phrabbott

Why is this convo happening in the V10 thread? Did I miss some new fangled connection of verses now?

just replying to a previous quote.

phrabbott

Why is this convo happening in the V10 thread? Did I miss some new fangled connection of verses now?

lost

Pass two friends of octave (Octave Chanute) lower case

@rabidrabbit was discussing capitalization of certain words and what that means (including the thought that it refers to a proper noun)
Several posts later
While he didn’t explain, I think what he was trying to illustrate is that – in an altogether different verse – most people interpret the (lower case) octave reference as being Octave Chanute – a friend of the Wright Brothers. And that would be a case where a word that should be a proper noun and thus capitalized was not.
Then an argument broke out about how many Blue Men are in an octave. (I may have zoned out for a bit)…

Ah. Thanks! Definitely missed that and ya, as octave isn’t capitalized it
would
be very off brand to be a proper noun. My whole approach has been drawn into question! I hate Verse 10 I’m going back to verse 5 for image 12 haha.

Kang

rabidrabbit, I REALLY like where you’re going with this. Your method of arriving at the answer would seem to rely on correct interpretation of your founding assumptions – some of which are below.
Just trying to be helpful as I’d like you to arrive at your correct answer. So you may want to consider the following. If the hints in the Japanese book are correct and to be believed, the “R” may not refer to Roosevelt.
Clues from the Japanese book: (as heard in the audio of the translation conversation kindly posted by burnstyle).
“M and B” – These are the initials of two people. I asked Mr Preiss, what do they do, and he said both of them are very famous song composers.
“Congress” – When I asked Mr Preiss, he said that this is a proper noun.
“R / L” – This R and L are also referring to people.
According to Preiss, R and L refer to one person, and it’s a critical politician.
R = popular interpretation seems to be that this is a reference to Roosevelt. But that doesn’t quite fit the Japanese book clue as Lincoln and Roosevelt are different people.
An interpretation that might be a better fit:
R = Republican. A Republican would be ‘known’ to Congress. Lincoln was certainly a critical politician and the first Republican President and thus L and R refer to a single person.
So – are the Japanese hints accurate? No idea. If they are, Republican would seem a better fit. Not sure if that alters/expands your thinking at all about your method, just throwing it out there so you can decide. Good luck and Happy Hunting!

Kang—
Thnx for the encouragement.
i’ve had a couple of PMs —both positive and negative— commenting on what I’ve tried to do with my public post.
In a nutshell, there are a couple of STANDARD RULES that can be gleaned from the verses, but I’m afraid my explanations in the public post are kinda crummy. And there are a few typos which need corrections.
I’ll rewrite and post over the weekend for comment.
Of course the RULES I see my just be coincidence (or even typos on the original pages) — But my (another) close study of the verse can’t hurt.
QUESTION:
Has it been confirmed that BP was a Brooklyn, NY native?
This fact doesn’t effect my solution, but does effect how one may approach the puzzles.
Thnx.

This is where to dig.  Just can’t figure the v and how it got us there.

The preposition “of” begins three of the lines of this verse. It could’ve been Preiss’ intention or subtle hint for the Dutch word “van” which means “of”.
“Cars abound” might also be translated into the word “van”, short for “caravan” which can be a covered wagon or several vehicals, people, or animals in a series, e.g. a caravan crossing the desert.
This verse is begging to fit Vancouver. Ever since the legeater discovery in Montreal or interest in Image12 as a NY location, nobody has given Vancouver a second thought.

Correction, it wasnt Egbert who first identified the 3 slab Harding memorial, it was johann back in Feb 2005. Egbert was just supporting the idea. I want to be sure to credit the right person, just in case…
viewtopic.php?f=32&t=728&p=21520&hilit=Harding#p21520

erexere

The preposition “of” begins three of the lines of this verse. It could’ve been Preiss’ intention or subtle hint for the Dutch word “van” which means “of”.
“Cars abound” might also be translated into the word “van”, short for “caravan” which can be a covered wagon or several vehicals, people, or animals in a series, e.g. a caravan crossing the desert.
This verse is begging to fit Vancouver. Ever since the legeater discovery in Montreal or interest in Image12 as a NY location, nobody has given Vancouver a second thought.

