?
“Although the sign
Nearby
Speaks of Indies native”
Just throwing ideas out there

The Verrazano and fort hamilton have been dicussed at length about a year or so ago.  Good ideas not to be dismissed.  A few of us poured over Brooklyn and found a church similar to that shape in the image.  But it stopped there when we thought Battery park and v5 were the answers….  By all means KW, keep plugging away.  The board is always being watched and will look forward to any ideas.
Here’s something you can add to your train of thought:
In summer
you’ll often hear a whirring sound
Coney Island,  the MTA train yard next to fort hamilton.  Lots of whirring there.  Especially Coney in summer.

Here are the photos of Egbert and my recent expedition to Ellis Island and lower Manhattan.  More thoughts and observations to follow.
http://share-dell.shutterfly.com/action/share/welcome?i=EeCNWbVi3ZtGWF&open=1&sm=0&sl=0

guys, there is no way Preiss buried a cask on Ellis Island. I just refuse to believe it.
wilhouse

Things may have been “very” different back in 1982.

there is also brighton beach:
http://journalism.nyu.edu/pubzone/pavem … y-the-sea/
just something “russian” …haven’t looked there except long time ago when i was hooked on coney island.

The domes in the picture look something like the domes of the Haupt house in the New York Botanical Gardens. But not ENOUGH like them.
I spent a fruitless day searching through pics of the B. G. and came up empty. Besides, it’s a
garden
, which probably means it’s not there (according to the rules).
I think too much stock is being put into these domes. I have looked up every onion-domed church in NYC, and the surrounding area, and have come up with nothing matching. Much like the box castle in p. 11. And I’ve come to the conclusion that perhaps these images that appear in the pictures, like the castle and these domes, are NOT meant to match exactly. What says “Russian” more than a couple of onion domes? (Besides the hammer and sickle, that is?)  Not much. Everyone would associate them with Russia. So perhaps they are only meant to mean “Russia” and not a specific place, then?
And if so, then where is the most Russian thing in New York? Probably the Russian Tea Room on W. 57th. Nothing in the actual restaurant suggests anything in the picture, but perhaps the location is important.

I had a few new ideas lately that I’d like to share. I found the Little Red Lighthouse at the base of the GW Bridge, which had been mentioned here some years ago. It certainly fits the first two lines of V10. Then, if you follow Riverside Dr. south 3.0 miles (
http://goo.gl/maps/L7ZC9
), you will run into a segment of land that EXACTLY matches the fold coming down from the lady’s belt:
Then if you look immediately to the east, you will see two eagles that, from the side, look like this (matching all but the tongue from up close):
When viewing the eagles from the west side of the monument (which was massively run down in the 70’s/80’s –
http://www.grantstomb.org/tdr2.html
) looking east, you would be looking over the cracked ceramic/ceramic bench murals by Antoni Gaudí.
There are 22 steps leading from the west side of the tomb to the east side (18 on the west side, 4 on the east side), leading over to Sakura Park.
I realize this leaves a lot unexplained, but I thought it was quite interesting.

I had a few new ideas lately that I’d like to share. I found the Little Red Lighthouse at the base of the GW Bridge, which had been mentioned here some years ago. It certainly fits the first two lines of V10. Then, if you follow Riverside Dr. south 3.0 miles (
http://goo.gl/maps/L7ZC9
), you will run into a segment of land that EXACTLY matches the fold coming down from the lady’s belt:
Then if you look immediately to the east, you will see two eagles that, from the side, look like this (matching all but the tongue from up close):
When viewing the eagles from the west side of the monument (which was massively run down in the 70’s/80’s –
http://www.grantstomb.org/tdr2.html
) looking east, you would be looking over the cracked ceramic/ceramic bench murals by Antoni Gaudí.
There are 22 steps leading from the west side of the tomb to the east side (18 on the west side, 4 on the east side), leading over to Sakura
Park
.
I realize this leaves a lot unexplained, but I thought it was quite interesting.

could the shape of walt whitman
park
and cadman plaza
park
be the shape of the long loop in the belt…..
walt whitman’s newpaper was the “aurora”  goddess of the dawn, (the woman in the image)
and he wrote a primer……..about words, the spirit of words………..”wording the future”
and the brooklyn war memorial was dedicated on november 12…….and it was more than 22  feet lhigh…24 i think
with the heroic figures and it mentions “universal peace”
i’m not sure how many steps from the monument to walt whitman
park
hey at least i’m looking in brooklyn now

Thanks to Dan’s high res pics, I was able to look at this pic in more detail.  In the middle of the ocean appears to be the number 74 with an X below it — it is very faint, written in the white part of the ocean.  Am I just seeing things?  Anyone see anything else?  I would think that the ocean, which takes up half the picture, would hold a couple of clues.  If you delude yourself enough  😉 you can see a large letter “N’ written in white foam on the blue ocean.  Anyone else see that?
I can’t see any clue in the colored dots at the top of the picture.  I am a short drive from New York, so if anyone can tell me where to look, I’ll be happy to go there.

On the admittedly small chance this building could be a mosque in NYC, I looked in the book “New York Masjid” by Ed Grazda, a photography book containing pictures of NYC mosques. Only two in the book were possibilities, and neither of them look like our building. the Masjid Hazrat-i-Abu Bakr at 141-49 33rd Ave in Flushing has only two towers, and Masjid Alfalah at 42-12 National Street in Corona has only one.
Bummer.

The author of the text in “New York Masjid,” Jerrilynn Dodds (Ed Grazda was the photographer), assures me that the building is
not
a mosque. She surmises that it is “definitely a Russian (or Armenian or Greek) Orthodox church.” I hope that narrows it down a little for us.

around mccarren park you have a russian orthodox church and another church with  a clock tower (607 humboldt stree).
http://nycslav.blogspot.com/2008/09/wal … point.html
if it’s between these 2 churches, it seems it would be around mccarren park

Josh, while I appreciate your thoughts on Gray Peak, I see the spelling of grey as an important clue. Sure BP could have just spelled it with an “e” for the hell of it but I don’t think so.
Let me add something to the “Barrett Wave” solve.
From the middle of one branch
Of the v
The base of the statue on which Clarence Barret stands is made out of Pink Tennessee Marble. It has 3 branches forming a triangular base. Each backside of the base creates a “v” where the water fountain connects. From the Northeast “v”, 22 steps take you to the wave (backside of the bus shelter) and the casque.

Some what random question…Has every singe signature of JJP’s in the images been found?

Unknown

Unknown:
Some what random question…

Somewhat random answer. You can’t find what isn’t there. Although people have been trying for over 35 years. To their detriment, IMO.

Euhirudinea

Somewhat random answer. You can’t find what isn’t there. Although people have been trying for over 35 years. To their detriment, IMO.

So it is a fact that some images do not have his signature on them?

Unknown

Unknown:
So it is a fact that some images do not have his signature on them?

No, that’s my opinion. Everyone has access to the high-resolution Images, and they are welcome to form their own.

We know at least one painting was cropped for publication (the Roanoke suit of armor), and his sig was probably on the edge. No mystery, no clue.

catherwood

We know at least one painting was cropped for publication (the Roanoke suit of armor), and his sig was probably on the edge. No mystery, no clue.

ah.

Unknown

Unknown:
We know at least one painting was cropped for publication

We can only go by what was in the book. If the signatures were important to the puzzle, then they would have survived the editing process, or added back in before the book went to print. IMHO.

fox

It sure seems to scream NY to me too.  One thing that may concern me but I am not quite sure how much is this…..
forgive me, I dont have my book with me and may just have to get it so I can quote it….but…
somewhere in the story of the fair people (I know, most {even myself} tend to agree that it isnt needed)… it talks of the Folleti from Italy teaching or hanging out with the indians around NJ.  If that is the case, than the “pandora’s box” P would be NY.  I think that P ties in with Italy.
how bout this….if this makes no sense, scratch it all and wait until I re-read the section so it can be quoted…

Now now…  You’ll be all right Fox.  I’m sending a doctor right over!  lol

This is my rendition of what the sea foam might look like from above. Why does it remind me of sliced radicchio?
Part of it (the right side) might be a very inaccurate representation of New York Harbor. Sorry if that’s been suggested before.

It has NY all over it.  Just don’t know how.
BTW, nicely done!

thanks boogie…looks like I really needed that.
After reviewing my notes and book…feel free to disregard everything I said.  lol.  It wasnt the Folletti and it wasnt P11 but here is what I was trying to remember.
*pg. 13 (last paragraph) speaks of the Lowland Alven {lowland dwarves} of the Dutch going to a land they named Kaaterskill.
http://www.angelfire.com/ny4/waterfalls … alls2.html
*pg. 29 (last paragraph) also tells of the Lowland Dwarves {the Alven} observing their friends the Canarsie trading Manhattan Island for some trinkets…
“The Canarsie’s home was today’s present day Brooklyn.”
http://www.writerzbookworks.com/Factor.html 
http://www.answers.com/topic/new-york
present day brooklyn eh….right back to our Verrezano Bridge…

It sure seems to scream NY to me too.  One thing that may concern me but I am not quite sure how much is this…..
forgive me, I dont have my book with me and may just have to get it so I can quote it….but…
somewhere in the story of the fair people (I know, most {even myself} tend to agree that it isnt needed)… it talks of the Folleti from Italy teaching or hanging out with the indians around NJ.  If that is the case, than the “pandora’s box” P would be NY.  I think that P ties in with Italy.
how bout this….if this makes no sense, scratch it all and wait until I re-read the section so it can be quoted…

In my opinion, from a style standpoint the silhouette is more obviously Russian Orthodox…
Pine

Choice

In 1966 the island was turned over to the coast guard.
Coast guard was part of the dept of transportation.
So the question is: Was the coast guard as strict as the navy so to treat the island as a military base?

Well, yes, but I still assert it doesn’t matter: If it was property of a military base, Bantam’s lawyers wouldn’t have allowed it regardless of how lax security was

Has it ever been considered that the mosaics in this image are meant to evoke the unique tiles at many subway stations in New York? Perhaps if one could find a station that had patterns that matched the ones in the image you would know that you were near the casque. Or perhaps they are a little map of sorts. Start at a station with a certain kind of tiles and ride the subway passing stations with tiles like you see in the image. This is what I’m referring to with subway tiles.
I don’t think any station has the exact same pattern as another so finding a match would mean combing through every station.

If you rotate the image 180, the church image actually looks like there is hand and finger pointing to the end of a penninsula. The blue part being water.

Lol Rabbit.  But there is snow on the ground.

Hey, search function didn’t bring that post o my attn.  I wonder why?

erexere

Maybe the woman is to be seen as Aphrodite and the seabird is to be seen in reference to a winged creature.  I’m surprised this aspect of sea foam and origins in Greek myth haven’t been discussed yet.

WhiteRabbit

I think the book includes references to Classical mythology, and this pic put me in mind of
Venus/Aphrodite
, “born of the sea foam” (aphros).

boogieman

And just so you all know, the toll to get to Brooklyn has gone up to $16.  Send money!!!!

…yep, that was my first impression of this image (P35).
There’s a link to Liberty there.
“The entire statue is of copper, the metal of Venus.”
I’ll pay the darn toll already. Now go!

