The Lafayette Square Conservancy have a planting coming up on May 14th. If you dropped them an email maybe you could persuade them to dig in an extra caladium or two.  😉

slappybuns

ooooohhhh, from the “spanish” sign……….thanks
cw you ole pirate  🙂
i think egbert found it behind that big stonework, and it seems the back was like a hill, but i’m not sure, someone who has been there could tell us

slappy it was the greek garden,next to the italian garden so it says in the article and the verse said, (In a rectangular plot),and that is where egbert found it
at the wall, must be some difference i dont see between,rectangular plot,planter,flower bed,maybe flower beds that arent in a planter LOL
http://www.angelfire.com/dragon/egbert/secret.html
anyway seems like someone brought up,Gnomes and the NO saints once, ill check it out might be another lead,i like the jewels idea too
fixed a typo

hi all—-
I had put my thoughts for verse 2 in image 9 posting– but will put it here again for talk of other meanings of it.
at the place where jewels abound
fifteen rows down to the ground
in the middle of twenty-one
from end to end
only three stand watch
as the sound of friends
fills the afternoon hours
here is a sovereign people
who build palaces to shelter
their heads for a night!
gnomes admire
fays delight
the namesakes meeting
near this site.
IF the image 9 clues give us the mount stephen house as a starting point—this is how I think the verse fits—
at the place where jewels abound– because this is a wealthy home,(now club) many jewels could be here.– either as jewelry or just possessions in the place itself.
fifteen rows down to the ground— from the house go down the 15 steps
in the middle of twenty-one
from end to end————-this is what will give the exact location to dig– determined from the site itself.  it doesn’t look like there were ever 21 trees here or enough of those stone bases, so something else.
only three stand watch— I feel this is another link to the image 9.  the 3 legeaters on the lamp post.  if the 3 stand watch(from one side)– could there be 21 blocks(brick like)going back to the house above that one grassy patch?
as the sound of friends
fills the afternoon hours—- it is now a club, where you meet with friends
here is a sovereign people
who build palaces to shelter
their heads for a night!———–sovereign means elite/supreme— this area is known for the mansions they built to live in.– a night?– I think it just is that its their homes not museums or anything more.– like -‘these palaces were their homes!’
gnomes admire
fays delight———– just a gold reference mentioned by niteowl9?– for another link to image 9 with gold squares?
the namesakes meeting
near this site.———this meeting place(club) is named after the once owner-stephen
I feel a lot of the verse is just confirming the house(or any place) as a starting location.  This verse doesn’t have many points to go in sequence.–just describes the surroundings or location known from the image.
sixer

Hard to put this v in Montreal, after all the St Lou stuff but got to keep this open.
gnomes admire
fays delight
the namesakes meeting
near this site.
Still think this is referencing more than one.  Gnomes, fays, and namesakes.  It’s almost like two teams, The Gnomes vs The Fays and they meet close to this leg-eater.
Another possibility is the Montreal Expos who played at the Olympic Stadium in Montreal from the 70’s until last year.  They are the namesakes of the Montreal Exposition of 67′.  How far is the stadium from Club Mount?
edit: Expos and Alouettes (were Concordes in 81’and 82′) played at Olympic.  Not far and can be seen from Mount royal Park.

Yeah I forgot that I adjusted my thinking about the Jazz walking tour itself. I haven’t looked at this one in quite awhile since I posted my solve.
The history of the Jazz walking tours have been around forever according to a friend who grew up in NOLA but didn’t become official Jazz tours until the mid 80s I believe. So as I thought more about it I’m more inclined to believe BP was talking about the row houses that go down St. Charles St from Lafayette Square. I haven’t been able to find any history on what has or has not been torn down over the last 30+ years.
For me though this line in the verse:
Fifteen rows down to the ground
simply refers to row houses…these could have been 15 rows on the St. Charles that went from Canal St down to the ground (Lafayette Square) or perhaps 15 rows on Camp Street. I just have no way to quantify 15 with so many changes over the years.

Unknown

Unknown:
THE THEATERS 300 & 400 blks. St. Charles and
Camp Sts. In the 19th and half of the 20th century, this
was New Orleans’ largest theater district. Now vanished,
they were the American Theater (Camp St. Theater), the
New American Theater, 3 consecutive St. Charles Theaters
(3rd aka the Orpheum), Academy of Music (Audubon
Theater), Regent (Joy Rio & Avenue), Lyceum, and Liberty

Unknown

Unknown:
ORPHEUM THEATER 129 University Place
The Orpheum Circuit Co. moved to this location in
1921. It was designed by nationally noted architect J.
Albert Lansberg, assisted by local architect
Sam Stone,
Jr. Conductor Emile Tosso’s Orpheum Symphony
Orchestra featured many jazz musicians, including
cornetist Johnny Dedroit. The later house band also
had jazz musicians including trumpeter Howard Reed,
trombonist Jac Assunto and saxophonist Al Gallodoro.

There are several theatres in the Lafayette District–it used to be known as THE theatre district in NO.
.
Note the name of the local architect–Sam Stone…..jewel = stone.
This is not the only place in this district he designed.
c

The idea I’m most comfortable with relates “in the middle of twenty-one” to the 60′ wide grass median on Basin street. I think Preiss counted out 21 paces (approx. 2.85′ per pace). Basically, the centerline of the grass is all he’s telling us with that.
I’m interested in the 2.85′ measurement because it may be useful in the other puzzles where paces are mentioned. 100 paces = approx 285 feet. 12 paces = approx 34 feet.

Bull.

What I find surprising is that this crazy old hunt seems to be the only one at Q4T with any activity.
We’re the last of the treasure seekers.

“And he’s off –>”
I can not comment on a solve that has no details.
If the clues fit the solve, then that is where it is.
As I said, I welcome someone to answer the questions
the verse poses and present a solve.
“The namesakes meeting near this site”
“Give me a name Senator, just one name.  This can all be over
now.  I need a name.”

Dang, Dang, Dang.
Big Pig on a Dig found squat.  Wrong kind of shovel for the earth though, but I must be missing some smaller clue.  I am at work, but plan to spend some slack time posting my pics and compiling the solves, hopefully today.  I would have bet money on it, but, alas, I would have been paying out.  I can get you within 10 Yards. of it, I am pretty sure, but again, there must be some small clue that I am missing.
I believe that the Casque is in Forest Park, in St. Louis Missiouri, just east of the Jewel Box.  The missing piece of the puzzle that clicked in for hyper verification was the statement “15 rows down to the ground”.  I believe either Wilhouse or Johanne made a post some time back alluding to the clock made out of roses that used to sit next to the Jewel box.  I finally pin-pointed where this used to be through photographs and a friends grandmother.  In the direction of the 3, which can either be taken as 15 minute mark, or 1500 hours millitary time, there are indeed, our 3 friends that stand watch in the middle of 21.  The ‘spin’ I put on it, although some of us have dug there before, is to try and get a little under the platform that the lamp post is on, thinking it might have been set back a bit.  Nothing in front, Nothing in the rear, and a case of the he-be-ge-be’s digging away with an officer on horseback booking past me at a full gallop.  Again, the rose clock is positioned perfectly for the original solve of the lamp post in the middle of the U shaped Vandeventer Gate, on which, there are 3 lions heads (at one point there were 4).  The ‘blob in the pic’ located on his left, your right, just underneath and right of the dog leg may hold a key.  This shape reflects a portion of the garden, at the apex which sat the rose clock.  The X or 10 oh his upper left, your upper right, chest may also have some meaning that I did not add in.  Well, sorry to get your hopes up, but my dream is shattered.  Doesn’t anyone have a ground penetrating radar we can borrow?  It could be anywhere there in a 100 square yard area, we could just be missing it.  The real problem with the site is that it used to be the east entrance to the worlds fair, and about 6″ down, there is this old surface that makes probing almost impossible, cause you hit something everywhere you try.  A method of probing to see where this surface has been broken up would almost make more logical sense than probing for a hard spot.  Who wants to rent a bob-cat with me, I need a look out.  Send all your left over fireworks to me, well put a charge on this puppy and let her rip.
Arg.  The sweet feeling of defeat.

spinner– Can you at least tell us the city?  If you want some assistance, please let us know.

Unknown

Unknown:
I think I have solved it.  I have used every clue available in both the picture and the verse, and it all fits.

Best of Luck Spinner.  When you find it–take loads of pictures!
What picture are you pairing with Verse 2?

http://www.quest4treasure.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=2919.0
Started a new topic for now, most of it is here, together, Image, Verse, and Solution.

Johann,
Is this what you are talking about?
http://stlouis.missouri.org/neighborhoods/history/grand/vandeventer12.htm

So George, add row 7 to your dig area!

Unknown

Unknown:
I tried hard to link the Mount Royal area of Montreal to this verse but it never seemed to really work. I believe they are still doing some work on the statue and that area right now but haven’t been by there in a couple weeks so i’m not sure.

Unknown

Unknown:
It will indeed remind you of a Dead concert on Sundays.  I’m really not sure about the shelters you mentioned as I have never noticed them.