Show me some map coordinates in an image that come anywhere close to Vancouver.

Merlot Brougham

Show me some map coordinates in an image that come anywhere close to Vancouver.

Why assume there needs to be Vancouver coords or that the lack thereof is a way of contesting my findings based on some verse interpretation for the Netherlander opal?

erexere

Why assume there needs to be Vancouver coords or that the lack thereof is a way of contesting my findings based on some verse interpretation for the Netherlander opal?

So unlike every other image with numbers that are clearly city coordinates, Image 9’s numbers are deliberately bogus and misleading? I don’t subscribe.

well sure is one thing,
but until we actually use a verse to find a casque
for instance,
in the northwest corner of Golden Gate Park there stands a large grey windmill its arms extend over many slender paths
I believe in the summer they actually used to let the windmill spin which might make a whirring noise.
lots of cars there at the intersection of Fulton and Great Highway
lots of possibilities for natives of Indies
I just never could find an Isle of B
if someone can think of an Isle of B this one could also then fit SF

oh the other thing that this one also makes me think of
When I think of Summer and whirring sound
I think Cicadas
Although I live  in CA now
I lived on the east coast during the last 2 17 year cicada cycles and you people living there now have my sympathies.
but even though the cicada cycle is peaking now in the summer there are usually always some cicadas out…
That would make this an east coast verse (if the whirring sound is cicadas)

I live about 1.5 miles from FH HS and can go there and take pictures if anyone wants. The construction in the area across the school is still there, but it seems like the tree everyone’s talking about is just outside the construction area?

erexere

This is an interesting find, again looking at Granada, CO.  There is a map engraved on a wood plank that shows how the houses were arranged in lettered blocks.  Comparing that with an aerial and extrapolating out to the memorial stone where I just based some sun shadow observations actually fits perfectly with the last two lines of verse:
Or gaze north
Toward the isle of B.
The red arrow is pointing north, notice the B-Block, is this the B-Aisle?

Just to be clear, I did manipulate the image to add three additional blocks “D C B” to show that extrapolating and using the E F G H that’s already there to discover that the “B” aisle isn’t any stretch of the imagination, it simply maps out.  I kind of like this area, but it really does bother me that it’s far from any port area.  The area has everything to do with immigration however, so it has it’s considerations.
I’ve been hot onto looking up Solar Charts and placing shadow positions lately.  I just worked with this image as a 6pm on the Summer Solstice.  Both of these are assumptions only and based on the line in verse “In Summer” and the 6pm vs 6am is still open for discussion.  The many moons in the sky, what twelve or so, really put this at a twilight or sunrise time.  I’ll next look at the 6am shadow and see where that leads.  I don’t know if either am or pm work for the Pearl Harbor date as far as usable Sun goes.

also, you know full well you have me blocked lol.

I’ve found the Elek Imredy statue mistaken for the Dutch Mermaid that sits on Douglas Brown’s isle to be a good candidate for being gazed upon. It sits north of the natural position from where it would be viewed. B. For Brown is simple enough. I think its a difficult clue to ascertain, but something designed to be encountered by those visiting tourists or appreciated by locals looking deeper into their own landscape and bothering to read or visit Vancouver’s Maritime Museum. I liked how this information survived to make it into this bloggers article,
http://activerain.trulia.com/blogsview/ … anley-park
I wonder if Stanley Park itself might be candidate for having the shape of the pixelated blob (image 9) when seen on a map.

I wonder if a good lead might be to consider the “Hard word” something about “Hard Alcohol”.  Perhaps the choice of words “in 3 Vol.” is to suggest the “Volstead Act”.
What think we?

Unknown

Unknown:
I always expected Him of Hard word to be pointing to an author.

I’ve thought the same thing. The fact that Hard was capitalized made me think that it was part of a title. The only thing I’ve come up with is Hard Times by Charles Dickens which was written as 3 volumes (it was released one volume at time through his periodical). The only statue of Dickens in the world is in Philly but Egbert has said that BP didn’t think he put one there. Dickens came to the US several times and saw Boston, NYC, St Louis, Montrael among other cities so there may be a connection to one of those.