I figured it was possible to imagine what stuff looked like from above, but maybe that was a bridge too far.

i just had an idea…what if that rectangle is outlined red, and is the shape of our park?  like we see the park map in FOY image.  i was looking and wondering, why is that extra line down under the circular oval shape and thought of that……which would make it maybe central park, and that line under could maybe be the road that goes thru columbus circle….

i just had an idea…what if that rectangle is outlined red, and is the shape of our
park
?  like we see the
park
map in FOY image.  i was looking and wondering, why is that extra line down under the circular oval shape and thought of that……which would make it maybe
central
park
, and that line under could maybe be the road that goes thru columbus circle….

lol, boogie, i’m getting to ya!
i forgot a “subway”!  how could i forget that!
but guys, honestly, doesn’t this picture seem to say “God Bless America”
Irving Berlin wrote that, and it would stand for all Immigrants, the whole scheme of the whole book.
and he came through Ellis Island and he’s from Russia.
………..or maybe Woody Guthrie, who wrote, This land is My land.
herald square and greeley square (really two triangles)  cohan wrote about Herald square, and they make a bow tie, which also makes a V,
and the isle of B could be Broadway
and remember the New York Times was called the “gray lady”

and some guy owned that land (columbus circle..central park)…….guess what his name was…
john
somerin
dyck   ……in summer…….summer in  ;D
here’s more for my theory of the subway or railways……….the door motors make a “whirring” sound
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R160_%28Ne … way_car%29
“The old cars made an odd whirring noise as the electric motor powered the car. I also remember the putt-putt-putt sound made by the car’s air compressor for the air brakes. The very ol”
http://johnsantic.com/nyc_dorm/

and some guy owned that land (columbus circle..
central
park
)…….guess what his name was…
john
somerin
dyck   ……in summer…….summer in  ;D
here’s more for my theory of the subway or railways……….the door motors make a “whirring” sound
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R160_%28Ne … way_car%29
“The old cars made an odd whirring noise as the electric motor powered the car. I also remember the putt-putt-putt sound made by the car’s air compressor for the air brakes. The very ol”
http://johnsantic.com/nyc_dorm/

I see a B D.  Brooklyn dodgers?  We do have the Brooklyn-Battery tunnel tunnel slappy.

just wanted to say this, and not sure where it should go, but columbus circle is the distance  all points are measured from in new york city….and i remember the spirit of ’76 ( i know, i know, just thinking) mentions “maximum distance from monuments erected to her fame”.. i had been thinking canada, or the border, but….we know he saw the maine monument, because it’s in the book for “the pill grim”  i think
http://joemygod.blogspot.com/2007/07/mo … ument.html
hey, it’s driving me crazy, you don’t wanna know all the thoughts i have, i even contemplated one of the 7 dwarves as “rhapsodic”man……you know, the one called “happy”……..

Belt
Parkway running under the pedestrian bridge…
Nearby Fort Hamilton High School…
Image 11 clock and flower link…
The flagpole is just to the right of the bridge. I think the five blobs either side are benches with views towards Bedloe’s. I’m interested in the adjacent green strip, digging by a particular bench; eg number 5 (V) clockwise or some such.
(Here was the other visual confirmer from the
Verse 10 thread P36
…)
The verse fits. What more do you want? Go dig!

The artist, JJP, said that BP sent him photographs and he would paint the images according to those pics.  He has never been to the treasure sites.  Think BP sent a an overhead picture of this area in 1980?

boogieman

The artist, JJP, said that BP sent him photographs and he would paint the images according to those pics.  He has never been to the treasure sites.  Think BP sent a an overhead picture of this area in 1980?

Hmm, interesting…
Must be more than literally photographs though surely, unless we discount stuff like Sumter and Roanoke. Maps? Drawings?

Very good point WR.  But it would have had to have been something attainable from a library.  No google maps then.  Or maybe pics taken from a whirring sound, a helicopter.  But then we would need a helicopter too.  hmmm.  tell me why we are doing this again?

I did the red filter thing digitally (red layer, 50% opacity)–no dice. I cannot discern an image. But I do agree that it looks like colorblind tests. Maybe it’s simply a reference to colorblind tests, or the answer involves the name of the person who invented those tests?
My wife saw those and said it reminded her of the artwork in the lobby of Lincoln Center, but after taking a peek at the photos in the Met, we both now think it’s not a factor.

While looking at some stuff about Bryant Park I came across this….Our granite walls from V5?
The Croton Distributing Reservoir
In 1847, following the construction of one of the city’s most imposing edifices, the Croton Distributing Reservoir, on the present site of the New York Public Library, the city designated the former potter’s field to its west as a public park called Reservoir Square, a simple Victorian greensward. The reservoir itself, built in 1839-43, was a man-made lake four acres in area, surrounded by massive,
fifty-foot-high, twenty-five-foot-thick granite walls
designed in a vaguely Egyptian style. Along the tops of the walls were public promenades, offering breathtaking views. It was an integral part of the first supply of fresh water carried by aqueducts into the city from upstate New York. This water-supply system was one of the greatest engineering triumphs of nineteenth-century America. Iron pipes carried water forty-one miles to the receiving reservoir in what is now Central Park, thence to the distributing reservoir at this site. The aqueduct system, constructed at a cost of $11.5 million, was officially opened on July 4, 1842. The Croton Distributing Reservoir was pulled down in the 1890s.

This is the sort of pose I meant. This grotto is in St. Louis. Sorry I couldn’t get a bigger picture.

You guys are obviously pretty intelligent.  Your thought process is amazing.  But I’m from NY.
I can tell you that in 82′, the towers and the statue were the places to be.
The first few lines from V10 just nail this.  Look back to my post of the statue and the
P12 face that I moved from the other thread.  The direction the eyes in P12 are looking in that post,
away from the Narrows, is because I flipped the pic to match the statue, and if you stood in front of it today,
you would see they look away. The way it was painted, she’s looking right at the slender path and the arm the extends over it,
and I believe it was done delibrately.  P12 is not like P4 or P5.  There are only four things in 12 that are identifiable.
We have two.  Liberty and the tower.  The domes and the eagle still have to be figured out.
V10 will not get you to Bryant Park.

I appreciate everyones responses to my strange idea.
*FB & shecrab…  as I stated before, the pose is not exactly like the Angel but the pose…oh the pose.  flower in one hand, other hand outstretched…  Also, the comparison FB did is great, thanks.  Look at the empy hands, thumb outstretched, index finger raised slightly, middle and ring finger lowered and pinky fairly straight.
What I forgot to mention in my previous post was the robe.  I think the robe is our map somehow.  The folds in the robe look to be more than just folds in a robe…especially the triangular area on her right sleeve and the billowy part hanging from the belt.  I swear there are faces or something in there.  For the longest time I have seen a duck and a rabbit (?) in there.  The duck is looking up directly under the belt so you can see the underside of his beak and his outstretched neck.  Now, this rabbit thingy really bugs me.  There is obviously an eye mid way down on the right (her left) side of the main fold…below that on the rear fold is a v shaped nose looking thing.  Maybe not a rabbit but something definitely there.
*boogie…  dont worry, I havent given up on JPJ park just yet.  Just looking at differernt avenues just in case.  We need a backup if JPJ is wrong when I am down there.
I know V10 wont get us to Bryant Park.  (1) Bryant Park may be wrong  (2) V10 may be incorrect V (3) We are all so wrong and the casque is actually buried in Omaha NB…
*242…  very interesting about the granite walls…

If she had a belt on her…..sash or belt?  Belt Parkway…stretch maybe.  I see the duck.
Always reminded me of the AFLAC commercial.  Plus, if you opened the fold under the belt,
I think it would reveil a face.  Can almost see a beard and the nose.  Hamilton?   Hamilton Parkway…
I’d like to get a close-up of the book in her left hand.
When the snow goes away, I’ll make a few trips to JPJ Park and the Statue.
Nice pic here:
http://www.endex.com/gf/buildings/liberty/sol002510.jpg

just a date…..

I found some info on the sports logo for the Seattle Seahawks that points to the Haida Eagle as it’s influence.
http://www.greenglare.com/seahawks_logo_design.html
Morning Mist was a Haida Indian woman.  I have a good fit for many features of this image pointing to her which can’t be ruled out.
Captain Pickett mairried her.  Woman is wearing a white dress.  Wedding dresses are white.
Her name is Morning Mist.  Woman is floating with large water droplets.  Mist is defined as drops of water suspended in air.
Her hair color and skin tone are also indicative of the typical hair color found in Native Indian people.

For the longest time I was sure the ring window was an indicator of San Francisco.
because of this statue in Golden Gate
Park
‘s japanese tea garden.
http://www.lwn-photo.com/images/Snglimgs/JTG/Buddha.jpg
I have since given up that idea—-

I am new to the hunt.  I foud out about it after Egbert found the Cleveland casque as I live in the Cleveland area.  I found the pics and verses and have been pouring over them.  I think your comments about the face in this pic being the Statute of Liberty intriguing.  MY thought for this pic was Tennessee.  I think the outline for the wave is a close match to Tennessee.  Do any of you have any thoughts??
I also have the article from the Cleveland Plain Dealer from Egbert finding the casque.  It has an interesting sidebar detailing some of the cluse in the picture.  If any of you would like to see it let me know.  I am trying to use this solution to find the clues in the other pictures.

Choice

Point well taken Kang. I’ve never been to NYC except on layovers so I wouldn’t know the intricate routs. I’m just interpreting the image and direction it’s pointing.
Statue’s arms are the V and that branch of the V is pointing towards E.R.

You seem to be speaking in absolutes, yet nothing you are saying makes much sense to anyone. You are not interpreting the image or the verse as much as you are trying to project your own perspective without any substance.
I would like to go back to taking the image/verse apart piece by piece without someone bringing in an idea that has not even been researched by the one proposing it.
As we were saying before, we mostly agree about SOL and Bedloe, thus we are looking at South Brooklyn coast. We have established some signs with Hamilton’s name on them and I would like to believe most of us can agree, going this route, that the grey giant is most likely the Verrazzano bridge.
Any thoughts to further this?

No. Good luck!
[ADDED] BTW do you have any image matches to your location? There’s an image match to Roosevelt.
Secondly, if Bedloe was the B. then why did he abbreviate island? He could’ve just wrote island of B. The reason is he wanted to use alternative meaning to Isl.
Another abbreviation in the verse is Vols. I think these two need to be put together.
Isl Vol … Isl lov.