The statue is still cordoned off, and the ground around it looks serious disturbed. There is a nearby row of old trees lining the street, but I don’t know if there are 21 from end to end. I drove up to the top of the Mount today – the view is terrific.
A product of wishful thinking, probably. Ah well, it was worth a try!

“From end to end”
Why this specification after in the middle
of twenty-one?
Because twenty-one is not a reference
to a spot but a collection of twenty-one things.
So, in the middle of twenty-one ends. (to ends)

Here is a sovereign people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their heads for a night!
Could just mean New Orleans.
Or just a a hotel
Gnomes admire
Fays delight
We have the Fays of France in the litany, otherwise
baffling.
Gnomes are Dutch and jewel is the opal . The opal looks like stained glass. So maybe a building with opal like stained glass.
A place that is important to Dutch and French. I don’t know of any in NOLA. Perhaps Montreal.
Namesakes meeting
Did Lafayette ever meet Jackson in new Orleans. Maybe it’s the literal spot they met in NO

Howardjthomas

Here is a sovereign people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their heads for a night!
Could just mean New Orleans.
Or just a a hote

Your logic has merit.
However I would argue that referencing the St Charles Hotel directly when one actually means to reference a different hotel, is the very definition of a red herring. And red herrings need to be obvious, otherwise they are just bad, intentionally misleading clues specifically designed to punish the well read. And if anything can be generally linked to Preiss’ mindset when making these puZzles, its that Preiss loved the well-read

I’m now finding it hard to deny BP had known of the quote. I didn’t know it was in printed copies of Bartlett . That said I’m debating what he was intending to convey with the quote. The gnome is what leads away from NO and to a hotel. I did not know of the quote when reading the verse the first few days and I thought hotel. It is a cool way to describe a hotel.

How did this go unnoticed till now. St.Mary park established in 1906 that is bound by jewels (N Diamond st and S Diamond). Before it was a park it was St.marys market established in the 1830s. It was one of many markets set up in the neutral grounds of NO. Malted could you check some historical areal not sure how much it has changed since 82 especially with the world’s fair in 84.
A park bound by jewels
https://imgur.com/gallery/s4rDi

went back to 98 looked basically identical

frishkie

At the place where jewels abound
Fifteen rows down to the ground
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
Only three stand watch
As the sound of friends
Fills the afternoon hours
Here is a sovereign people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their heads for a night!
Gnomes admire
Fays delight
The namesakes meeting
Near this site.

Assuming that twenty – one is represented by the letter ‘U’
then now why the “From end to end” on its own line?
The middle (for a circular object) is pretty well descriptive.
So if one takes a piece of string/rope/taffy and pulls it
“from end to end” that is the act of “stretching”
The stretch at Churchill Downs is right it front of the grandstands
before the finish.
Another turn of a thought of the image… the Hat with the Jewel
(whose shape and contours still bug me) can be called a Derby Crown
(derby meaning hat and crown meaning a head piece adorned with jewels)
At the time of 1981, the Derby Crown (the winner of the horse races)
was awarded in the middle of that “U”.
gnomes – standing for jockeys
fays – standing for things flying really fast
ground – meaning dirt
meeting – the term used for a horse race
This line if thought actually gives me a smile because it true,
the casque is still there to get!

Saw an interesting piece on the Discovery ch.  The Budweiser Clydesdale Horses have their own stable in St Louis.  One block from the brewery.  Wouldn’t that be nice if they had a leg eater there?  Image9 has to be St louis, no?  Trohn, trying to keep your horses in it.  LOL

boogieman

Saw an interesting piece on the Discovery ch.  The Budweiser Clydesdale Horses have their own stable in St Louis.  One block from the brewery.  Wouldn’t that be nice if they had a leg eater there?  Image9 has to be St louis, no?  Trohn, trying to keep your horses in it.  LOL

*SMILE*  like I need much help in that regard….
In regard to the “leg-eater” of Montreal, why would image 9
depict this reference point as inside a box?

Hmmmm . . . I’ll have to check out the Cydesdale possibility.

I’m kinda thinking “namesakes meeting” might mean that the park(?) is at or near the site of a fair (gnomes and fays are “fair folk”).
Something like a World’s Fair or one of the big Exhibitions from early in the 20th century.  This also kinda fits the description of sovereign nations building palaces to shelter them for a night.  Countries would have a pavilion for their exhibit, and would tear it down afterwards.
Leaning right now towards the Palace of Fine Arts in SF.  It’s a reconstruction of a building from the Panama-Pacific International Exhibition (I think that’s the right name).  The tallest feature of the exhibition was the now-destroyed Tower of Jewels……
Pine

Trohn and SoonerFan – Churchhill/Hoosier and Lewis/Clark aren’t namesakes. “Namesakes” are people, places, or things that have the
SAME
name.

forest_blight, in my example I wasn’t saying Lewis & Clark are namesakes, I was saying “Lewis & Clark” (the people) would be the namesakes of “Lewis & Clark” (a park). That’s just the way I initially read it, but I’ve come with zero on that angle so I’ll probably start looking at it as you had suggested.
Pine_Tree, I like the World’s Fair notion. I remember awhile back researching the World’s Fair in St Louis quite a bit. Don’t recall how much of that was discussed on the forum.

Speaking of namesakes, didn’t the football St Louis Cardinals and the Cardinals baseball teams play in St Louis in 82′?
Edit: They did.  The football team moved to Arizona in 88′.
http://www.football.com/history/index.shtml
Keiner Plaza?

“Gnomes admire
Fays delight
Their namesakes meeting
Near this site”
Namesakes is not an anagram instruction
nor is it a joining of something.
It is always used to mean Ancestry.
So the ancestry of both gnomes and fays.
I know that Druid Hill is close to Churchill Downs.
Does this fit?
Ideally I would like a Dwarf or an Elf.
Or perhaps, the namesake meeting should be
between admire and delight…
that namesake would defintiely qualify as
‘Keen’… and of course Keenland is down the road.
Thoughts?

I don’t understand your latest entry, Trohn. It’s “The” namesakes meeting, not “Their.” I don’t read it to mean ancestry at all. Here it could mean any two things with the same name, like Highway 22 and Interstate 22. Or Little River and Little Creek. Or Kansas City and Kansas City. Something along those lines.

The namesakes meeting…near this site.
I misread it, good point.

So, The namesakes
refer to things or people with the same name.
i.e. The vice presidents of Lincoln and Kennedy.
(both Johnson)
Seattle Slew has sired many offspring that went on
to be great thoroughbreds, but back in
1982 he was only eight.  He probably hadn’t gained that
reputation yet, but he was put out to stud next door
to Churchill Downs.
hmmm…

forest_blight

I don’t understand your latest entry, Trohn. It’s “The” namesakes meeting, not “Their.” I don’t read it to mean ancestry at all. Here it could mean any two things with the same name, like Highway 22 and Interstate 22. Or Little River and Little Creek. Or Kansas City and Kansas City. Something along those lines.

I’ve always thought about the namesakes line referring to a place that is a combination of the names of two or more people. For example Lewis and Clark park. The namesakes (Lewis and Clark) meeting (maybe meeting to leave on their expedition) near this site (Lewis and Clark park) {<-- That's just a made up example not a suggestion for the real meaning}. But that's an interesting example about the highway or river though, I hadn't considered the names of rivers or other things that could meet (railroads, states, trails, ??)

How about this one….
The namesakes meeting
Winston S Churchill met his wife Clementine Hoosier
just across the Ohio River in Indiana!!

Unknown

Unknown:
To this day, unpredictable flooding still lifts the occasional coffin out of the ground in areas above the water table, generally considered safe from flooding…Eventually, New Orleans’ graves were kept above ground, following the Spanish custom of using vaults. The walls of some cemeteries here are made of economical vaults stacked on top of one another, while wealthier families could afford the larger, ornate tombs with crypts.

Just a random thought, but:
Giant pole, giant step
To the place the casque is kept
The giant pole has to be a key to V7, wherever it is, New Orleans or otherwise. I was racking my brains thinking about giant poles and giant steps, and wondered about pole vaulting.
New Orleans is notable for its vaults.
(Interesting idea about the covered 6,7,8 on the clockface. Re: references to 21, V7 also has a 21 possibility in its “aces high”…)

WhiteRabbit

(Interesting idea about the covered 6,7,8 on the clockface. Re: references to 21, V7 also has a 21 possibility in its “aces high”…)

The air smells sweet (Evans Candy)
http://www.hmdb.org/Marker.asp?Marker=54194
Don’t think I haven’t run through all the verses on this image (although, I’m sure the same is true for you). I just got bored and posted what I had above.

erexere

Giving significance to the cemetery in general but also specifying Tomb #15 for some reason.  Looking at the listings, it shows that the family name for Tomb #15 is “Chesse”.  Does that hold some kind of importance to this puzzle?  Chesse looks like a variant of Chess or Cheese.  I take some time looking into it and discover through the magic of Google that one of the first books (second actually) published in England was “The Game and Playe of Chesse” by William Caxton.
I’ve felt strongly in the past that image 7 has some hints about chess given the checker pattern and the knight like gryffon head and a shape that looks like the profile of a chess piece when you wrap the sides of the image together for a half and half reversed image.