Am I going out on a limb to include the following when considering the lines
find the arm that extends over the slender path
?
If we can consider the arm motions as a YMCA, I can find one extending over the slender path.

Very nice find, Merlot.
I have searched and searched for any type of plaque or monument mentioning Charles Dickens in New York, but I have come up with nothing so far.
There are plenty of writings about him, and one of the more famous biographies of Dickens is John Forster’s “The Life of Charles Dickens.”  I am mentioning it because it was published in 3 Volumes.
http://www.gutenberg.org/files/25851/25851-h/25851-h.htm
http://www.amazon.com/Life-Charles-Dickens-I-III-Complete-ebook/dp/B001COV1HY
However, John Forster is not a native of New York.  So, although it fits “…still speak of him of Hard word in 3 Vols.,” it does not jibe with “the natives…”
The only other thing I can think of, as a connection, is the New York Public Library, but that is a stretch.

Here’s another Indies native in lower Manhattan:

Egbert

It could also refer to how much space is taken up by something – so maybe there are 3 containers of something in the area.

Also, think about how you would properly write out the volume of something. Such and such cubic liters or liters cubed…. liters3.

Liters^3

Unknown

Unknown:
It was on the train, with its steely rhythms, its rattle-ty bang, that is so often so stimulating to a composer – I frequently hear music in the very heart of the noise… And there I suddenly heard, and even saw on paper – the complete construction of the Rhapsody, from beginning to end. No new themes came to me, but I worked on the thematic material already in my mind and tried to conceive the composition as a whole. I heard it as a sort of musical kaleidoscope of America, of our vast melting pot, of our unduplicated national pep, of our metropolitan madness. By the time I reached Boston I had a definite plot of the piece, as distinguished from its actual substance.

I’ve been ignoring a possibly crucial idea that the “rhapsodic man” is anyone else but Gershwin.  I thought I’d sidestep the obvious choice in favor of a more root understanding of the word rhapsody, which is why I thought the enthusiastic expression with arms raised of the Lord Stanley statue in Vancouver might be it.
In reevaluation I’m taking a moment to look more closely at the Gershwin idea.  According to his biography, Gershwin shared how the Rhapsody in Blue came to him,
So it was “on the train, with it’s steely rhythms.”  Does this allow us to substitute “Railroad” for “Rhapsodic man”?  I consider this idea because it is consistent with a result I’ve gained from exploring the Lumberman’s Arch in Stanley Park.  The plaque there explains the history of how a previous arch once stood in the park after being relocated from the intersection of streets Pender and Hamilton.  It turns out that the intersection of Pender and Hamilton is the west corner of Victory Square which is bound by
P
ender street and Highway
7
a.  This P and 7, including the normal map perspective of the intersection actually match the square with X icon in image 9.  It even matches with respect to Pender being a 4-lane two-way street and Hamilton being a narrow single-lane one-way street and that the X shape in it’s orientation shows a thick line and thin line also corresponding to this observation.
Now consider what significance this site has, if any, to anything to do with Gershwin or the Railroad.  The site of Victory Square is actually quite significant for being owned by the CPR, George Stephen’s Railroad -remember, it’s his home which has the LegEater lamp.  L.A. Hamilton drove the first survey stake in the north corner of Victory Square establishing the city boundary between the Grainville Townsite and the CPR Townsite and signified the terminus of the Montreal based Railway.
That establishes the soil rights of the railroad, but of Gershwin I can only see that Victory Square and it’s Cenotaph memorial with WW1 steel helmets which look just like the one worn by the Centuar was established in April of the year 1924, only a couple months after Gershwin’s Rhapsody in Blue was performed in February, 1924.
I’m considering the line where you take twice as many steps as the hour from the middle of a branch of the v.  If we take “V” for victory, then we have a clear choice for using the Victory Square cenotaph as the marker.  It has 3 paths leading from it’s center.  Two paths lead into the street bounding the northern sides but one path leads southwest into the park and just around 60ft up a small flight of steps there’s a retaining wall with a tree and then a grassy hill.  I’ve been working with the idea that one piece of this puzzle involves the 9 o’clock Gun which actually aims in this direction from the eastern tip of Stanley Park.  I’ll look into whether it actually aims directly at this site, that would be cool.  So if the name of that historical artifact is what we use to determine “the hour”, then we are looking at twice 9, or 18 steps or more.  If a step is about 3 feet, then we’re looking at 3×18= 54 feet.  I’m only estimating here, but 54ft is comparably close to 60ft.  I wonder if I’m finally piecing this together.
This is a mind blowing thing to consider, but it first requires everyone to put aside the notion that the Legeater is the primary indicator of location.  I believe it has it’s place in this solution, but it doesn’t indicate location or proximity for the casque.  Granted, it is a good assumption based on the Cleveland and Chicago solves.  I think it’s solely important for realizing the significance of the 1881 CP Railway.  The next step is picking up on the theme of “end to end” or “connecting the east to the west”, that being Montreal to Vancouver.  The first train to perform the transcontinental task was the No.374, which is why it was chosen as the model for a miniature train established in Stanley Park.  I have a suspicion that it’s very possible that the historical significance of the CPR in Vancouver might’ve resulted in a photograph or painting of the Mount Stephen Club being viewable somewhere like the miniature train station or in a Pavillion or museum space nearby.  This is similar to my experience when I stop by a pizza house or bagel shop on the west coast and see a wall sized photograph of New York City.  The Mount Stephen Club does look pretty sharp as a photograph, so I don’t think it’s out of the question.
Some changes have been made to the pathways of this site, but I don’t think it has interfered with the casque which might be at this location.  In my haste, I drew the contours of the main path curving in the wrong direction, but you can see an early photo to make the mental adjustment.  The yellow line represents about 18 or more steps.