Hi NYC Native. Completely agree on Southwest Brooklyn location. I arrived at it slightly differently using “shadow of the gray giant” as the ‘border of Manhattan’ and ‘find arm that extends’ as picking one of the parkways as you leave Manhattan. Nonetheless, completely agree with the area you are looking in.
Now it’s time for some old fashion detective work. I hope others will jump into conversation here as well.
Narrowing the focus to areas (likely parks) in southwestern Brooklyn, there are not too many, as we have already listed. Can we make the rest of it fit? We need an Alexander Hamilton sign, may be Charles Dickens reference?, and then, most importantly, a mysterious “v” at the treasure site that has lots cars nearby and bicycles/ferries/helicopters.
I agree with Kang here. I think the first half of the poem has brought you to this general area in Southwest Brooklyn. Need more of a boots on the ground approach now to complete it.

davinci4

Hi NYC Native. Completely agree on Southwest Brooklyn location. I arrived at it slightly differently using “shadow of the gray giant” as the ‘border of Manhattan’ and ‘find arm that extends’ as picking one of the parkways as you leave Manhattan. Nonetheless, completely agree with the area you are looking in.
Now it’s time for some old fashion detective work. I hope others will jump into conversation here as well.
Narrowing the focus to areas (likely parks) in southwestern Brooklyn, there are not too many, as we have already listed. Can we make the rest of it fit? We need an Alexander Hamilton sign, may be Charles Dickens reference?, and then, most importantly, a mysterious “v” at the treasure site that has lots cars nearby and bicycles/ferries/helicopters.
I agree with Kang here. I think the first half of the poem has brought you to this general area in Southwest Brooklyn. Need more of a boots on the ground approach now to complete it.

Hola Davinci,
We have all of those in one area with a few parks, except for the Dickens reference. Yet we are not sure that Dickens has anything to do with any of this at all. I understand the logic based on the Jap. clues, but we are not sure of that at all, so I think we should put that to the side.
We have plenty of boots on the grounds in the area and we have done a lot of research in the area. I think the hardest part to complete is the hard word in 3 vols. and a conclusion to the rhapsodic man.
I have heard the theory that Manhattan is the grey giant, thus Brooklyn being in its shadow, and I am not opposed to it. Finding the arm over the slender path still seems to fit the bridge. Some even say that there is an image confirmation in the image of the bridge as well. So I am proposing the Verrazzano as a big piece of this puzzle. There is also plenty of evidence and connections, that many of you are already aware of, that confirms this.

NYCNative

Hola Davinci,
We have all of those in one area with a few parks, except for the Dickens reference. Yet we are not sure that Dickens has anything to do with any of this at all. I understand the logic based on the Jap. clues, but we are not sure of that at all, so I think we should put that to the side.
We have plenty of boots on the grounds in the area and we have done a lot of research in the area. I think the hardest part to complete is the hard word in 3 vols. and a conclusion to the rhapsodic man.
I have heard the theory that Manhattan is the grey giant, thus Brooklyn being in its shadow, and I am not opposed to it. Finding the arm over the slender path still seems to fit the bridge. Some even say that there is an image confirmation in the image of the bridge as well. So I am proposing the Verrazzano as a big piece of this puzzle. There is also plenty of evidence and connections, that many of you are already aware of, that confirms this. Thoughts?

I don’t know how you can say that the face in Image 12 does not look like the statue of liberty.
edited to include image for reference

I read on the board that NY searchers have found ‘nothing of interest’ at proposed cask locations. As we try to narrow choices, general question for the group, what are people hoping to see/find at the NY location? We have already discussed the likelihood there are probably no image confirmers at the location. Are we looking for a “v” “22 steps”? What are people envisioning at this location that would seem to fit?

davinci4

I read on the board that NY searchers have found ‘nothing of interest’ at proposed cask locations. As we try to narrow choices, general question for the group, what are people hoping to see/find at the NY location? We have already discussed
the likelihood there are probably no image confirmers at the location
. Are we looking for a “v” “22 steps”? What are people envisioning at this location that would seem to fit?

While I believe this is true of Charleston, the New York verse gives instructions and there is bound to be some Image confirmers in Image 12. There are a few that I can think of. One of the issues that people struggle with is how blatant the image matches were for Chicago and Cleveland, and this has molded a generation of seekers.

If we consider parks south of SOL:
Definitely:
-Owls Head
-Shore Road Park
-JPJ
-Leif Ericson
-McKinley
Possibly:
-Sunset Park
Less likely:
-Prospect
Love Sunset Park BTW. Amazing view of Manhattan and can see SOL and Ellis Island. Has anybody ever counted the number of steps going in? Actually surprised this park has gotten more attention over the years. If you believe the story, this may be the only spot where all the images are visible in the painting.
…Gershwin seems like a very logical choice for the rhapsodic man.

dosethree

I don’t know how you can say that the face in Image 12 does not look like the statue of liberty.
edited to include image for reference

I have to agree with GMan on this. It is similar to SOL and gets you to NY. It’s not similar enough. The face shape is not as masculine, the nose isn’t as broad, the shadows of the eye sockets are more slender and that is intentional. More on that when I finish compiling a mountain of info.

davinci4

I read on the board that NY searchers have found ‘nothing of interest’ at proposed cask locations. As we try to narrow choices, general question for the group, what are people hoping to see/find at the NY location? We have already discussed the likelihood there are probably no image confirmers at the location. Are we looking for a “v” “22 steps”? What are people envisioning at this location that would seem to fit?

Just speaking for myself here, when we investigate an area of interests and we exhaust all possible leads and clues from the image/verse in that spot, we save the information and move on. Obviously one persons perspective could be wrong but if a spot has been researched by many with the same results, then we are at least able to put that theory/location to rest for a while. Usually, when a new perspective or clue about the verse/image comes to light, we go back to possible locations to see if they fit.
While these are all assumptions that I hope we can we can agree with or rule out, I am under the belief that the image has to refer to a location on the coast. Between the Arch in the image, which is the same for SF puzzle, and the water and the bird (which seems to be part seagull).
I am very well versed on the book, which most people have not read or even completely understand. The entrance to NY harbor is very important as is the entrance to SF bay. An arch is symbolic of a gateway (door). My feeling is that the grey giant may very well be the Verrazzano bridge, which makes the slender path very easy to figure out form that point.
The actually story in the book only has one clear reference to Brooklyn but it is an important one. This area makes total sense but I am having a hard time finding the relevance to Gershwin in this area or finding Him of hard word.
And just to clarify, the face of the lady in the image looks like the statue of liberty to everyone that sees it. You can go in the street right now and ask a random person and I am sure they will tell you the same. I would of been open to the idea that it might be a SOL replica somewhere in the city but that would mean I need to ignore Isle of B. I say keep it simple and follow through with these more obvious clues and see where it actually leads. IF your argument is that the face is not an exact, perfect match for the SOL, I would argue that it is no supposed to be picture perfect. That is like picking apart the Chicago tower because it doesn’t have windmill fans or it is not the same exact shape.
I don’t think the SOL face is up for debate, in my opinion. It is a fruitless argument at best, especially when you have no other leads/clues/ or theories that hold weight about it. Keep it simple and take the hint for what it is worth before thinking it is some sort of elaborate diversion. So far the coast of Brooklyn has much more relevance then any other location researched before.

davinci4

If we consider parks south of SOL:
Definitely:
-Owls Head
-Shore Road Park
-JPJ
-Leif Ericson
-McKinley
Possibly:
-Sunset Park
Less likely:
-Prospect
Love Sunset Park BTW. Amazing view. Has anybody ever counted the number of steps going in?
…Gershwin seems like a very logical choice for the rhapsodic man.

Good list!!
I understand that Gershwin fits for Rhapsodic man because of rhapsody in blue but if that is so, what relation does he have to that area of Brooklyn listed? From what I can tell he was located mostly in E. New York/Brownsville area. Also, if we are looking down at his soil, wouldn’t that suggest a smaller area rather then a whole borough?

Yes. I think Preiss was providing a VERY general reference to Brooklyn, solely based on birthplace. You are correct, by itself, Gershwin lived in NYC as well. Coupled with other clues (south of SOL, Hamilton), it just seems to fit. The more interesting part is the ‘simple roots.’ I envision walking 22 steps and coming to a spot in a park where the terrain suddenly changes (from gravel to grass for example).
Might we take one step further:
1) South of SOL
2) Brooklyn
3) Eliminate any parks without “nearby” references to Alexander Hamilton
I like Sunset Park for many reasons but never seriously considered it based on a lack of nearby signs that mentions Hamilton, unless I missed one. Thoughts?

She looks like a typical Audrey Munson modeled statue. Watch the very short video within:
https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/miss-manhattan/

Choice

She looks like a typical Audrey Munson modeled statue. Watch the very short video within:
https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/miss-manhattan/

SMH

davinci4

Yes. I think Preiss was providing a VERY general reference to Brooklyn, solely based on birthplace. You are correct, by itself, Gershwin lived in NYC as well. Coupled with other clues (south of SOL, Hamilton), it just seems to fit. The more interesting part is the ‘simple roots.’ I envision walking 22 steps and coming to a spot in a
park
where the terrain suddenly changes (from gravel to grass for example).
Might we take one step further:
1) South of SOL
2) Brooklyn
3) Eliminate any parks without “nearby” references to Alexander Hamilton
I like Sunset
Park
for many reasons but never seriously considered it based on a lack of nearby signs that mentions Hamilton, unless I missed one. Thoughts?

I still don’t see the relevance to Gershwin, at all but I have been told I have been stubborn about that.
As far as signs with Hamilton’s name, there are a ton along the belt parkway, from Owl’s head to JPJ.
Also, while I like the simplicity of thinking that the whirring sound in summer is a bike path, a military friend made me aware that in the summer is when most of the training is/was done around Ft. Hamilton.

davinci4

Yes. I think Preiss was providing a VERY general reference to Brooklyn, solely based on birthplace. You are correct, by itself, Gershwin lived in NYC as well. Coupled with other clues (south of SOL, Hamilton), it just seems to fit. The more interesting part is the ‘simple roots.’ I envision walking 22 steps and coming to a spot in a park where the terrain suddenly changes (from gravel to grass for example).
Might we take one step further:
1) South of SOL
2) Brooklyn
3) Eliminate any parks without “nearby” references to Alexander Hamilton
I like Sunset Park for many reasons but never seriously considered it based on a lack of nearby signs that mentions Hamilton, unless I missed one. Thoughts?

I still don’t see the relevance to Gershwin, at all but I have been told I have been stubborn about that.
As far as signs with Hamilton’s name, there are a ton along the belt parkway, from Owl’s head to JPJ.
Also, while I like the simplicity of thinking that the whirring sound in summer is a bike path, a military friend made me aware that in the summer is when most of the training is/was done around Ft. Hamilton.

Yes. I have always felt the cask was likely buried in one of those locations (JPJ, Shore Road, Owls Head). Curious about Owls Head, less familiar with that location, are there any obvious ‘Hamilton signs’ that are visible in the
park
?

Yes. I have always felt the cask was likely buried in one of those locations (JPJ, Shore Road, Owls Head). Curious about Owls Head, less familiar with that location, are there any obvious ‘Hamilton signs’ that are visible in the park?

davinci4

Yes. I have always felt the cask was likely buried in one of those locations (JPJ, Shore Road, Owls Head). Curious about Owls Head, less familiar with that location, are there any obvious ‘Hamilton signs’ that are visible in the
park
?

Probably not and not from my memory. Then again, since that
park
is right on the belt parkway, I am sure there are exit signs nearby of Ft. Hamilton.
I also do not think it is JPJ. The
park
is very, very small with a few landmarks and nothing really fits in the area. I am aware of the theories before of him being the rhapsodic man but there is seriously nothing there.

davinci4

Yes. I have always felt the cask was likely buried in one of those locations (JPJ, Shore Road, Owls Head). Curious about Owls Head, less familiar with that location, are there any obvious ‘Hamilton signs’ that are visible in the park?