Well isn’t that nice and convenient? It brings us right back to clock boy and his statue in Lafayette Square. I don’t even believe I need to make the connection. See for yourselves:

tanban

can you send me a picture or a location of the statue of Saramiento? I can’t find it.

The quote about a sovereign people comes from President Sarmiento of Argentina. There is no statue of him on Basin street. Theres just three statues of other Residents of North, Central, and South American countries.

erexere

The quote about a sovereign people comes from President Sarmiento of Argentina. There is no statue of him on Basin street. There’s just three statues of other [Pr]esidents of North, Central, and South American countries.

(I corrected your typo.) I’m not sure how 3 statues of 3 leaders of 3 different countries is anything close to a match for
THE
sovereign people, nor how they relate to building palaces which function as shelter for a single night.
My pet theory for the palaces was tied to a winter festival where an ice palace was built one night and left to melt the next day. This idea never really fit the rest of the verse.

erexere

I’m very enthusiastic about the Gardens of the Americas’ three statues, a President of Venezuela, a President of Mexico, and a President of the Federal Republic of Central America. This reconciles very well with the quote by Sarmiento, “Here is the sovereign people who build palaces to shelter their heads for a night!”, since he was a President of Argentina.

can you send me a picture or a location of the statue of Saramiento? I can’t find it.

3 leaders of different countries within the bounds of all three of the Americas represented by three and only three statues from one end of Basin street to the other end of Basin street are predominantly linked by just two lines of verse:
From end to end
Only three stand watch
As for the three Sovereiign people quote, attributed to Sarmiento, I find it interesting to consider yet another leader of a country. Sovereignty is ALL about independence and rule. I think the utility of that quote is one matter to discuss but the fact that it was gleaned for some purpose from the President of Argentina is something to consider if contextualized by the Gardens of the Americas statue installation.
Further context is supplied by the quote as it applies to St. Charles hotel being compared to St. Peter’s which is in fact a burial site for St. Peter. This imho is utilized to loint us towards a cemetery environment. Basin street offers that.

Fays delight – face the light…?

it was behind a planter, behind the wall which is shown as part of the image.
it was part of a raised cement structure, but more of a leftover behind the scenes area.
Nothing had ever been planted there.
like a planter box that had a wall set up in the middle of it. leaving a dirt area behind the wall.
think of it as the area behind a baseball backstop.

At the place where jewels abound
Fifteen rows down to the ground
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
The format of this is similar to:
Beneath the tenth stone
From right to left
Beneath the ninth row from the top
It sounds like some kind of wall or similar as the simplest interpretation. Considering Image 7:
…it might be the number of squares across from the dragon head and the estimated number of rows.

The line about the sounds of friends filling the afternoon hours makes sense to me as being about the Krewe of Zulu.  Zulu starts earlier than tye other parading Krewes.  In the afternoon hours would put them close to the end of their route.  Once again this is near St. Louis street and Armstrong Park.

Place where jewels abound
High school kids?

It seems like there is a lag of 36 hours before my posts show up. Is this because I’m relatively new here?
Anyway,
http://imgur.com/a/6V7Xb
Here is an album of picture links to put Image 9 with Montreal, and here ->
http://imgur.com/W3RPt2v
is the link to a picture counting fifteen rows down to the ground when standing in front of the Sunlife Building. And here ->
http://imgur.com/g0yeD1l
is a picture to show you the layout, and how the Windsor borders Dorchester Sq on the other side of the Sunlife.
Image 9 kept bringing me back to Montreal because of that pesky “legeater” and the hand configuration which resembled to Boer War Monument horse. Also the word “Peel” – I kept trying to brush it off but it definitely says “Peel” in the upper right hand corner. So I dutifully kept trying to make Verse 5 work. Until I remembered I saw someone say they thought Verse 2 might work. By then I’d done so much GD research on the area that it fit almost immediately.
There is a Dutch connection here. In regard to Image 9, the Boer War Monument, the centerpiece of Dominion (Dorchester) Sq., commemorates the war between the British and the Boers – Dutch settlers of South Africa.
Verse 2 in itself does not speak of Canada. I’m starting to believe that we can’t trust any claim that “this Image goes with this Verse” unless we see for ourselves photographic proof or really accurate leads.
This hunt is fun, but in the 3 months I’ve been on it, I see that most of us are just really in love with our own ideas. Why aren’t there more actual conversations? (By the way, someone was trying to converse with me a few posts ago — I replied but it hasn’t shown up yet!)
I don’t want to run the risk of arguing that anyone else’s ideas are wrong. I hope I am coming off as someone offering up photos to back up their theory, and I welcome any feedback.

decibalnyc

This all sounds pretty good, but in order for that to be right we would have to ignore the direct quote from the literary reference to the St Charles Hotel, that puts us looking in New Orleans.
Do you have any on site image matches for this? Perhaps some way we can be absolutely sure that you can link this verse to Montreal? Where the jewels abound, that phrase doesn’t specifically scream Montreal Canada. Maybe something similar to what we have at FOY with “the first chapter”? Or what we have in Milwaukee with the tie to Mitchell?
I’m not discounting your theory, just looking for the link where you would match up the verse and image.

Werner Klopek

But you know how old people are, they grow so attached to things.

Nope. Not a single on site match. My only angle would be this. We dug up the Sarmiento quote in the internet age. Maybe, as some have suggested, the quote was meant to be taken at face value, in which case, there is a lot of weight that could be put on Montreal.
I’m not sold one way or the other and am totally open minded about this. There’s no
“my theory”
involved, just throwing out possibilities.

Its easy to say hey this verse belongs over here contrary to popular belief.
because of this one part…
except ages ago we stopped looking at the verses as a single item. There are 12 casques and 12 verses.
we have pretty much definitively identified the citys associated with the images
and then as a whole fit the verses with the cities.
So if you suggest a different verse for a city, that’s fine.
but then you also have to look at how that changes the verse/city layout for the other cities.
if your change then requires other verses to be paired with cities where its obvious they don’t fit.
then your change is probably also weak.

Aha!!! Finally a picture of those pavers!! Thanks, Cormac! Yet–no matter how I count them I come up with 14 not 15.
The Federal Appeals courthouse does have 15 rows down to the ground—on its facade. There is no “Ground” however under these rows, so there would be no place to dig–IF they were indeed telling us to do so. They may instead be telling us to dig IN the park, right across from this structure….?
http://www.travelphotobase.com/f/LANBL/LANDL128.HTM

count the pavers then add the curb.
or count the grey curb in the foreground….
still that leads to a flower bed and I thought flowerbeds were out of bounds…

Looking at Shecrab’s satelite image…
The statue with the circles around it look much like the clock and it’s circles…
The outer gray circle is what I was refering to when I mentioned the pavers.
15 rows of pavers from the outer edge of the grey circle to the wall of the flower bed.

Re: verse 2
« Reply #373 on: Today at 01:14:50 am »
You know, all those people with rakes and shovels going through OUR park is sure making me nervous
me too and if they found it, im sure they think it was something katrinia dropped there

http://www.travelphotobase.com/s/LANBL.HTM
Try this link, Fox…you can see very clearly every single building that surrounds the park and that’s where those figures are. I liked the Federal building windows also–but…the building only has 14 floors, not 15.
Ironically–this park (according to the conservancy publication) was restored to its 1984 state! I believe this may be the only park that was restored to FORMER glory–including re-planting all the trees that Katrina destroyed in the SAME PLACES. So if the trees are “21” by some calculation, then they will not have moved!  That is fantastic, as far as I’m concerned!  The only real “change” they made was to add a doggy drinking fountain, and change out the wooden bollards for concrete ones. They didn’t move anything!
I was talking to my son last night and he had some suggestion also:
(1) The horse’s head in the lower right corner on the “mound” of the checkerboard wall could be referring to one of those horse-head hitching posts that are all over the city. I think you can actually see some of those on one end of the park. Or it might have something to do with chess–the background IS a checkered pattern, like on a board, and that horsehead looks a bit like a Knight. We might be able to interpret “Knight” in some way that works in this park–either
literally
as a Knight, or as its
movement
: in the shape of an
L
–which could stand for
L
afayette!
(2) The mask in the P.–he thought maybe that that mask actually was referring to the BUST of McDonough–since a bust is actually just a head. I think I might agree there–it’s another confirmation that this is the place.
Things just seem to be falling into place nicely here.

Having trouble uploading a picture… any advice?

you dont really get to upload pictures
you have to have them hosted somewhere else then imbed the link in the text of your message.
Like if you look up a few messages you will see the image shecrab posted.
if you right click it and look at its properties, you will see it is hosted at image shack…
h t t p:/ /img254.imageshack.us/img254/3096/lafayettesquarelz1.th.jpg

I noticed in those pictures that President Bush was digging in the park during an Earth Day celebration. You don’t think he has a copy of The Secret, do you?

shecrab

http://www.travelphotobase.com/s/LANBL.HTM
Try this link, Fox…you can see very clearly every single building that surrounds the park and that’s where those figures are. I liked the Federal building windows also–but…the building only has 14 floors, not 15.