Mister EZ

It’s not like we can zombify BP or hold a seance

Wow check out this guy’s negativity, I bet you didn’t even try either of these ideas before dismissing them.

drunknerds

Wow check out this guy’s negativity, I bet you didn’t even try either of these ideas before dismissing them.

I’m leaning towards reanimation…

animal painter

After Hurricane Sandy, we may find it even more difficult to recognize landmarks in NY…

True. But it also makes it easier to get away with traversing city parks with a shovel and a city-worker type reflective-orange jacket
. Digging might not appear the be that extraordinary either.
On a similar note, this makes it a good time to be looking for “
me sweet stuffed animal type friend
” too.

Can someone direct me to the email where Preiss said the treasure was not in Central Park?
I have quite a few clues that point there or close to there.

boogieman

BP reponded three diffrent times about NY locations.  Nothing in Central Park, the Statue of Liberty (or Liberty Island), and this one on point, Ground Zero.  I assume that his ***not so*** came after the other two.
Why
wouldn’t he just say ***get out of NY***?  He gave up Canada, Houston, and St Louis for us.  I think one has to believe here, with the history of his contacts, that his ambiguity surrounding NYC is about not handing anyone the shovel to dig.  Afterall, his office was located on 25th Street, Midtown Manhattan, and born and raised a Brooklynite…..Image12 has the Statue of Liberty, Two WTC, and the Verrazano Bridge.  You can tinker with the verses, but the image belongs to NY.

Here you go, Rockhunter…
————————————————-
From:
To:
Subject: Re: Sorry to bother you.
Sent: Sunday, May 23, 2004 8:08 PM
there is no treasure in central park

Great Idea, hard words = written in stone or metal
3 vol = 3 plaques….
definitely something to keep an eye out for…

But who is the “him” of Hard word?

while researching pic-1 and v-7, i ran across this, maybe this is what bp is saying,
when he says,……….The natives still speak  Of him of Hard word in 3 Vols.
prob not coit tower..though columbus is there, cant read sign
hard word in three vols
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jimmyrowla … 1/sizes/l/

forest_blight

But who is the “him” of Hard word?

Speaks of Indies native, yes a bad thing not known if west or east, indies native
looked up east indies most refer to, the dutch east indies, that may help with p-9

Native Americans were once called “indies” as well.  I should have saved that tidbit.  It was on page 30 something of a google search.