Probably not and not from my memory. Then again, since that park is right on the belt parkway, I am sure there are exit signs nearby of Ft. Hamilton.
I also do not think it is JPJ. The park is very, very small with a few landmarks and nothing really fits in the area. I am aware of the theories before of him being the rhapsodic man but there is seriously nothing there.

I guess you missed page 67 of the book where he published the actual picture of the statue. Not a caricature. That’s an Audrey Munson modeled statue.
https://tinyurl.com/yyrwd538

NYCNative

Wait…why is Brooklyn “rhapsodic man’s soil”? I would strongly disagree with Prospect
park
though. Besides all the research that goes no where as far as connection to the puzzle in Prospect, we are way out of range of view of SOL.
J

This statement assumes that one of the objects that should be in view from the dig spot is the SOL. While I agree that generally the SOL is referenced as a locater, the woman in the painting does not really look like the SOL and may be an entirely different reference at or very close to the casque location.

NYCNative

Wait…why is Brooklyn “rhapsodic man’s soil”? I would strongly disagree with Prospect park though. Besides all the research that goes no where as far as connection to the puzzle in Prospect, we are way out of range of view of SOL.
J

This statement assumes that one of the objects that should be in view from the dig spot is the SOL. While I agree that generally the SOL is referenced as a locater, the woman in the painting does not really look like the SOL and may be an entirely different reference at or very close to the casque location.

Choice

I guess you missed page 67 of the book where he published the actual picture of the statue. Not a caricature. That’s an Audrey Munson modeled statue.
https://tinyurl.com/yyrwd538

What I missed is how this is relevant to anything. What is the connection? what is the point? If you are claiming that the face in image 12 is not the SOL but is Munson, then back it up with something.

Audrey Munson was known as “Miss Manhattan”.
That spot at the Columbus Circle is a straight shot to Queensboro Bridge.
Her left hand points towards east and her fingers form E and backwards R.
Cross East River to Roosevelt Island. South part of it is in the shadow of UN building.
To the north is Lucille Ball’s fictional home, right at the shore of East River at E 68th St.

Choice

That spot at the Columbus Circle is a straight shot to Queensboro Bridge.
Her left hand points towards east and her fingers form E and backwards R.
Cross East River to Roosevelt Island…

Though this may not be apparent unless you’re very familiar with NYC, you can’t take 59th street over the Queensboro Bridge to get to Roosevelt Island. At least not in a way that sounds as simple as the above.
First, the bridge does not go to Roosevelt Island. It goes
over
Roosevelt Island. To Queens.
Second, for the shortest route, you can’t access it from 59th street (the street Columbus Circle is on). You can only access the upper roadway from 57th street. Then you must go to Queens, drive in about 1/2 mile, do a loop around and block, come back towards the bridge, turn on Vernon Blvd, go north more than 1/2 mile to access the Roosevelt Island bridge to come back west to get to the island.
You can access the lower roadway from 59th St, but that dumps you out even further into Queens and it’s a much longer and more tortuous route to go north and then west to get to Roosevelt Island bridge.
The only other ways to get to Roosevelt Island from Manhattan are the F train or take a Roosevelt Tram gondola.
https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Columbus+Cir,+New+York,+NY/Roosevelt+Island,+New+York,+NY+10044/@40.7629811,-73.9610708,5188m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m15!4m14!1m5!1m1!1s0x89c258f63c9804b5:0xacca5e3d4112d7eb!2m2!1d-73.9814981!2d40.7678746!1m5!1m1!1s0x89c258c4d85a0d8d:0x11f877ff0b8ffe27!2m2!1d-73.9509934!2d40.7605031!3e0!5i2
Your route to the island may very well account for this or take the Tram. I’m just pointing this out so that you can clarify your intentions if you wish. Happy hunting.

Kang

Though this may not be apparent unless you’re very familiar with NYC, you can’t take 59th street over the Queensboro Bridge to get to Roosevelt Island. At least not in a way that sounds as simple as the above.
First, the bridge does not go to Roosevelt Island. It goes
over
Roosevelt Island. To Queens.
Second, for the shortest route, you can’t access it from 59th street (the street Columbus Circle is on). You can only access the upper roadway from 57th street. Then you must go to Queens, drive in about 1/2 mile, do a loop around and block, come back towards the bridge, turn on Vernon Blvd, go north more than 1/2 mile to access the Roosevelt Island bridge to come back west to get to the island.
You can access the lower roadway from 59th St, but that dumps you out even further into Queens and it’s a much longer and more tortuous route to go north and then west to get to Roosevelt Island bridge.
The only other ways to get to Roosevelt Island from Manhattan are the F train or take a Roosevelt Tram gondola.
https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Columbus+Cir,+New+York,+NY/Roosevelt+Island,+New+York,+NY+10044/@40.7629811,-73.9610708,5188m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m15!4m14!1m5!1m1!1s0x89c258f63c9804b5:0xacca5e3d4112d7eb!2m2!1d-73.9814981!2d40.7678746!1m5!1m1!1s0x89c258c4d85a0d8d:0x11f877ff0b8ffe27!2m2!1d-73.9509934!2d40.7605031!3e0!5i2
Your route to the island may very well account for this or take the Tram. I’m just pointing this out so that you can clarify your intentions if you wish. Happy hunting.

This is why boots on the ground is so important. Even in relatively accessible sites, like Lake Park in Milwaukee for example, walking around reveals how practical or improbable a particular direction or area is. Great post.

Point well taken Kang. I’ve never been to NYC except on layovers so I wouldn’t know the intricate routs. I’m just interpreting the image and direction it’s pointing.
Statue’s arms are the V and that branch of the V is pointing towards E.R.

Trohn

In regard to the Pier A clock, this was a common style used at the time.
If it was still around in the ’80s, I am sure you could find an example to point to.
I commuted to and from NY for fourteen years.  I do not have a photo of this,
but I believe the clock to be closer to the one on on the Water Street Heliport.
This heliport has a clock face on two sides of the building (street side and water side)
The key is (if I remember) that it only have the four roman numerals (XII, III, VI, IX)
rather than all tweleve.
Regardless of the exact clock picture, we can all agree (hopefully) tjhat it will be found
fronting water.

trohn did you mean this one
http://jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=5721912&nseq=54

!

The general outline of Prospect Park is a good match Slappy…..very intresting

thanks guys

Unknown

Unknown:
I was just in Battery Park today.  You can’t see the Chrysler building from the park.  Too many buildings.

But were they all there over 20 years ago?

Unknown

Unknown:
I was just in Battery
Park
today.  You can’t see the Chrysler building from the
park
.  Too many buildings.

But were they all there over 20 years ago?

God call with Pitt, but why would there be waves in the picture if it wasn’t
near
the ocean.  I live in Jersey, but I don’t know if you can see the CChrysler Building from Battery park, but you  can see Lady liberty.  Oh wait what about Liberty state park in New jersey?

God call with Pitt, but why would there be waves in the picture if it wasn’t
near
the ocean.  I live in Jersey, but I don’t know if you can see the CChrysler Building from Battery
park
, but you  can see Lady liberty.  Oh wait what about Liberty state
park
in New jersey?

Cormac

In rhapsodic man’s soil …
Prospect Park’s Concert Grove possesses a rich collection of historic bronze sculptures. Three were donated by United German Singers of Brooklyn as trophies won in the national Saengerfest choral competitions. These works include Henry Baerer’s bust Ludwig von Beethoven (1894), Augustus Mueller’s Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart (1897) and Chester Beach’s Karl Maria Von Weber (1909).

I now think that this prevous post I left is misleading.  Explanation in Verse 10 post.

Check out the Russian Orthodox Cathedral of the Transfiguration of Our Lord, in Brooklyn
http://www.roct.org/
Note that the domes were once green/turquoise (probably in the ’80s as well), but were cleaned in 2004 and are now brown/copper. Also McCarren Park is located across the street.
-bazile

This is what I’m thinking. Osprey.

Unknown

Unknown:
which would be tragic if you have the right spot but gave up because one thing did not fit.

Based on my experience here, it’s rarely just one thing. If anything, its usually the other way around. People find one or two things that they really like, then build the rest of the solve around that. I’m not saying that’s wrong necessarily, but the more that’s left open to interpretation, the more likely the chances that the solve is not the solution.

hi everyone…my name is holli…and i just heard about this one and decided to give it a go…i see alot of familiar names from tweleve here…hope to be of help to you all…

Hey there holligirl….welcome to The Secret.  Cant wait to hear some of your thoughts on this one since you seemed to have a good grasp on ATT.  Spoken for the masses over at Tweleve who have been toiling away with A Treasures Trove….Holli is a great addition to The Secret team.
Nuff of the accolades….time to get cracking holli
The treasures are no where near the value of ATT but to say you had a hand in cracking one of these 20+ year old puzzles in treasure enuff.  Again…..WELCOME !

I’ve been lurking on the boards for a while, enjoying the hunt–hope you don’t mind if I jump in. I want to propose something a little radical (could be completely wrong, but I thought I’d throw it out here for comment).
I wonder if image 12, which we’ve been assuming to refer to NYC, could actually be paired with verse 10 and referring to Pittsburgh, PA.  Here are my thoughts:
The solo rectangle in the left corner looks to me like the US Steel tower (USX tower) in downtown Pgh, which is one of the tallest buildings in the world.  It is dark grey (the “grey giant” of verse 10?).  If you cross the Monongahela river to the south side of Pgh, you find St. John the Baptist Ukranian Catholic church almost literally “in the shadow of the grey giant.” (see first link below)
http://www.clpgh.org/exhibit/neighborho … _n223.html
Here is another image:
http://www.clpgh.org/exhibit/neighborho … _n221.html
The church is not an exact match to the silhouette in I12, but it’s pretty close.  Perspective based on where you’re standing might also affect the match.  From the photo in the second link, it seems that the stained-glass windows in the church are shaped just like I12.
If you start at the church and go about half a mile west on Carson street, passing under the Liberty bridge (a possible alternate explanation for the face of Liberty on the woman in Image 12?) you get to the foot of the Monongahela incline.
http://web.presby.edu/~jtbell/transit/i … llView.jpg
The station sign saying Monongahela (after the nearby river, which was named for the native Monongahela Indian culture) could be the “sign nearby” that “speaks of Indies native”  and I can tell you from experience that there is a serious whirring sound from the cables–the incline is really noisy!  “Cars abound” here, definitely. “Carson” (a play on words?) street has lots of auto traffic.  There are railroad tracks and a train station on the other side of the street (train cars) and the incline has cars, too.  If you wanted to get cute, you could say that “cars abound” refers to the incline cars, which are bound to the track.
The “arm that extends over the slender path” could be the incline track itself–there are supposedly footpaths that go up Mt. Washington, but I have no idea if there is one near or under the incline.  If you take the incline up, you get to Grandview Ave.  Nearby to the east is Grandview
Park
.  I haven’t been there, so I am not sure if 22 steps (“twice as many east steps as the hour”) would get you to from the top of the incline to the
park
, but it might.  22 steps might also refer to stairs near the bottom or top of the incline.
If you are at the top of the incline, on Mt. Washington, you have a view that allows you to “gaze north” (northwest, technically) “toward the isle of B” which would be Brunot Island, in the Ohio river.
I don’t know who “him of Hard word” would be in this case.  “Hard” makes me think of steel, and Pittsburgh is known as the Steel City.  Perhaps one of the nineteenth-century steel tycoons like Carnegie or Frick?  The area of the city that I’m describing used to be industrial, with iron, steel and glass works.
Other random ideas: the three droplets of water in Image 12 could represent Pittsburgh’s famous three rivers.  In Verse 10, the “simple roots in rhapsodic man’s soil” might refer to the fact that Pittsburgh was the birthplace and childhood home of Oscar Levant, a pianist and actor who was the best friend of George “Rhapsody in Blue” Gershwin.  Levant played himself in the movie “Rhapsody in Blue” and also recorded much of the movie’s soundtrack, including the title track.  From Grandview avenue (or
park
) you can see all of downtown Pgh, including the Hill district, where Levant grew up.  Maybe there is a plaque or monument?
The eagle is the main thing making me question all of this, because I agree that it really does look like the gargoyle on the NYC Chrysler building.  But could it be just an eagle?  The only link I can come up with for my scenario is that the eagle relates to George Washington (as on the quarter-dollar coin, and in general USA symbology) and Mt. Washington is
central
here.  Kind of weak, though…
Would love to hear anybody else’s ideas on this.  I thought it was interesting enough to rate a post, but maybe I just have too much time on my hands…
–Melanie