I didn’t mean 15 floors {horizontally}, I was referring to verticle windows along one wall of the building.  Looking at the F Edward Herbert Federal Bldg in your link makes me like the idea even more…except we don’t see the whole building to count 15 rows.  Look at the picture though and I would say that those long verticle windows sure look like rows stretching down to the ground.
I really like this park!  I only wish you guys would have come up with these ideas when I was in N.O. because this is such a small park and I truely believe we would have casque #3 finally unearthed.

cobock1

I noticed in those pictures that President Bush was digging in the park during an Earth Day celebration. You don’t think he has a copy of The Secret, do you?

Why do you think the other 2 men are known as Secret Service?   ::)
While watching the slide show, I noticed a couple of things that could be considered our ‘rows’…both can be seen in many of the pix where they are installing the creepy eyeball bench thingy.  One is windows, as in rows of windows.  The ones I am referring to are the tall, verticle windows on a nearby building that can be seen in the above mentioned Bush Photo Op.  Are there 15 of these windows?  If so, they would be a row of 15 windows that stretch down to the ground.  The other idea I had was on other pix, there were large columns on a nearby building.  These columns could be considered verticle ‘rows’ that go down to the ground.
Just some more ideas to mull over.
There is also a nearby building which appears to be white marble that has a very large frieze on it’s side depicting 3 men.  This can be seen in the Bush meet-n-greet pic.  I don’t think these are our 3 that stand watch {pretty convinced on the 3 park statues} but was wondering if any of the other buildings have similar friezes containing a face like P7’s mask.

There is also a nice picture of a huge crowd in the park with the JM statue in the lower lefthand corner.  If that boy isn’t our clock boy I will eat my hat.
You know, all those people with rakes and shovels going through OUR park is sure making me nervous

I didn’t have any luck counting the windows on buildings surrounding the park when I was there.
Also looked for brick/stone paterns on the walls.
My time there was short so I could have missed something.

oh wow, i hadn’t realized you’d been there cormac!  did you do any poking?  when you were there did you feel it was there, that you had the right place?

The only thing keeping me from driving there tomorrow is my ever level headed wife… Only 450 miles away…

Yep…was there.
Had just found a copy of the book, and had already planned the trip to NewO before hearing about the book.
Had a great time there… but could only talk my wife into one afternoon of searching…
She was the one who pointed out that the girl’s dress looked like the narcissus on the right… that it had no stamen like the one on the left and almost appeared to have a neckline like the dress…
have now posted a couple pictures here…
http://thesecretatreasurehunt.shutterfly.com/neworleans

Recompiling.
Line 1, jewels = something or someone precious, abound = great in number
Lines 2 and 3, = find tomb No.21 amidst a row of 15 tombs
Lines 4 and 5, = there are just 3 statues along the entire length of Basin street
Lines 6 and 7, = festivity/merriment following the highest point of the day
Lines 8 -10, = Sarmiento (Argentine), tombs
Lines 11 and 12, = looking up to Morazan in recognition of the “gateway” (entrance) to North America
Lines 13 and 14, = “AA meeting” symbol resonates with the Morazan seal.
—

Here is my thinking. Lee Circle
There use to be 21 trees in a circle and in the Midle is Lee(middle of 21)
Its literally 15 steps(rows) down to the bottom (ground)
A famous hotel is built there in lee Circle (shelter)
General Lee is looking towards St. Charles Avenue(Gnomes Admire)
Dryades Street and Cours de Naides (now St Charles Avenue) were named after wood and water sprites respectively. They originate @ Lee Circle. (Fays Delight)

Here is my thinking.
Lee
Circle
There use to be 21 trees in a
circle
and in the Midle is
Lee
(middle of 21)
Its literally 15 steps(rows) down to the bottom (ground)
A famous hotel is built there in
lee
Circle
(shelter)
General
Lee
is looking towards St. Charles Avenue(Gnomes Admire)
Dryades Street and Cours de Naides (now St Charles Avenue) were named after wood and water sprites respectively. They originate @
Lee
Circle
. (Fays Delight)

here is another therory to pick apart, thanks in advance
have been thinking about some of the lines from v-2
Fifteen rows down to the ground,.. ground is park
15 rows are streets from LA park, i think bp did not use the
steets that dead end into st. charles, because they are not a thoroughfare….
ie..the conditions necessary for passing through  =  rows i know questionable
the, better after thought……..
something else i thought of
so if we take p-7 as… YOU ARE… in N.O., and start at preservation hall and count
all the blocks from there to  royal to park, it is 15 rows, i like this better as, the jewels
line in poem,  and the mask, longs and lat ect get you to N.O.,
and the clock tells you were you are, and where you are going
royal becomes st charles, and is one of the parade routes, with plenty of jewels
preservation hall would be a count of one, royal 2 ect i know still questionable
and that left turn that was mentioned
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
some walkways have set blocks like your sidewalk,
i measured mine i have 7, 5 foot segments,from my driveway to the next driveway
which covers my front yard, the ones at my city park were 4 feet,from fountian
to the sidewalk entrance,im thinking the segment spaces depends on how much ground
is in between 2 objects for the walkway. so maybe their are 10 segments between
each statue. ie..from boy to clay 10, from clay to ben 10 more, clay would equal 11,
from end to end
Gnomes admire
Fays delight
The namesakes meeting
Near this site.
not sure about gnomes,…. maybe some on a building at site, as they are in many places in N.O.
Fays delight…the park
The namesakes meeting…..their is a Plaque on the clay
statue, stating where he use to be.
if you are reading the Plaque, you are facing north,
turn south and you are facing the clock tower
Plaque link
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image … eStone.jpg
more photos of park
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Categ … ew_Orleans
the wall
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image … UpBack.jpg

I think the theory that rows = streets is kind of a stretch. It would make more sense for them to be simply
rows
of something, on some vertical surface (hence,
down
to the ground). Remember how literal V4 was, using similar wording:
Beneath the ninth row from the top / Of the wall including small bricks
.

Unknown

Unknown:
Early French colonial New Orleans was centered on what was then called the Place d’Armes (lit. “weapons’ square”). Under Spanish colonial administration in the second half of the 18th century, the name was Plaza de Armas

Unknown

Unknown:
Very impressive work esp since the book is 20 years old. I think you deserve to know that you are correct about st. Louid,but not correct about the location.thanks for all your excellent work.”

I just noticed something interesting about Jackson Square; dunno if it’s come up before. The Louis Armstrong statue was originally unveiled there on July 4th 1976, and wasn’t moved to Armstrong Park until 1980.
Here’s a picture of Louis being hauled upright in Jackson Square…
http://www.louisianadigitallibrary.org/ … AZ/id/1905
…and the historical background…
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=y0T … rk&f=false
Just wanted to recap some of the key points of this verse as it relates to Jackson Square.
At the place where jewels abound
It’s a “Place”; the Place D’Armes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jackson_S … ew_Orleans
)
(As for the jewels, the plaque includes a crown; and there’s the casque of course.)
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
Only three stand watch
As the sound of friends
Fills the afternoon hours
Not yet identified.
Here is a sovereign people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their heads for a night!
Quotation linking the verse to New Orleans.
Gnomes admire
Fays delight
The Fays are the French fairies named in the litany; dunno where the Gnomes come into it.
The namesakes meeting
Near this site
“Near this site” appears on a plaque opposite the square.
http://openplaques.org/plaques/39428
Perhaps “the namesakes meeting” could be Louis Armstrong and St Louis Cathedral.
Another of the compelling clues for this location is BP’s “I think you deserve to know that you are correct about st. Louid” (sic). St Louis seems to have fallen out of favour as a casque city these days. With such good evidence for Image 9 as Montreal, Image 12 as New York, it’s difficult to see where it would fit in. And remember that the tone of that note from BP was very encouraging…
Surely he was trying to give a genuine, useful hint here. Given the likelihood that New Orleans is a casque city and St Louis isn’t, what could be more natural than to interpret this as a hint for the cathedral?
Then there’s the horse’s head, there’s a plaque with Moon on it…
…there’s the “Union must and shall be preserved” quote on Jackson’s statue, and the general clock-like layout of the square…
I think it’s all about as good as it gets round here.
I just dialled up the Plaza on Google maps for old times sake, and they’ve done a great job on it. You can walk all round it, and through it, now.

Unknown

Unknown:
So let’s say he buries the casque in St. Louis and wants to write a cryptic riddle. He notes that St. Louis is near St. Charles County, so he needs a veiled reference to something involving St. Charles. So far, I could go along with that, except that St. Louis isn’t in St. Charles County. One would have to exit St. Louis City, traverse St. Louis County, and then enter St. Charles County. Even granting that BP really means to refer to St. Charles County, I think it highly unlikely that he could come upon the St. Charles reference in Abroad in his search because the St. Charles Exchange Hotel is not in the index of Abroad in America. It would be a fantastic coincidence to have buried the casque in St. Charles County, then just happen to encounter the exact sort of phrase he needed to provide a cryptic reference to it. A more parsimonious explanation is that he buried it in New Orleans, then simply flipped through the index of Abroad until he found what he was looking for. This would not have been difficult, since there is only one page in the entire book that mentions New Orleans, p. 110.