The natives still remember him of Hard word in 3 Vols.
Which natives? Why would they remember him? Was he one of their own, a leader, a speaker of words, a writer of a great set of books? We would only recognize such remembrance through a plaque, historic marker, memorial or monument right?
Does this man have the word ‘Hard’ in his name? Harding? Hardy?
Was he a famous man who stuttered or had some other form of speech impediment?
How is a word Hard, or uniquely hard? Uncompromising? A curse? A judgement? Having the characteristic of stone, metal, or alkaline in pH? Man…what a riddle.
My favorite idea so far is the time Teddy Roosevelt continued to give a 90 minute speech after being shot in the chest in Milwaukee. His speech, folded in his breast pocket helped absorb the impact. “It takes more than that to kill a bull moose.” Who would argue that being bullet proof or hard to kill isnt Hard with a capital H?
Maybe the clue is simply a reference to a moose statue…again…what a riddle.

Wk
I’ve always thought that vertical line of dots was a crown if turned counterclockwise. Not sure what it means for sure. Figured maybe it’s a reference to tell us the “bear/lion” is part of a royal coat of arms or something. Or maybe pointing us to Kings or Queens in Brooklyn.

Deuce

Wk
I’ve always thought that vertical line of dots was a crown if turned counterclockwise. Not sure what it means for sure. Figured maybe it’s a reference to tell us the “bear/lion” is part of a royal coat of arms or something. Or maybe pointing us to Kings or Queens in Brooklyn.

ok. I will study the surf again. I was looking for patterns of trees in Prospect Park before the bear turned up, where there might be 4 trees that stand out in a row.
I also found a 1978 New York subway map
http://images.nycsubway.org/maps/calcag … system.gif
Prospect park seems to be a major junction on that map.
I am thinking the colours on the top row of panes in the window in image 12 possibly relate to the object in the pane below.
The stone mosaic effect to indicate underground. Then the maroon and cream colour not underground.

Deuce

Wk
I’ve always thought that vertical line of dots was a crown if turned counterclockwise. Not sure what it means for sure. Figured maybe it’s a reference to tell us the “bear/lion” is part of a royal coat of arms or something. Or maybe pointing us to Kings or Queens in Brooklyn.

Also as a side note… The top of a wave is called a crest. Could this part of the image mean a royal crest? Hmmmm.

wk

I also found a 1978 New York subway map
http://images.nycsubway.org/maps/calcag … system.gif
Prospect park seems to be a major junction on that map.
I am thinking the colours on the top row of panes in the window in image 12 possibly relate to the object in the pane below.
The stone mosaic effect to indicate underground. Then the maroon and cream colour not underground.

Some of the old stations, like on the 1 the 9, have old tiles. He could have been taking you on a subway hunt…is everything found so far subway accessible? Perhaps are they along the blue line (A,C,E) or the red line (1,9) If the subway has anything to do with it, I would bet the colors mean more than the design, but you have only blueish colors. It could be an old subway mosaic, but more likely a pattern in the ground…maybe that is the image clue to “Rhapsodic man’s soil” or just a visual indicator that you’re in the right spot. It’s helpful to find anything old…pictures, maps, etc… you may not see a purpose now, but later on when things make a little more sense…then they will come in handy trust me!

slappybuns

the right hand from the image looks like seward’s hand holding the quill (in madison square park)
http://www.waymarking.com/gallery/image … 7da89c7986

AnotherDoth

Page 62
, Preps Ghoul is posed in front of the Brooks Brothers Plaque at their flagship location on 346 Madison Avenue in New York, NY

More Rhapsodic men…
TS Eliot
(house in
St Louis
). Or
Frank O’Hara
. (
Madison Square Park
…? Just throwing it out there.)

“Indies native” is a sign referring to Alexander Hamilton. I pose this may either be Hamilton Grange (uptown) or Hamilton’s burial site (Trinity Church) or the Alexander Hamilton Customs House (which houses the National Museum of the American Indian – a nice tie in to the “Indies native” and “The natives.”
If the “grey giant” was the United Nations…
“In summer
You’ll often hear a whirring sound
Cars abound”
might be the cable cars to Roosevelt island.
Even though I can find rationale to place this in midtown east, I’m feeling battery park is most likely the place.

I always thought that “of hard word”
was the foreign translation (answer depends
upon the language of the naitves)
My thought being “Duras”  (isn’t that Hard in Spanish?)

I always thought “of hard word” meant that the Indies spoke ill of him.