I’ve been lurking on the boards for a while, enjoying the hunt–hope you don’t mind if I jump in. I want to propose something a little radical (could be completely wrong, but I thought I’d throw it out here for comment).
I wonder if image 12, which we’ve been assuming to refer to NYC, could actually be paired with verse 10 and referring to Pittsburgh, PA.  Here are my thoughts:
The solo rectangle in the left corner looks to me like the US Steel tower (USX tower) in downtown Pgh, which is one of the tallest buildings in the world.  It is dark grey (the “grey giant” of verse 10?).  If you cross the Monongahela river to the south side of Pgh, you find St. John the Baptist Ukranian Catholic church almost literally “in the shadow of the grey giant.” (see first link below)
http://www.clpgh.org/exhibit/neighborho … _n223.html
Here is another image:
http://www.clpgh.org/exhibit/neighborho … _n221.html
The church is not an exact match to the silhouette in I12, but it’s pretty close.  Perspective based on where you’re standing might also affect the match.  From the photo in the second link, it seems that the stained-glass windows in the church are shaped just like I12.
If you start at the church and go about half a mile west on Carson street, passing under the Liberty bridge (a possible alternate explanation for the face of Liberty on the woman in Image 12?) you get to the foot of the Monongahela incline.
http://web.presby.edu/~jtbell/transit/i … llView.jpg
The station sign saying Monongahela (after the nearby river, which was named for the native Monongahela Indian culture) could be the “sign nearby” that “speaks of Indies native”  and I can tell you from experience that there is a serious whirring sound from the cables–the incline is really noisy!  “Cars abound” here, definitely. “Carson” (a play on words?) street has lots of auto traffic.  There are railroad tracks and a train station on the other side of the street (train cars) and the incline has cars, too.  If you wanted to get cute, you could say that “cars abound” refers to the incline cars, which are bound to the track.
The “arm that extends over the slender path” could be the incline track itself–there are supposedly footpaths that go up Mt. Washington, but I have no idea if there is one near or under the incline.  If you take the incline up, you get to Grandview Ave.  Nearby to the east is Grandview Park.  I haven’t been there, so I am not sure if 22 steps (“twice as many east steps as the hour”) would get you to from the top of the incline to the park, but it might.  22 steps might also refer to stairs near the bottom or top of the incline.
If you are at the top of the incline, on Mt. Washington, you have a view that allows you to “gaze north” (northwest, technically) “toward the isle of B” which would be Brunot Island, in the Ohio river.
I don’t know who “him of Hard word” would be in this case.  “Hard” makes me think of steel, and Pittsburgh is known as the Steel City.  Perhaps one of the nineteenth-century steel tycoons like Carnegie or Frick?  The area of the city that I’m describing used to be industrial, with iron, steel and glass works.
Other random ideas: the three droplets of water in Image 12 could represent Pittsburgh’s famous three rivers.  In Verse 10, the “simple roots in rhapsodic man’s soil” might refer to the fact that Pittsburgh was the birthplace and childhood home of Oscar Levant, a pianist and actor who was the best friend of George “Rhapsody in Blue” Gershwin.  Levant played himself in the movie “Rhapsody in Blue” and also recorded much of the movie’s soundtrack, including the title track.  From Grandview avenue (or park) you can see all of downtown Pgh, including the Hill district, where Levant grew up.  Maybe there is a plaque or monument?
The eagle is the main thing making me question all of this, because I agree that it really does look like the gargoyle on the NYC Chrysler building.  But could it be just an eagle?  The only link I can come up with for my scenario is that the eagle relates to George Washington (as on the quarter-dollar coin, and in general USA symbology) and Mt. Washington is central here.  Kind of weak, though…
Would love to hear anybody else’s ideas on this.  I thought it was interesting enough to rate a post, but maybe I just have too much time on my hands…
–Melanie

Someone brought it up once as being close to Central Park but not *in* it. Also, it was close to my hotel.

Someone brought it up once as being close to
Central
Park
but not *in* it. Also, it was close to my hotel.

Refresh my memory….why Columbus Circle?

THIS SHOULD HELP, IT IS A MIRROR IMAGE OF THE GOW

Shannon – that is precisely the kind of thinking outside the box that will win this thing. Great ideas!! Recently someone very new to the hunt looked at Verse 9 and saw the acrostic under everybody’s noses — the first time anyone was able to do that in 26 years of hunting. I hope you are similarly right about the musical notes. Can you illustrate exactly what you mean using images?

the water droplets are the three islands off of mahatten island, in the picute her gown is in the shape of mahatten island and there is three island in the location of the drops,

Hi everyone,
Although I bought my copy of The Secret 2 years ago, I only recently had a chance to start looking at it. Since I just moved to northern NJ, I figured that I would concentrate on image 12. Everyone seems very open on this site to sharing ideas. Here’s my thoughts on the water droplets.
If any of you saw the Numbers episode lately dealing with a cryptographer, you’ll know that they solved part of  the code using the placement of some objects as musical notes. I traced the water droplets on wax paper and held them up to a bar of music. Assuming that the gem is middle C, the notes appear to be G or F one octave higher, middle C, E, then G or F one octave higher again. What led me to think about this is the symbol seen in the water in the light blue wave above the “74.”  It looks like a % sign, only it has two bars in the middle. This is a musical symbol that stands for “simile marks” (see link below and search on simile) meaning to repeat the sequence. Given that some people are linking this p to v10 with rhapsodic man, this may be a clue. I tried matching the tune to Stairway to Heaven or Rhapsody in Blue, but didn’t have much luck. Perhaps someone with a piano and some sheet music could explore this more. I may have also started on the wrong key.
Another possibility is that the letters then become numbers, C for 3, etc. I’m still playing with it, but I thought I’d throw the idea out since I hadn’t seen it posted before. If this is an old and discarded theory, just let me know.
http://www.dolmetsch.com/musicalsymbols.htm
Shannon

turtle123456

the water droplets are the three islands off of mahatten island, in the picute her gown is in the shape of mahatten island and there is three island in the location of the drops,

I opened google earth and popped up manhatten Island
I dont see the correspondance with the bottom of the dress and manhatten – Them seem to me to be two entirely different shapes
and while there are indeed drops and a jewel below the dress – the dont seem to me to correspond with the locations of Governors island, Ellis isand and Liberty island.
Am I missing something?

Tying in a specific and well known historic event is a great way to normalize these puzzles.

Re: those horse railings in OHP…
I noticed that in the horse story, when they go on about “steal horse” (steel horse) it happens on three nights (knights). It’s so bizarre, it must mean something.
This…
…reminds me of this…
Also looks like a “3”.
And you have “white horse” meaning “wave”.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/white+horse
OHP also has these, visible in the railing pic:

those diamond shapes remind me of the dark (shadows) of the woman’s eyes in the image.
just putting this out there…….inwood hill park
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=htt … 29,r:4,s:0

those diamond shapes remind me of the dark (shadows) of the woman’s eyes in the image.
just putting this out there…….inwood hill
park
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=htt … 29,r:4,s:0

bemo12

Has anyone seen the Fort Hamilton triangle in person?
The bird at the top look awfully familiar like the one in the image, but I can’t see close enough from this pic.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/wallyg/626 … 164131264/

What is closer to the image as a whole is the Fort Hamilton Seal.
Google it.

Has anyone seen the Fort Hamilton triangle in person?
The bird at the top look awfully familiar like the one in the image, but I can’t see close enough from this pic.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/wallyg/626 … 164131264/

I really can’t say too much about the stops or stations until I get over there to check it out.  A while back I posted a pic of a cream and maroon clored subway car from 1980 that was at the Hamilton station.  Never made anything of it.
I will look for these things for you….After I dig on the west side of the flagpost.

i hope it is right there by the flagpole boogieman! poke the north side too! it will be so SWEET if you get one!
the verse seems to take you right there.
i’m going to visit my family the end of this week and will be pretty busy, but i’ll be sure to keep checking, hoping you’ve got it! good luck to you!

Foo dog?

boogieman

http://webapp1.dlib.indiana.edu/collect … P11558.jpg
This is all gone.  Whatever memorial was there has been moved, at least about three years ago.  I was looking around the Battery for V5 back in 06′-07′.  Lots of pics but nothing on Minuit.

booge this monument in link for flicker below
its near the sphere
i think its still there, i saw pics someplace on
the net for last year. will see if i can find them again
i could be wrong i remember seeing construction
near there for the tunnel will have to check
some text from link
When the park was closed from 1940 to 1952 for renovations and to build the Brooklyn-Battery Tunnel, the monument was relocated to its present site at the northeast entrance.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/wallyg/332157206/
minuit purchased the island/new york
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Minuit

Hmmmm…spent some time on the Battery park site last night looking for matching stuff, but didn’t find much. I do like the pylons at the East Coast memorial, though, for the V. However, I don’t buy the Minuet/Minuit/rhapsody connection at all.
“Rhapsodic” can also refer to epic poetry.
There was, however, something that DID strike a chord (forgive me) and that was Castle Clinton. If you Wiki the term, you will find out that a large number of people involved in music came through it when it was an immigrant processing station. But rhapsodic? nah…it doesn’t really get there for me. I was hoping that we could find some connection with either a poet (other than Emma Lazarus) or with Gershwin. But I didn’t spend enough researching time on that connection.

ck thats an idea, i remember reading something to do
with a writer, not sure the writer was a poet
anyway something to do with one of the monuments
ill look for it, and get back if i find it again

yep without being there its hard to
see how well it all matches
maybe boogie or someone could
take a look see, sometime
——————————————
I like the Battery Park location much better than JPJ park, but…
what are the “
simple roots
?” And why is he(
Minuit
) “rhapsodic?”
maybe bp was taking literary license, as the simple start of NY
and the
minuet
waltz is music=peters last name / minuit
and music is thought of as rhapsodic sometimes

http://webapp1.dlib.indiana.edu/collect … P11558.jpg
This is all gone.  Whatever memorial was there has been moved, at least about three years ago.  I was looking around the Battery for V5 back in 06′-07′.  Lots of pics but nothing on Minuit.

oh wow, cw, that is great!
i love the word play!

boogieman

But there is snow on the ground.