Unknown

Unknown:
Granted. If we try hard enough, we could get any numbers 0-9 out of P7. But you have to really try to squeeze a 38 out of it, when 29 is sitting right there. Parsimony.

Unknown

Unknown:
I think our collective efforts would be wasted trying to make P7 to fit St. Louis, when there is much stronger evidence in favor of New Orleans for this one.

I’ll give you this scenario….St. Louis is not in St. Charles county–but next door to it. HOWEVER, it has a prominent St. Charles Street, which used to be known as the King’s Road.  It might not be the only reference–it was just the first one I found.
I agree about arches. They’re everywhere.
As for direct references, this particular image is a lot more direct than any of the other images or verses; it blatantly says “Preservation.”  It blatantly holds up a mask. Of
course
one would think New Orleans. It doesn’t need to be more direct than that!  But none of the other unsolved images have anything that drastic in them so that you can be certain of where it’s referring you to except maybe the city hall in Milwaukee. What in the image, for instance, screams “Chidlren’s Zoo?” or “Fountain of youth Park?” I know there are some parts of these images that fit–and some parts don’t–with each idea that we’ve had. Why not St. Louis AS WELL AS New Orleans?
Seeing as there hasn’t been any further pinpointing of the casque IN New Orleans, I don’t see the problem with thinking it might not even BE there.
Oddly enough–I found these references completely by accident. I was looking up names, things that had been mentioned, etc, and St. Louis just came UP over and over again. Frankly, I was rather surprised, since I hadn’t given St. Louis any thought at all beyond reading through the i9 threads.
When I saw the vintage baseball player, I thought “now how often will you see that outfit–and that’s actually what started my research in St. L. The “vintage clubs” (resurrected ones) may not hae been around in the 80’s but that isn’t the point of the connection: St. Louis is considered one of the cradles of the sport–much baseball history took place there.
Sportsman’s Park, St. Louis
Starting back in the 1870s, baseball was played at Sportsman’s Park. Around the turn of the century the St. Louis Browns began playing here, and in 1920, the St. Louis Cardinals moved in and shared the park until 1953. Sportsman’s Park was home to the Cardinals until May 8, 1966. After leaving the stadium, Anheuser-Busch and August A. Busch, Jr. donated the property for use as a private recreational facility, the Herbert Hoover Boy’s Club, which opened in 1967. If you stop by, it’s still possible to play on the exact spot where almost 100 years of St. Louis baseball history took place.
)Quote from the Naional Trust for Historic Preservation website)
This is one of those places where baseball has been played continuously since it was an organized sport.
Isn’t one of the images using the warts on someone’s face for numbers? I wouldn’t call that obvious either.
That’s just it…I think the “evidence” is about equal. In other words, there IS no evidence beyond a quote in an old book. The rest of the information is just that–information gathered from the sources we’re all using, i.e., the internet. As for collective efforts, nothing says we can’t research BOTH places. There are people in both places who can physically go and take photos.  What’s the big deal, really?

shecrab

Why not St. Louis AS WELL AS New Orleans?

shecrab

That’s just it…I think the “evidence” is about equal. In other words, there IS no evidence beyond a quote in an old book. The rest of the information is just that–information gathered from the sources we’re all using, i.e., the internet. As for collective efforts, nothing says we can’t research BOTH places. There are people in both places who can physically go and take photos.  What’s the big deal, really?

I agree – that is entirely possible. Likely, even.
That’s a good point.
Here is something to chew on. BP came out and
told
johann that there is a casque in St. Louis. My opinion (and that’s all it is, an opinion) is that neither V2 nor P7 go with St. Louis (and that they go with New Orleans instead). So what does that leave us with?
I’m going to assume here that the V3 location is Boston, given all the “Midnight Ride” references, and that V7 goes with San Francisco. We have:
P1/V7:  San Francisco
P2/V6:  Charleston
P3/V11: Roanoke
P4/V4:  Cleveland
P5/V12: Chicago
P6/V9:  St. Augustine
P7/V2:  New Orleans
P8/V1:  Houston
P10/V8: Milwaukee
V3:    Boston
That leaves unaccounted for:
P9
P11
P12
V5
V10
Some pretty good arguments have been put forward for P9 and St. Louis, but what Verse? The focus has been on V2 for St. Louis, but if it isn’t V2, it is probably either V5 or V10. Maybe we should be trying hard to find links between V5 or V10 and St. Louis.

Geez… Either one of you two would kick my butt in a spirited debate, so I’d like to try to keep out of it.
The big problem I see is that we have 10 probable locations with 3 more possibilities.
New York
St Louis
Canada
I still like v3/p11 for Boston.  So that leaves us with two verses and two pics with three possible cities remaining.
V10
V5
P9
P12 (why we still argue whether this is NY or not kills me)
So let’s just say that P12 is NY with either v5 or v10.
That leaves P9 with either V5 or V10 in either St Louis or Canada.
This point I try to make kind of fails when you think that BP confirmed St Louis, and somebody here swears he also said there’s one in Canada.
That would seem to leave NY out in the cold.  So, until we dig one up, we are all full of it!

Forest_blight. You are not alone.

WhiteRabbit

OK, so Armstrong’s sojourn in Jackson is an irrelevance. Fair enough. Since you found that damn “near this site” plaque though, what do you make of it? Do you think it’s the reference in this verse?

Why discount that the line might also mean “the namesakes meeting [is] near
this
site?” Rather than denoting a specific object (i.e., the sign), the lines could be referencing that the “namesakes meeting” is near the treasure ground, and we need to figure out what the “namesakes meeting” is, no?
Is there a way to determine which of these two ways it is? Is there a third way? A fourth? Or the better question… Does it matter what those lines are referring to, and is there a way to tell if it matters?
I do have thoughts on what that line means, but I’m not going to share it. All sharing it will do is give you my
opinion
, which might create another digspot to throw on the pile. Another digspot
theory
,though, at this point, is useless. We have enough that have not yet been dug to keep us digging for a year out. We don’t need to find digspots and theories, we need to find where the location of the casque is and proceed directly to that site. Then we can start exploring.

Glossiphoniidae

Does it matter what those lines are referring to…we need to find where the location of the casque is and proceed directly to that site.

It could perhaps be argued that the verses describe items around a site, and having tied a verse to a location, all you need do is identify the specific reference that leads to a casque and you needn’t worry about interpreting the rest. Is that what you’re suggesting…? Like, who cares what the Milwaukee compass or the Houston fortress are; it doesn’t matter.
Maybe in a more contained area like Roanoke, FOY or Hermann Park you could take that approach. But New Orleans, SF, NY, Boston; it’s a wide area. We don’t know what the parks are yet. If you can find a verse reference that subtly pins down a particular park, that’s worth a second look. We have mini quotes from plaques in other puzzles, and that’s another plausible one; not as distinctive, but still characteristic.
Near this site
Socrates, Pindar, Apelles
The first chapter
By dauntless and inconquerable
Hardly conclusive though, I admit.

This is beginning to sound like a useful discussion, WR. Haven’t seen or been engaged in one of those on here a while… It makes me smile.

Glossiphoniidae

Ever wonder why in most other cities we try to do the same thing and end up following a path that leads to, well, a spot where nothing the verse says should exists exists? A spot where we can’t really dig with any sort of certainty at all. A place Preiss is most certainly leading us to/around, but that the dig clues do not fit a bit without stretching like Armstrong.

OK, so Armstrong’s sojourn in Jackson is an irrelevance. Fair enough. Since you found that damn “near this site” plaque though, what do you make of it? Do you think it’s the reference in this verse?

I have a new idea on the lines Gnomes admire and Fays delight.  The word admire is used to tell us we must look up at something.  Delight is synonymous with entrance or charm.  I think we must use something’s doorway or entrance as a point of reference.

I’d like to see where/how “three stand watch” fits with this Jackson Square idea.

who knows?
maybe it is confirming the 15 rows (15 seconds)
maybe it is the three train tracks
maybe it is the points on top of St. Louis XII Cathedral
maybe it is nothing at all
maybe this is 3 (III):
or maybe the pole is the one aligning with the end of the cannon (center of clock), or is it aligning with the center of the wheel (outer and inner rings on clock face):
whatever it is, it seems to be pretty important because it is the only number marked by two black dots (inner and outer rings):
there is one black dot by the pole:
the III might also represent a specific spot in the fence that is similar to the image:

I was about to ask the same thing, erexere. Perhaps only 3 of that line of trees were left in 1981/1982? That would explain it.
How about the namesakes? One idea is that St. Peter Street and N. Peter Street (which coincides with Decatur St. for a stretch) intersect
very
close to those planters. I would call that “namesakes meeting.”