It’s melted by now, surely…?
May 1st heralds the fire tide. Time to kick ass.

rolenrock

Wait.. what? I need to provide proof to you that a dig happened? The permit was properly applied for and attained from the parks department. As far as that, what did you want me to do, send you the dirt off the shovel?
It happened.

It’s super-sad, but a lot of people will say “oh I dug there” when someone posts a solve, just to scare people off. Then they can go dig there later and claim that sweet worthless treasure.
So, yeah, a photo of the holes or a picture of the permit would be nice, if only so we can combine our efforts and figure out where exactly has and hasn’t hasn’t been dug.

With a wife and three kids, time is very valuable so the going is slow.
The casques have been hidden for over twenty years….
I do not think you have to apologize for taking your time
While it is true that we will not know for sure until something
is unearthed, I am trying not to settle in my head a verse for an
image for a general location – only after all the pieces fall into place.
Just seems with time alasping, some clues provided could point to many
general locations.  If we used a dart board, I am sure we could get some
aspect of most verses to fit into the random target.
I do like the Bayonne church, just the location stinks as far as logic is
concerned.  Just no where to bury it.
I wish we could nail down a good location in Canada with a verse and an
image – that would help our remaining US possibiliites.
(FWIW – I like Egbert’s approach – find one and not get obsessed about
finding a second
)  Plenty to go around….

Even if the church silhouette is the one in Bayonne, BP may have included it just to establish the Russian theme for Image 12. It may have nothing to do with the casque location.

Forrest-
There is no evidence to support your supposition.
Every image scrutinized thus far has had no out of
location material.
Following up a posting to the wiki…
here is a link…
http://www.phlf.org/spotlightonmainstre … ing02.html
I am making no conclusions, just provinding fodder.

Try this:  this should clarify the hair NJ/NY map issue nobody has responded to.
http://www.freewebs.com/patcash/nycharbor.htm

Trohn

Just seems with time alasping, some clues provided could point to many
general locations.  If we used a dart board, I am sure we could get some
aspect of most verses to fit into the random target.

“Eighteenth day
Twelfth hour
Lit by lamplight
In truth, be free.”
Dont see how this can point to anything but Paul Revere’s midnight ride.  No dart boards here….but…if there is a dart board, I would say this is a bulls eye.

boogie – I can never see the pictures you post. Am I the only one with this problem?

See new postings at verse three.

forest_blight

boogie – I can never see the pictures you post. Am I the only one with this problem?

Can you see them with the link?

I can’t see them in the link or the forum.

I tried red (a little Chloraseptic in the bottom of a glass) but saw nothing.  However, I’m a little color-blind, so I may be the wrong person to ask.
Does anyone (with good color vision) have one of those 3-D glasses with a red and a blue lens?  Try each of them.

This pic appears to fall under the following theme:
November (11 o’clock? hard to tell)
Topaz? (there’s blue topaz, but the poem indicates a gold color!!!)
Chrysanthemum
Russian Theme (russian orthodox church!)
“A Topaz is the Russian prize:
The royal sunstone, frozen fire.”

phrabbott

Hi all–I have another connection that I don’t see discussed anywhere.
The rectangle with the red outline in the lower left of the window/grid. The fact that it’s red has always been very important to me.
This is certainly a stretch, but…
Could it be a representation of the White Hall Building?
http://www.nyc-architecture.com/LM/whhall.jpg
Perched so conveniently facing Battery Park next to a gray clock face with roman numerals?
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d9/Manhattan_-_Pier_A_from_the_harbor_02_%289440383581%29.jpg
Designed by Henry
Hard
enbergh? Is that too convenient or what? haha. I haven’t made headway with this theory unfortunately. I can’t fit 3 Vols into it. Also where’s the Indies Native sign? Hamilton Custom House doesn’t work because it was named in 1990.
I fear that a lot of my clues lead to Battery Park. The casque would have had a hard time surviving that one over the last 40 years.

That is an interesting theory. A lot of us started with battery park/financial district area but it always led to nothing. I am convinced that the casques would probably be in or around a major park and not in a neighborhood park, lot, or a random patch of dirt. One of the points of the book was to go out and enjoy what these cities have to offer.

Ha, I started with Staten Island actually but a few boots on the ground forays really made it seem unlikely for the major park as opposed to small park reason. My idea there just wasn’t a fun or interesting walk which made me think it wouldn’t meet the goals of this hunt.
However, as the past images have always been things you see on the way and not necessarily directly related to the find, I’m still convinced image 12 depicts (in order from left to right) the Staten Island Ferry ride.
Battery park continually delivers in image and verse, but it’s changed so much that I believe that’s where the dead ends form. I’m currently working on reconstructing it from past tourist pamphlets and images. I even saw an 80s artist’s quote that states they love battery park because it’s so empty on weekends. Also lots of references to passing time by riding the ferry. Solidifies it as a very good candidate imo.

anyone think the rough outline of the white surf portion of the water is similar to the shape of San Juan Island National Historic Park?

animal painter

Once more I have modified the map.
Today I found a better match to the
animal in the foamy water in image 12.
It is a bear figure by the Delacorte Clock…
another Central Park location…not Chinatown.
You can watch the animals on the clock
move around, at the link posted below.
I know someone said that BP denied burying
a casque in Central Park, so it is merely a clue
to get us in the right area.

Erexere,
Are you talking about the animal in the foam?

Animal Painter, I’ve updated the image in my previous post to illustrate a VERY rough similarity when I scale the map to the size of the WHOLE surf segment.  Have a look.

I still don’t know what that bear is doing there. It’s escaped from Montreal.

i love the battery park area.  i tried to fit verse 5 with it, lots of it works.
lane 222- washington street
you’ll see an arc of lights-anything
weight and roots extended…==castle clinton
of granite walls…–castle clinton
a wingless bird ascended, born of ancient dreams of flight—, man, immigration, ellis island
beneath the only standing member of a forest to the south ———–jesse de
forest.
………..walloon settlers monument
http://www.nycgovparks.org/sub_your_par … monId=1647
but then when you look up walloons, the picture looked like image 9……..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walloons
i like image 9 for new york, with the dutch idea  :)………..but my golf idea doesn’t go with battery park

I’m going to propose a new idea for Image 12. Maybe we are getting a bit hidebound on this board–and maybe Ex is right a little
about our refusal to shake up our ideas. Whatever. At any rate, he got me thinking again about New York.
I went through (albeit hastily) the posts on this image again–all 43 pages of them. And something popped out at me.
The bottom of the woman’s gown is shaped like Lower Manhattan. The gemstone in the image is almost exactly where Governor’s Island would be, and the other water droplets could be Ellis Island (left) and Brooklyn (the two on the right). I know that Governor’s Island was proposed once, but Trohn said that because it was a Coast Guard base at one time that BP would have had “zero access” to it. That isn’t true, exactly. There is still (and was then) a large residential area on GI that would have been publicly accessible. HOWEVER, I’ve been over the place with as fine a toothed comb as my research permits, and I don’t really think the casque is there–although a strong argument for that bear in the surf could be made for Bear Road, on Governor’s–which would have been in the publicly accessible area. But I think the bear is just an inside joke of BP’s and JJPs. a bit of a Red Berring, as it were. (groan).  At any rate, None of the images in the top of I. 12 are on Governor’s either. And that’s a stronger argument. So where are they? Actually, a lot of them are in Battery Park. The bird–the mosaics–the rectangular figure, and the red/white tiles–all elements found in Battery Park. The mosaics are famous, actually–part of a bunch of mosaics that Heins and LaFarge did all over NYC. The bird is almost the exact same shape and wing-set at the one in the image, and the rectangle is part of a bunch of rectangular stones that line one end of the park. The tiles are part of the subway station. In fact, even the “onion domes” are visible–as those dome-like things on the Ellis island building, just across the bay–visible with the naked eye (or a pair of binoculars.) In other words, not far. And those mosaics–they aren’t  (in my opinion) JUST representative of the famous ones–they could also be something else: Castle Clinton, (which has a prominent arched doorway at the front like the arch in the Image) was at one time the NYC Public Aquarium. Those pebbly mosaics look a lot like fish tank gravel to me. NEXT POST PLEASE.

Okay–so how do we make Verse 10 fit? Well, we don’t.
Here’s where you’ll have to take a leap of faith.
I think this Image should be paired up with Verse 7.
At stone wall’s door the air smells sweet:
It would. Castle Clinton is basically a big stone wall, with flowers and gardens around it. The fresh sea air would be a constant counterpoint to the stuffy city atmosphere. Battery Park has always been a famous place to “take the air” in NYC.
Not far away, high posts are three
Education and Justice for all to see.
The 3 “high posts” would be the three places where monuments speak of education and justice: The Statue of Liberty on Liberty Island, The immigration museum on Ellis Island, and the Coast Guard on Governor’s Island. In addition, “justice” could be served by the use of Castle Williams (on GI) as a prison for many many years.
Sounds from the sky near ace is high
Again, the Coast Guard had their base nearby–and there were many “aces” in the squadrons. There was a small airport there on GI.
Running north, but first across
Battery Park is north of these things that were already mentioned–and “first across” could mean the ferry, which runs North-South
In jewel’s direction
the jewel’s direction would be, then, NORTH. NOT on Governor’s Island, but in Battery Park.
Is an object of Twain’s attention.
Oh, yes there is. The Player’s Club is NORTH of the park–and Mark Twain FOUNDED IT along with Edwin Booth. Certainly an object of his attention.
Now comes the hard part. I found the Giant Pole.  It’s here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mandaroak/4495692010/
But, I don’t know about the Giant Step–but I’m assuming it’s somewhere near the pole. I have not been able to find a lot of good pics of Battery Park that show the whole place, especially around the spar-pole. I really think there needs to be someone to walk the place and see in person.
Okay—I know this is a little radical, but a lot of it fits together. The image fits, the verse fits. And the location would have been ideal then, and still is. It’s not central Park, and it’s not Ellis Island–both of which we have been told were NOT locations. It’s not as problematic as Verse 10 with it’s “hard word” and V and Isle of B It would free up Verse 10 to be used in Canada–I’ve always liked Niagara Falls as a location for that one.  Or there could be yet another location in New York state–it’s not out of the question.
Your thoughts?

And here is another idea: There is a man named Scott Jordan who is an artist and a self-styled “urban archeologist” who grew up on Governor’s Island. He has dug up most of the place and uses the shards and artifacts he finds to make jewelry or art objects. He also digs up a lot of stuff all over NYC. We could maybe contact him–he has a website–and ask if he (1) ever dug up a plexiglas box at any time, and (2)  if he might be interested in digging around in Battery Park. He gets permission easily because he’s well-known and respectful of the site–and has a (smile) “higher purpose” to his digging.
What do you think?
http://www.newyorkartifactart.com/articles.html

here is an email from BP to FRSTPRZFA which she forwarded to me concerning a possible casque location in
Central
Park
.
—————————————————–
From:
To:
Subject: Re: Sorry to bother you.
Sent: Sunday, May 23, 2004 8:08 PM
there is no treasure in
central
park
—————————————————-
drats, there goes my ideas….looks like we need to turn to other parts/parks of NYC

here is an email from BP to FRSTPRZFA which she forwarded to me concerning a possible casque location in Central Park.
—————————————————–
From:
To:
Subject: Re: Sorry to bother you.
Sent: Sunday, May 23, 2004 8:08 PM
there is no treasure in central park
—————————————————-
drats, there goes my ideas….looks like we need to turn to other parts/parks of NYC

Unknown

Unknown:
Now this is the 3rd verse that may fit battery
Park
.  Thanks Shecrab.  More to work with.  Thats a good thing.  On the downer side, i dont have any time now to treasure hunt.  I run a travel softball club, working, and  3kids to run around for, it’s tough.  As soon as something opens up I will post what I find.  I will say this though, the giant pole has concrete around it, maybe 24 ft in diameter.  Giant step? 12 in. small step? 12 ft giant step?

Oh, cool—-that could very well be it! Perhaps due north of the pole, that would indeed be a “giant step!” I could not see much of what was around the pole on any image I found on line. The pole does sit in a sort of lawn-y area–no flower beds that I could see–so that might just be a good location! And in the late 80’s, in this
park
, the area was sort of neglected–not patrolled or too secure–it would have been (maybe!) an ideal place to dig a hole without causing any undue reaction. The reason I think this is the giant pole is that the pole looks like a mast, not just any old pole. This verse could also explain why there aren’t a lot of directions to a really specific place–you would only need a compass to find true north, and that would be a very small area to dig in.  We need a digger in NYC!! (Hope the team is doing well this year!)

Unknown

Unknown:
Now this is the 3rd verse that may fit battery Park.  Thanks Shecrab.  More to work with.  Thats a good thing.  On the downer side, i dont have any time now to treasure hunt.  I run a travel softball club, working, and  3kids to run around for, it’s tough.  As soon as something opens up I will post what I find.  I will say this though, the giant pole has concrete around it, maybe 24 ft in diameter.  Giant step? 12 in. small step? 12 ft giant step?

Oh, cool—-that could very well be it! Perhaps due north of the pole, that would indeed be a “giant step!” I could not see much of what was around the pole on any image I found on line. The pole does sit in a sort of lawn-y area–no flower beds that I could see–so that might just be a good location! And in the late 80’s, in this park, the area was sort of neglected–not patrolled or too secure–it would have been (maybe!) an ideal place to dig a hole without causing any undue reaction. The reason I think this is the giant pole is that the pole looks like a mast, not just any old pole. This verse could also explain why there aren’t a lot of directions to a really specific place–you would only need a compass to find true north, and that would be a very small area to dig in.  We need a digger in NYC!! (Hope the team is doing well this year!)

I found some good history on the Colman Dock pier clock tower in Seattle.  I don’t know if any clock was present in 1980, but in 1912 the clock was knocked into the water by the Alameda, the cruise ship collided with the dock at full speed and sunk the Telegraph, a steamferry which was tied to the dock.  In 1976 the rusty salvage of the clock, lost for over 40 years was found in a warehouse and was restored and placed back at the pier in 1984.  It’s an eventful bit of history and I wonder if BP drew from that, placing a pier clock in the window panel even though there wasn’t one actually at the pier at the time.
Anyone know if there was any other clock tower in the Washington Ferry area in 1980?

shecrab

Okay–so how do we make Verse 10 fit? Well, we don’t.
Here’s where you’ll have to take a leap of faith.
I think this Image should be paired up with Verse 7.
At stone wall’s door the air smells sweet:
It would. Castle Clinton is basically a big stone wall, with flowers and gardens around it. The fresh sea air would be a constant counterpoint to the stuffy city atmosphere. Battery
Park
has always been a famous place to “take the air” in NYC.
Not far away, high posts are three
Education and Justice for all to see.
The 3 “high posts” would be the three places where monuments speak of education and justice: The Statue of Liberty on Liberty Island, The immigration museum on Ellis Island, and the Coast Guard on Governor’s Island. In addition, “justice” could be served by the use of Castle Williams (on GI) as a prison for many many years.
Sounds from the sky near ace is high
Again, the Coast Guard had their base nearby–and there were many “aces” in the squadrons. There was a small airport there on GI.
Running north, but first across
Battery
Park
is north of these things that were already mentioned–and “first across” could mean the ferry, which runs North-South
In jewel’s direction
the jewel’s direction would be, then, NORTH. NOT on Governor’s Island, but in Battery
Park
.
Is an object of Twain’s attention.
Oh, yes there is. The Player’s Club is NORTH of the
park
–and Mark Twain FOUNDED IT along with Edwin Booth. Certainly an object of his attention.
Now comes the hard part. I found the Giant Pole.  It’s here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mandaroak/4495692010/
But, I don’t know about the Giant Step–but I’m assuming it’s somewhere near the pole. I have not been able to find a lot of good pics of Battery
Park
that show the whole place, especially around the spar-pole. I really think there needs to be someone to walk the place and see in person.
Okay—I know this is a little radical, but a lot of it fits together. The image fits, the verse fits. And the location would have been ideal then, and still is. It’s not
central
Park
, and it’s not Ellis Island–both of which we have been told were NOT locations. It’s not as problematic as Verse 10 with it’s “hard word” and V and Isle of B It would free up Verse 10 to be used in Canada–I’ve always liked Niagara Falls as a location for that one.  Or there could be yet another location in New York state–it’s not out of the question.
Your thoughts?

Now this is the 3rd verse that may fit battery
Park
.
Thanks Shecrab.  More to work with.  Thats a good thing.  On the downer side, i dont have any time now to treasure hunt.  I run a travel softball club, working, and  3kids to run around for, it’s tough.  As soon as something opens up I will post what I find.  I will say this though, the giant pole has concrete around it, maybe 24 ft in diameter.  Giant step? 12 in. small step? 12 ft giant step?

shecrab

Okay–so how do we make Verse 10 fit? Well, we don’t.
Here’s where you’ll have to take a leap of faith.
I think this Image should be paired up with Verse 7.
At stone wall’s door the air smells sweet:
It would. Castle Clinton is basically a big stone wall, with flowers and gardens around it. The fresh sea air would be a constant counterpoint to the stuffy city atmosphere. Battery Park has always been a famous place to “take the air” in NYC.
Not far away, high posts are three
Education and Justice for all to see.
The 3 “high posts” would be the three places where monuments speak of education and justice: The Statue of Liberty on Liberty Island, The immigration museum on Ellis Island, and the Coast Guard on Governor’s Island. In addition, “justice” could be served by the use of Castle Williams (on GI) as a prison for many many years.
Sounds from the sky near ace is high
Again, the Coast Guard had their base nearby–and there were many “aces” in the squadrons. There was a small airport there on GI.
Running north, but first across
Battery Park is north of these things that were already mentioned–and “first across” could mean the ferry, which runs North-South
In jewel’s direction
the jewel’s direction would be, then, NORTH. NOT on Governor’s Island, but in Battery Park.
Is an object of Twain’s attention.
Oh, yes there is. The Player’s Club is NORTH of the park–and Mark Twain FOUNDED IT along with Edwin Booth. Certainly an object of his attention.
Now comes the hard part. I found the Giant Pole.  It’s here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mandaroak/4495692010/
But, I don’t know about the Giant Step–but I’m assuming it’s somewhere near the pole. I have not been able to find a lot of good pics of Battery Park that show the whole place, especially around the spar-pole. I really think there needs to be someone to walk the place and see in person.
Okay—I know this is a little radical, but a lot of it fits together. The image fits, the verse fits. And the location would have been ideal then, and still is. It’s not central Park, and it’s not Ellis Island–both of which we have been told were NOT locations. It’s not as problematic as Verse 10 with it’s “hard word” and V and Isle of B It would free up Verse 10 to be used in Canada–I’ve always liked Niagara Falls as a location for that one.  Or there could be yet another location in New York state–it’s not out of the question.
Your thoughts?

Now this is the 3rd verse that may fit battery Park.
Thanks Shecrab.  More to work with.  Thats a good thing.  On the downer side, i dont have any time now to treasure hunt.  I run a travel softball club, working, and  3kids to run around for, it’s tough.  As soon as something opens up I will post what I find.  I will say this though, the giant pole has concrete around it, maybe 24 ft in diameter.  Giant step? 12 in. small step? 12 ft giant step?

How do we know for sure that Image 5 and Verse 12 go together, if we don’t know who found it? Is there a newspaper article or something that confirms this?

JRock…..The Handful sounds great!
Ordering my copy of Palmistry from Amazon.
Got any upcoming gigs in NJ?
Mexicali Blues? Etc.
PM me.

Unknown

Unknown:
How do we know for sure that Image 5 and Verse 12 go together, if we don’t know who found it? Is there a newspaper article or something that confirms this?

you mean for Chicago?
The publisher confirmed it at one point.

I’m thinking the thematic overtones of this picture involve a sense of gravity. The woman is floating/defying gravity. She has a few water drops floating with her. The word “drop” taken in a different sense implies gravity.

Been there, done that.
Siskel and I went to all of the possible matches of Russian Orthodox churches in NYC and Brooklyn.  There was no place you could stand where you could even come close to matching the skyline in Image 12.  The closest match I ever saw was a church in Vancouver.
As for the eagle, it looks good, but it is not a match.

hey guys, what about the church boogieman found in Bayonne, New Jersey?  Forest_blight posted pictures of it on page 15 of this thread. have u seen that one egbert, or been to it? it’s the st. peter and Paul orthodox church on 98 w 28th street, bayonne, new jersey.

Still wondering how the eagle postdates the park….
meanwhile on the other side of town..
I see skyline potential as well as a near match for the stained glass… and right across from a park.

Still wondering how the eagle postdates the
park
….
meanwhile on the other side of town..
I see skyline potential as well as a near match for the stained glass… and right across from a
park
.