Jackson Square and Jackson “Jax” Brewery, named after Andrew Jackson, are the namesakes. These places meet at Artillery Park, where “on or
near this site
” starts the phrasing on a placard cemented at the the top of 15 stairs. At 12 o’clock from this placard, and the cannon, is the 21 trees.
The center of the clock is the back-end of the cannon (the short hour-hand), with a “J” on one side of the barrel and a backwards “J” on the other.

I get the feeling Preiss explored this area and some of Jackson makes its way into the image.
I figure the word “watch” is involved in a more particular way.  Look for a “wrist” motif or something hanging from a chain like an old watch.  Something with “eye” qualities like a statue gazing.  Perhaps something only to do with being timely, like a bus stop.
Could be any number of things where three things together are poised to see something eventful…or three separate things like a riddle about morning, afternoon and night… a man with a cane….there’s an odd kind of sugar reference.

The Giant Squid

It was located between St. Charles, Common, Gravier, and Camp streets.

Located between St. Charlees, Common, Gravier, and
Carondelet
streets.  Here is another map:
http://gennotes.150m.com/lucas.html
Description of the St. Charles Exchange Hotel starts on page 137 in the book at the following site:
http://books.google.com/books?id=yo8ZAA … #PPA142,M1

This is my first post on Q4T, please be gentle.
I just got back from the library, and I have finally (finally!) identified the source for:
“Here is a
sovereign
people Who build palaces to shelter Their heads for a night!”
It was written by Argentine author Domingo Faustino Sarmiento, who, while travelling in the United States, saw the St. Charles Exchange Hotel in New Orleans, and compared it to St. Peter’s Basilica in Rome. The whole quote:
“The Saint Charles, which lifted its proud head above the surrounding hills and woods, the Saint Charles, which had called up my memory of Saint Peter’s in Rome, was no more than a hotel! Here is the
sovereign
people who build palaces to shelter their heads for a night! Here is the religion which is delicated to man as man, and here the marvels of art are lavished on the glorification of the masses.”
I hope this helps. Please don’t confuse the St. Charles Exchange Hotel with the Cotton Exchange Hotel, which is a newer building.

This is my first post on Q4T, please be gentle.
I just got back from the library, and I have finally (finally!) identified the source for:
“Here is a sovereign people Who build palaces to shelter Their heads for a night!”
It was written by Argentine author Domingo Faustino Sarmiento, who, while travelling in the United States, saw the St. Charles Exchange Hotel in New Orleans, and compared it to St. Peter’s Basilica in Rome. The whole quote:
“The Saint Charles, which lifted its proud head above the surrounding hills and woods, the Saint Charles, which had called up my memory of Saint Peter’s in Rome, was no more than a hotel! Here is the sovereign people who build palaces to shelter their heads for a night! Here is the religion which is delicated to man as man, and here the marvels of art are lavished on the glorification of the masses.”
I hope this helps. Please don’t confuse the St. Charles Exchange Hotel with the Cotton Exchange Hotel, which is a newer building.

Oh, and the St. Charles Exchange Hotel was built in 1835 and burned down, rebuilt in 1851 and burned down, rebuilt in 1896, and burned down.
It was demolished in 1974, before The Secret was written. There are two other hotels, the Royal St. Charles, and the Parc St. Charles. Neither of these bear any relation to the original.

This is an incredible find. Bravo!!

I can’t seem to confirm this from a search of the internet.  Do you have a scan of the page that has the quote that can be seen?  This is clear confirmation of Verse 2 and New Orleans.  Nice job!

I can likely scan the page this week, sometime.
Of course, Sarmiento says “the
sovereign
people” and the verse is “a
sovereign
people”, but, that’s close enough, IMHO.
But, here’s confirmation from Google Book Search.
http://books.google.com/books?id=OZABAA … %22&pgis=1
I do believe the verse exists to point to:
a) St. Charles Avenue
b) St. Peter Street
c) Any hotel in NOLA
or
d) Simply establish a ‘link’ between the verse and the city.
And, if anybody is in New Orleans wanting to help out with this search, I’m glad to help. I’m based in Baton Rouge, and can make it down there any afternoon or Sat/Sun afternoons.
I have other data that suggest Armstrong Park, but I’ll reveal that in due time.

I can likely scan the page this week, sometime.
Of course, Sarmiento says “the sovereign people” and the verse is “a sovereign people”, but, that’s close enough, IMHO.
But, here’s confirmation from Google Book Search.
http://books.google.com/books?id=OZABAA … %22&pgis=1
I do believe the verse exists to point to:
a) St. Charles Avenue
b) St. Peter Street
c) Any hotel in NOLA
or
d) Simply establish a ‘link’ between the verse and the city.
And, if anybody is in New Orleans wanting to help out with this search, I’m glad to help. I’m based in Baton Rouge, and can make it down there any afternoon or Sat/Sun afternoons.
I have other data that suggest Armstrong Park, but I’ll reveal that in due time.

Eg – I
ran
walked swiftly to the university library (only one building away) and confirmed it for myself. I found two English translations of Sarmiento’s
Travels in the United States in 1847
. Here are the relevant passages:
“As the steamboat in which we floated down the Mississippi turned one of the semicircular curves described by that immense, smoothly flowing body of water, we were shown, against the horizon – dominating steplike clumps of trees in every shade of autumn colors, below which spread the emerald lines of broad sugar plantations – the cupola of the St. Charles, a comforting indication of our proximity to New Orleans after twenty-one hundred miles of river and forest. Although the appearance of the surrounding landscape does not favor the comparison, the sight of that distant cupola reminded me of the dome of St. Peter’s in Rome, visible from all points of the horizon as if it stood there alone, and looking so colossal at sixy miles that one would scarcely believe it when viewing it close by. At last I was to see in the United States a basilica of classical architecture and dimensions worthy of the Christian cult. Someone asked us whether we had selected a hotel, and suggested the St. Charles as the best appointed. “At sunrise,” he added, “you will have from its cupola the finest panorama of the city, river, lake, and surrounding countryside.” The St. Charles, which lifted its great head above the surrounding hills and forests, the St. Charles that had brought to my mind St. Peter’s at Rome, was merely a hotel!
Behold the
sovereign
people who build palaces for themselves, under whose vaulted roofs to lay their heads for a night! Behold the worship paid to man as man, and the prodigies of skill lavished upon the glorification of the popular masses. Nero had his Domus Aurea. But the Roman plebeians had only the catacombs for their shelter!”
The other translation (last bit only) reads as Squid wrote.
Sarmiento goes on with more description of the hotel. He was quite taken with the place. Where exactly was it?
This was an incredibly obscure quote, more obscure than the one from
Pierre
, and unlikely to be found inscribed on a monument. How could anyone hope to find it before Google?

Eg – I
ran
walked swiftly to the university library (only one building away) and confirmed it for myself. I found two English translations of Sarmiento’s
Travels in the United States in 1847
. Here are the relevant passages:
“As the steamboat in which we floated down the Mississippi turned one of the semicircular curves described by that immense, smoothly flowing body of water, we were shown, against the horizon – dominating steplike clumps of trees in every shade of autumn colors, below which spread the emerald lines of broad sugar plantations – the cupola of the St. Charles, a comforting indication of our proximity to New Orleans after twenty-one hundred miles of river and forest. Although the appearance of the surrounding landscape does not favor the comparison, the sight of that distant cupola reminded me of the dome of St. Peter’s in Rome, visible from all points of the horizon as if it stood there alone, and looking so colossal at sixy miles that one would scarcely believe it when viewing it close by. At last I was to see in the United States a basilica of classical architecture and dimensions worthy of the Christian cult. Someone asked us whether we had selected a hotel, and suggested the St. Charles as the best appointed. “At sunrise,” he added, “you will have from its cupola the finest panorama of the city, river, lake, and surrounding countryside.” The St. Charles, which lifted its great head above the surrounding hills and forests, the St. Charles that had brought to my mind St. Peter’s at Rome, was merely a hotel!
Behold the sovereign people who build palaces for themselves, under whose vaulted roofs to lay their heads for a night! Behold the worship paid to man as man, and the prodigies of skill lavished upon the glorification of the popular masses. Nero had his Domus Aurea. But the Roman plebeians had only the catacombs for their shelter!”
The other translation (last bit only) reads as Squid wrote.
Sarmiento goes on with more description of the hotel. He was quite taken with the place. Where exactly was it?
This was an incredibly obscure quote, more obscure than the one from
Pierre
, and unlikely to be found inscribed on a monument. How could anyone hope to find it before Google?

forest_blight

Sarmiento goes on with more description of the hotel. He was quite taken with the place. Where exactly was it?

I hope this link works…
http://books.google.com/books?id=yo8ZAA … #PPA137,M1
This section of the book seems to describe the location in 1845 as on St. Charles St. & Gravier St.

It was located between St. Charles, Common, Gravier, and Camp streets.
Currently, the Place St. Charles office tower sits at its former spot.
http://www.placestcharles.com/map.html

Spiritr

the key was never “afternoon hours”, it’s key should be the “sound of friends”
afternoon hours in general is called post meridiem, or pm

Well alrighty then… Ok, I’ll bite, what does “sound of friends” mean to you?

fox

Because it has….twice…in Chicago and Cleveland.