The angle of the dangle is inversely proportional to the heat of the beat.
I’m kinda liking the angle on this dangle…

nope you’re correct eagle dates from 63.
I swear somebody posted this eagle b4 and it then said it either was moved or placed later.
but I guess I am wrong…

Merlot Brougham

Personally, it will be difficult to sway me from the Ferry Building on Ellis Island as the match for the Image 12 bird, particularly when you put it together with the context of the other clues in the image

The immigration station on Ellis island was closed in 1954 The museum on Ellis island was not open to the public until 1990. Does that mean the island was off-limits to the public from 1954-1990?  The south side of the island is currently off-limits.
In 1970-81 could you even get to ellis island?

maltedfalcon

The immigration station on Ellis island was closed in 1954 The museum on Ellis island was not open to the public until 1990. Does that mean the island was off-limits to the public from 1954-1990?   The south side of the island is currently off-limits.
In 1970-81 could you even get to ellis island?

http://nutfieldgenealogy.blogspot.com/2 … -1975.html

I found no photos from my trip there in the spring of 83, but I remember being there and having lots of restrictions.  It was closed with scaffolds the summer of 86 when I took the Staten Island Ferry close enough to take some pics from around the bay.
I think the fact that the bird is so similar to the Ellis bird is a huge step forward.  The natural inclination would be to think the casque is very close to where that detailed visual is found, but everything about burying something on Ellis seems wrong, which poses a new question: why use THOSE eagles?
I suspect there’s an intrinsic connection to be found that has to do with the whole process of being a tourist, buying a ferry ticket, and visiting a historic monument.  The Ellis Island Ferry may have been Preiss’ closest to home template to build that particular portion of his visual puzzle for the purpose of inference.

i always thought the National Park Service, operated liberty and ellis
found this, now NPS works with The Statue of Liberty-Ellis Island Foundation (SOLEIF)
In 1982, President Ronald Reagan asked Lee Iacocca,to head a private sector effort to raise funds for the
restoration and preservation of the Statue of Liberty and Ellis Island
July 4th weekend, 1986, saw a gala three-day event celebrating the restoration.
When the Island opened in September of 1990–two years ahead of schedule
http://www.ellisisland.org/EIinfo/about.asp

boogieman, maybe the domes do cause a map, i’ve tried to do that with the outline of the bird and claws,  but i still think the colors play a part for the subway system.
this video explains the system, but it’s still greek (or roman ) to me.  but with the gray, and dark gray and purple lines, and the domes are blue and the background is in dark gray
http://www.youtube.com/user/mtainfo#p/u/1/yZ83UhBJFP0
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/e … way-4D.svg
i always just had someone telling where to go and where to get off  (lol)  when i was on a subway, no experience riding one by myself or reading the maps
wells, i’m not so sure if it’s a religious or just roman classical look in the image, i do like the image on the booth theatre that mikmaq  found, but thinking it is more for architectural design, maybe……
hope everyone has a good turkey week!

wk

It is Prospect Park. I tried fitting the outline of the park over the shadows on the body and it matches the clothes.
{img}

I can’t really see the park in the shadows on her dress, and your outline seems to be taking quite a few liberties as a match; but, your thoughts made me look at the shadows in the picture again. Perhaps we are looking in the shadows to find the coordinates. I’d say that’s a 75 in her dress, and her hands look as though they could be signing 4 and an 0.
I do like Prospect Park, and there are definitely interesting ways to apply different parts of V10 (e.g., the Moore bust, rhapsodic soil, ocean ave, east dr, etc.). There is one spot I like a lot, near the east wood arch:
http://goo.gl/maps/kBekL

wk

It is Prospect
Park
. I tried fitting the outline of the
park
over the shadows on the body and it matches the clothes.
{img}

I can’t really see the
park
in the shadows on her dress, and your outline seems to be taking quite a few liberties as a match; but, your thoughts made me look at the shadows in the picture again. Perhaps we are looking in the shadows to find the coordinates. I’d say that’s a 75 in her dress, and her hands look as though they could be signing 4 and an 0.
I do like Prospect
Park
, and there are definitely interesting ways to apply different parts of V10 (e.g., the Moore bust, rhapsodic soil, ocean ave, east dr, etc.). There is one spot I like a lot, near the east wood arch:
http://goo.gl/maps/kBekL

Your darker photo on the right makes it even more obvious.
Anyway, there are also other confirmations like the Long Meadow and the lake.

Thanks Rabbit.  I’ll certainly keep her in mind.
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The boogie is back
thought we lost you for good. Welcome back my friend. You sure have A LOT to catch up on

Is everyone completely sold on Verse 10 being new york? I thought there was some discussion about Verse 6 being NYC as the reference to Edwin Booth, has anyone looked at Gramercy Park for visuals?

decibalnyc

Is everyone completely sold on Verse 10 being new york? I thought there was some discussion about Verse 6 being NYC as the reference to Edwin Booth, has anyone looked at Gramercy Park for visuals?

I’m not sold on NYC being V10, but I am sold on Charleston being V6.

Deuce

I’m thinking Ellis Island as shady as it would seem to dig there. With the solved locations the visual clues were pretty close to the casque site. If the gargoyle is indeed a match, which i think it is, then how in 1982 would we find the gargoyle unless we went to the island to see it. It would be out of the way and redundant if it weren’t the correct place to end up anyways. I just can’t imagine going all the way there just to get a clue and then saying ‘ok cool now lets get back to main land’.

I’m gonna lean more toward #2, but without any need for justification in the final location other than marking a famous point in a city…
Chicago and Cleveland matched a building exactly in detail, but the verse did not mention them at all. These exact details were simply a point of confirmation.
Perhaps the “door” and the gargoyle are just two pieces giving exact detail of a confirmative location. Do any of the verses implicate digging directions at the island in any way, or is this a clue we only get from the image?
I tend to think this is the same with the montreal pic… just because the legeater matches exactly, doesn’t lend to any interpretation of the verses as a spot you should be digging at. It’s simply a clue of the city given only by the image… the verse makes no mention.

I agree. I just think its strange to go to the island just to get a clue that you’re near the correct (other) location.
However, the land east of Ellis looks like prime digging area. Not sure how it looked in 82.

What if the water tower in Chicago was part of the concept for how to recognize the final coordinating features that point at the dig spot?  I don’t have a visual on hand to say for sure, but I’m strongly theorizing that there was a water feature, a pipe down, that worked to that effect.  A water pipe and a water tower are comparative.
What about the Terminal Tower would play a role in the final spot by a monolithic wall with Greek names?  Is it that a wall represents a border between two countries, boundary = terminus or end?
So in this case, the Eagle and Lady Liberty may both be the iconics that follow to the final dig spot.  Is it correct to say they represent freedom and independance?  That might work for the Daughters of the American Revolution location or any proximity to an American Flag.

Deuce

I agree. I just think its strange to go to the island just to get a clue that you’re near the correct (other) location.
However, the land east of Ellis looks like prime digging area. Not sure how it looked in 82.

This is why I mentioned the distances from the iconic buidlings earlier… up to 4.6 miles is already shown. The area east is Liberty State
Park
.

Deuce

I agree. I just think its strange to go to the island just to get a clue that you’re near the correct (other) location.
However, the land east of Ellis looks like prime digging area. Not sure how it looked in 82.

This is why I mentioned the distances from the iconic buidlings earlier… up to 4.6 miles is already shown. The area east is Liberty State Park.

I understand. But don’t you find it strange to have to go to Ellis just to get a clue? You’ll have to book a trip over. And what tells you to go there? I understand the inlet in the image referencing Ellis but why go all the way there to get a clue to somewhere else? That’s out of the way and a waste of time only to find the eagle. I don’t know. You have the block AND the eagle. Two clues to the same spot tells me that’s it. The eagle only or the block only? Ok that would possibly say its NEAR Ellis. But two clues? Come on!

Deuce

I understand. But don’t you find it strange to have to go to Ellis just to get a clue?

Yes, that would be very strange. The cask isn’t where we want it to be, it’s where the clues point.

Merlot Brougham

The cask isn’t where we want it to be, it’s where the clues point.

More specifically, the verse.

.

Egbert

Lastly, take a look at her robes.  The sleeve on the left appears to have a shape that is relevant.  It “pops out” of the picture, and is trying to blend in with the rest of the robe.  I believe we will find that symbol near the treasure.

Egbert

Although the sign
Nearby
Speaks of Indies native
Probably a reference to Alexander Hamilton, a native of the West Indies.

I still like Fort Hamilton High School, which ticks both those boxes.

Glossiphoniidae

More specifically, the verse.

Absolutely. I’ve no doubt the eagle is from Ellis, but the images take their clues from a search area of variable size. In NO it includes City
Park
, Lafayette Square and Armstrong
Park
. In Image 12 it includes Ellis Island, Bedloe’s Island, and Fort Hamilton High.

Glossiphoniidae

More specifically, the verse.

Absolutely. I’ve no doubt the eagle is from Ellis, but the images take their clues from a search area of variable size. In NO it includes City Park, Lafayette Square and Armstrong Park. In Image 12 it includes Ellis Island, Bedloe’s Island, and Fort Hamilton High.

Deuce

Agreed and always agreed. Just saying… Why put a major clue in a hard to reach place when all that clue tells you is ‘you’re close’. It’s like putting a clue on top of a mountain that says the site is at the bottom of the mountain.

I was 100% agreeing with you. I was just saying that as a general statement because I know that most people would wish the cask to be buried somewhere other than Ellis Island. We can’t will the cask to a new location in spite of the clues just because they point to a rather “inconvenient” place, such as Ellis Island.

Glossiphoniidae

More specifically, the verse.

Agreed and always agreed. Just saying… Why put a major clue in a hard to reach place when all that clue tells you is ‘you’re close’. It’s like putting a clue on top of a mountain that says the site is at the bottom of the mountain.

Does anyone have any idea what Ellis Island was like in the early 80s? It was probably easier to dig there 30 years ago than it is today, just for security reasons.

The resolution isn’t great but it does a good job to compare the proportions of the image outline with that of the window of the Selby Abbey.  I just chanced upon this when using the keyword ‘selby’.  The historical connection to George Washington and the original elements of the US Flag are interesting.
http://www.selbyabbey.org.uk/washington_link.htm

Fwiw, I’m still enthusiastic/fanatical about Verse 9 going with this image. Seattle’s Alki Point Statue of Liberty in connection with the RusALKI Fair Folk puzzle making use of a British poet reference to acknowledge the stalemate/frozen fire/standoff between US army (green/base) and British on nearby San Juan Island.

dellucc

I’m having a problem navigating between verse and image. Do I have it correct that Image 12 was matched with verse 10?
I just matched Image 12 to verse 6, but my notes are they are already matched to another. Verse 6 points directly to Gramercy park. Who and why made the initial matches? I cannot find the page at this time.

Right dellucc. There are still obviously doubts, but many believe that V6 has MORE connection to Chas than NY because of the Edwin/Edwina quote in “Abroad in America”.
Also, the Booth statue may (see what I did? lol) have “1913” on it, but the USS Maine’s Capstan in Chas does too. Plus, Edwin Booth only had a daughter, named Edwina, I believe. Of course that gets into the argument of how the line is read…
“Edwin and Edwina named after him”
-read as one line, implying that two people, Edwin and Edwina were both named after “him”
“Edwin(,) and Edwina named after him”
-read with a separation, so that the line talks about the subject, Edwin, having one person, Edwina, named after “him”.
So, full circle…

The comma can be very important…
like in the title of the book…
“Eats, Shoots and Leaves” by Lynne Truss

animal painter

The comma can be very important…
like in the title of the book…
“Eats, Shoots and Leaves” by Lynne Truss

Hah AP-it sure does!
And that’s not even adding in the line breaks!

I’m having a problem navigating between verse and image. Do I have it correct that Image 12 was matched with verse 10?
I just matched Image 12 to verse 6, but my notes are they are already matched to another. Verse 6 points directly to Gramercy park. Who and why made the initial matches? I cannot find the page at this time.

Well that post brought me to the here. Gramersy Park fits, Booths( father of Edwina) statue was erected May 1913.

animal painter

The comma can be very important…
like in the title of the book…
“Eats, Shoots and Leaves” by Lynne Truss

I like cooking my family and my pets.