I really don’t feel that from the two finds the solution has been found yet. Chicago They figured out the city and Lincoln, everything else was very very very vague.
Egbert figured out the clues for cleveland, but I actually think he had several of them wrong. but he had enough to get to the site.
What I have been trying to do is distill the two solutions into one generic one.

The place where jewels abound?  That’s just New Orleans PERIOD.
There’s an entire neighborhood where the streets are named after jewels.
Fake “Jewels” are thrown to bystanders and revelers at Mardi Gras.
An early written guide to the city was called “Jewell’s Crescent City” and is still in print and used to this day. Edwin Jewell was a great promoter of new Orleans for the tourist industry.
How did you get from jewels to lampposts?

Unknown

Unknown:
It’s not so much about forcing a fit, it’s about looking at the simplest possible explanation for each line in the verse.

THat’s what Occam’s Razor IS. The simplest possible explanation.
And I fail–completely–to see how looking at a line of lampposts suggests that they are in any way JEWELS. Why on earth would he pick one item–lampposts–to represent jewels in a city where JEWELS ABOUND IN SO MANY OTHER
AND
REALISTIC
WAYS?????
It makes no sense. But you keep up the fight. I’m sure that you will soldier on despite the obvious.

I will reiterate my firm belief that Jewels Abound represents race horses –
singluarly valuable
rare in quality
admired
valued
And are bred by studs ( family jewels )
Not to mention that the triple crown races are the first, second, and thrid jewel in the triple crown.
(royalty)
And of course ‘In the Middle of 21’ talks about the ‘u’ or the horseshoe.
But, thats an argument that fox would say is beating a dead horse.

shecrab

The place where jewels abound?  That’s just New Orleans PERIOD.
There’s an entire neighborhood where the streets are named after jewels.
Fake “Jewels” are thrown to bystanders and revelers at Mardi Gras.
An early written guide to the city was called “Jewell’s Crescent City” and is still in print and used to this day. Edwin Jewell was a great promoter of new Orleans for the tourist industry.
How did you get from jewels to lampposts?

PERIOD?  Sure, based on your single non-debatable criteria, BP himself isn’t allowed to refer to a host of glimmering lamp lights as glimmering jewels.  A lot of things are referrable as ‘jewels’.  Let me lend you my Thesaurus.

And that there, I believe, is your problem.
Pull out your thesaurus and look up meanings for :  Lane, step, pole, fortress, lion, whistle, watch, shelter, site, tower, pass, letters, steps, arc, swept, paces, etc…etc…etc…
BP himself said that he didnt think these were that hard.  We cant keep pulling out our thesauruses (or is it thesauri) to force a fit to a location we like.  What in here is obscure:
“Verse 4
Beneath two countries
As the road curves
In a rectangular plot
Beneath the tenth stone
From right to left
Beneath the ninth row from the top
Of the wall including small bricks
Seven steps up you can hop
From the bottom level
Socrates, Pindar, Apelles
Free speech, couplet, birch
To find casque’s destination
Seek the columns
For the search.”
NOTHING and yet a casque was found.

So shecrab, you imply there is more redundancy going on in v2 than the other verses, why?
Image 7 is New Orleans for many obvious reasons already.  It serves the purpose ffor narrowing it down to a city.  Why then do the same task with a verse?  I only carry the logic a step forward to say the verse narrows it down to an iconic row of lights.  Btw, i used a picture of canal street.  So its the intersection of basin and canal.
You are going to have to trust me on the earrings being a concept in form that look like the iconic lamp posts.  Some earrings dangle from the ear just like those in the picture i shared with you.
Maybe you need to show everyone where all the other verses name their city with such an analogy and that your redundancy idea carries such obviousness for all to see.
Trohn, thats not too shabby of a theory.  The jockey disguise and chess knight on the oval shaped bulge gives it momentum for a horse race…and a healthy money bet.  It looks strong from one angle but weaker from another.  I see the bulge as a “fat” reference as well as a locator of “center of an oval”, !?! Thats great for my latest idea, i just picked a center of a lawn covered median on basin street and concluded “knight” is the best time to go a digging…and i’ll cite the jewels abound line as a night time suggestion, thus giving the line purpose beyond obvious/irrelevance/or redundance.
Preiss did say “St. Louis is correct”, but did he mean the city of St. Louis or the cemetery called St.Louis on St. Louis street?  (…or dont consider my question, as I know useless remarks are expected from the usual automatons of late who would rather believe Occam himself penned The Secret).

Isn’t it more of a problem to suggest that since one casque was easy that the rest will be as easy?  Seems like a silly rebuttle to say it is simple and nothing is debatable.
Why aren’t you responding to the idea that a jewel can be a thing of reference?  Are you saying ALL of the verses are 100% literal?
Oh.. First line..those weren’t countries…they were gardens named after countries…aren’t you silly to think they are actual countries?  Let me lend you a world map too!

erexere

PERIOD?  Sure, based on your single non-debatable criteria, BP himself isn’t allowed to refer to a host of glimmering lamp lights as glimmering jewels.  A lot of things are referrable as ‘jewels’.  Let me lend you my Thesaurus.

Oh for crying out loud. Let ME lend YOU my encyclopedia, and you can look up the term “Occam’s Razor”.

Why? Do you think ex needs a shave?
ooops
silly me, that is Gillette’s razor, not Occam’s razor.

Okay, if it’s not doing you any good, I love freebies.
So you reject my answer to your question?  I suppose BP also said it was so simple nobody would think to compare a whole bunch of lights to his “jewels abound” line?  My point, folks readily condemn an idea…justify however you like…but why bother?  I’m supplying ideas as contribution.  You’re 100% wrong to say I’m doing so in an effort to go against solid ideas.  Occams Razor would dictate that the solid idea would have recovered a casque by now.
Again, lots of lights could be seen as jewels.  Stars in the heavens can be described as jewels also.  Please don’t be so dense about this and rule my gesture to contribute to this hunt as a whole as “random” or “obscure”.  You don’t like it, thanks for saying, but please refrain from distracting remarks, which in themselves contribute nothing to the forum and only represent you as an antagonist.

shecrab

THat’s what Occam’s Razor IS. The simplest possible explanation.
And I fail–completely–to see how looking at a line of lampposts suggests that they are in any way JEWELS. Why on earth would he pick one item–lampposts–to represent jewels in a city where JEWELS ABOUND IN SO MANY OTHER
AND
REALISTIC
WAYS?????   :bang)
It makes no sense. But you keep up the fight. I’m sure that you will soldier on despite the obvious.

Cite Occums Razor, then avoid to address that it applies to this next question?  Why hasnt the simplest explaination based on solid ideas recovered a casque yet?

Because – I dont have permission to dig until January.

I was thinking these look similar to earrings and it would be obvious that lots of something such as these lights looks like “jewels abounds”.  The Basin Street idea wasn’t a random occurrence, I used the image7 to get there and just looked for anything that fit.  It’s not so much about forcing a fit, it’s about looking at the simplest possible explanation for each line in the verse.
Here is a line drawn from the #21 tomb to intersect with a line drawn between the only “three standing” statues on Basin street.  The blue box showing fifteen is based on the actual numbered map of the cemetery, so it’s not subject to me having miscounted or anything.  These are just verifiable ideas at this point.  One arbitrary element is the 15 rows of tombs stretches from corner to center gate,and it doesn’t seem to be required.  in the middle of 21 could be ascertained without, right?  I will continue looking for options.  Have a look,
I really think BP must’ve snuck this casque in at night.  Maybe he was disguised as a guy pushing a shopping cart with a shovel and some dirty rags in it…what was homeless like back in 1980?

erexere

Cite Occums Razor, then avoid to address that it applies to this next question?  Why hasnt the simplest explaination based on solid ideas recovered a casque yet?

erexere

Preiss did say “St. Louis is correct”, but did he mean the city of St. Louis or the cemetery called St.Louis on St. Louis street?  (…or dont consider my question, as I know useless remarks are expected from the usual automatons of late who would rather believe Occam himself penned The Secret).

Trohn

But, thats an argument that fox would say is beating a dead horse.

Because it has….twice…in Chicago and Cleveland.
This autamaton thinks that is a valid question.  I still find myself occasionally straying from Lafayette Park back to Jackson Square because of the St Louis Cathedral.
Trohn, you know I respect a lot of you theories……

I had a chance to start looking at this book again, and started digging into page 48, which is a familiy style portrait photo of many of the fairies and positioned right across from verse 2 on page 49.  I don’t have a scanner handy, but the fairies are sitting on a series of steps — the last fairy on row number 15, counting down to the ground.  There are 22 fairies from my count, so if you said “In the middle of 21”, that could be a clue to look for a central fairy–which I think might be the “Left Wing Symp and Right Wing Trog” positioned on step 15, described later on page 140 (where it is again backed by steps in a solo-photo) as hailing from North and or South Dakota, but can never agree on which.  When the verse on page 49 goes on to say “only three stand watch” it may be that there are 3 fairies that were sculptured instead of sketched missing from the group photo, all with a location in common.
I will keep looking, but I thought that this was worth mentioning because the title above the group photo was aslo included with the banner “The Verses”

The line
from end to end
is a challenge.
Im looking at several angles.  End could mean death, but it could also mean birth, since a beginning is also an end if you look at it in line perspective.  Im currently considering St. Judes church and the connection to the Childrens hospital.  Its a deep perspective amidst other child based ideas concerning Margaret Haughery and also John McDonogh.

erexere

End could mean death, but it could also mean birth

No, honestly, it couldn’t. The end of what? Gestation?

Dont get me wrong Trohn, the reasoning is great.  I just think the location is too (for lack of better words) famous.  Even if there was NO security back then, I just dont think it reasonable to go to the infield of Churchill Downs and dig.  I would be more at ease finding an out of the way corner of Disneyland and digging (which of course I would never do).  Quick question…during off season, are the grounds of Churchill Downs, including the infield, open for the public to just wander around in?

It would be wild if it was there.

Fox, its not that random.
“In the middle of 21, from end to end”
In the middle of twenty one refers to the winners circle
horseshoe – which you have a nice color photo of.
But not ‘in the middle’ but ‘in the middle from end to end’
so not in the middle of the bowl – but in the middle
from the ends of the points.
Its a specific spot – pace from the left to the right – count your paces
and then retreat half the number back.
Its really smart – because of all the changes that have taken place over the
thirty years, that one spot remains exactly where it has always been.
And back thrity years ago, security was practically non existent.

Fox-
Let me know if you want me to drag back up the photo
of the first section (before they reconfigured it ten years ago)
that was directly in sight line of the winners circle –
which clearly shows – fifteen rows of bench seating.

Trohn

Fifteen Rows down to the ground.

Bump.
The photo can still be seen on this thread on page seven.

fox

looks like 15 or 16 to me.

Bump.  WOW… nearly five years.

That link does not work for me.

shecrab

That link does not work for me.

The photo is imbedded on page seven of this thread.
The link didn’t come over properly.

Hyeah:
http://www.quest4treasure.co.uk/forum/h … 679#p56679

One of the simplest interpretations is the intersection of two roads named after different people, which unfortunately happens all over the place. (Eg Penfield and McGregor alongside
Percy Walters Park
, or St Charles and Maestri alongside Lafayette.)

WR, I’m not sure it is as common as you think. No two roads in the same city should have identical names (this does happen, but rarely), although one could be a “road” and the other a “street.” In New Orleans, there are the following, for example:
Audubon Boulevard
Audubon Court
Audubon Park
Audubon Place
Audubon Street
…creating 10 potential “meetings.” Do any of them actually intersect? Audubon Blvd. and Audubon Place are apparently the same road, just separated by some grassy land and an intervening chunk of road called Newcomb Place. They don’t actually meet. Audubon Street runs parallel to both, but does not intersect with either of them. Audubon Street and Audubon Court
do
intersect, so that would be a legitimate “namesakes meeting.” Another intersection is where Audubon Place hits Audubon Park. Nowhere else in N.O. do two “Audubons” meet.
These are the kinds of places I think attention should be focused.
Also, WR — what you suggest is exactly what I am trying to emphasize does NOT count as “namesakes.” If the two roads are named after different people, they are NOT namesakes unless their names happen to be the same. In your two examples, the names are different.

I was thinking about this whole “namesakes” issue today in the shower, where I do most of my thinking. Let’s subject this to a little logic. The lines in question:
The namesakes meeting
Near this site.
First, to get it out of the way, I think it is safe to conclude that “this site” refers to the treasure ground.
Mostly we have been thinking of the “namesakes” as a confirmer of sorts, a way to give us confidence that our pet theory might be correct, should something fitting the description of “namesakes” show up near a favored spot. But why not
start
there? Here are 3 definitions of
namesake
that I pulled from online sources:
1. “A person or thing that has the same name as another.”
2. “A person or thing named after another.”
3. “Namesake is a term used to characterize a person, place, thing, quality, action, state, or idea that has the same, or a similar, name to another. In the United States, the term is often used for a person or thing actually named after, rather than merely sharing the name of another. For example, if a person, place, or thing is named after another person, place, or thing, then the name target is said to be the namesake of the name source.”
Except for #3 (partially), these definitions agree that the “namesakes” share the same name. This helps us rule out certain pairs, like “Edwin and Edwina,” who may have been named after the same person (Edward Wilmot Blyden) but are not
themselves
namesakes. It also rules out (1) famous pairs of people, like Lewis and Clark; (2) pairs of people who have similar, but not identical, names, like Charles and Charlotte; and (3) entities with entirely different names, like gnomes and fays. I would also not regard married couples with the same married name as namesakes, but two unrelated people with the same name would qualify as namesakes by this thinking.
We have established that “namesakes” likely refers to people or things. But now let’s dissect “meeting.” If the namesakes in question are people, then the only way I can see these two lines having meaning are if two historic figures literally “met” near the treasure ground. For example, if Douglas Adams and Kirk Douglas had somehow met in New Orleans, that would qualify as “namesakes meeting.”
But I don’t think the lines refer to actual people literally meeting near the treasure ground, and here’s why. It’s a treasure hunt. Treasure hunts are all about locating a precise spot on the ground, so most clues and hints refer to places, not people. I think “namesakes” almost certainly refers to geographic features or places. but not just any features or places — they have to be the kind of features or places that can realistically “meet.” For example, historic structures or landmarks cannot be said “meet” each other because they just sit there. They do not “go” anywhere. On the other hand, features that can “go” and therefore “meet” might include:
Roads
(highways, streets, lanes, boulevards, circles, terraces, pikes, etc.)
Waterways
(streams, rivers, canals, brooks, creeks, etc.)
Here are some fictitious examples of namesakes meeting:
Intersection of Clemens Blvd. and Clemens St.
Merger of Lupin Rd. and Lupin Hwy.
Mississippi River and Mississippi Ln.
Jackson Hwy. and Old Jackson Hwy.
I would even go so far as to suggest that one of the namesakes in question
could
be “stationary,” as long as the other one is not. For example, we might encounter:
Pontchartrain Ln. meeting Lake Pontchartrain
Canal St. terminating at Canal Cemetery
Personally, I think we ought to be scouring maps of New Orleans for places that fit this description, then seeing if they fit with the rest of the verse. I am aware that there is room for disagreement here, but like most people expressing opinions, I think mine is right.
Clearly, I take long showers.

I was just thinking along those lines where Folly near Charleston is also an architectural term for a decorative structure or building.

The same T. Moore, Esq., appeared in the same book as [I think] you pulled the C. Leftly, Esq., poem from (The Poetical register, and repository of fugitive poetry).
Intolerance
specifically, did not appear.

forest_blight

I was thinking about this whole “namesakes” issue today in the shower, where I do most of my thinking. Let’s subject this to a little logic. The lines in question:
The namesakes meeting
Near this site.
1. “A person or thing that has the same name as another.”
2. …

Esquire? Squire?
… per wikipedia: “
In the United States, the suffix Esq. most commonly designates individuals licensed to practice law
“

LOL, Boston!!!

Unknown

Unknown:
since ‘fette’ is French for “party”)

Not quite. The French word is “FETE” not fette.

True — which would leave us with the possibility of:
OLDE T FETE
Which might be considered “Old Tuesday Party”  — but is seems more a a reach since it’s Fat Tuesday, and not old.  Perhaps I missed some letters, or this is just not what the anagram means to say.
I do have a feeling it is a clue for something, as this type of thing occurs in the other verses I have worked on so far.  I will keep poking at it. . . .

meow – I’m all for new ideas, but I think you’re really, really on the wrong track here. T E D E F L O E T also spells:
delete oft = must be where they manufacture keyboards
doe fettle = where can we find sand and deer? Florida!
dote fleet = where the Navy is celebrated? Virginia!
dottel fee = what states have a tobacco tax? All of them. Must be a U.S. casque
fee lotted = a place where they divvy up moneys received? Las Vegas
feel toted = ah, a ski lift! Colorado
feet toled = transparent organic light-emitting devices on your feet
felted toe = moccasins! must be Wisconsin
feted tole = gilded metalware for parties – where do they make costume jewelry?
lofted tee = a golf course at high altitude; again, Colorado
…and dozens more
You can make these anagrams mean anything you want, so they’re simply not helpful. Don’t waste your time!

Unknown

Unknown:
dote fleet = where the Navy is celebrated? Virginia!

To De Fleet!!
Let’s all go get enemas!!

I have recent reason to believe I can confirm that verse 2 goes with New Orleans, which I posted in another thread, but will re-post here:
By going through the poem, line by line, top-to-bottom, and crossing out duplicate letters that are not on the same line (sort of like eliminating pairs of tiles from a mah-jong game), the following letters are left:
J C V W U L O M M Y A K E E N R S I
when anagrammed, these can spell:
ORLEANS KEY W VI MJC MU (Orleans kew, Ward 6, Mahalia Jackson Center — I have no idea what ‘MU’ could be)
Also, by circling all the doubled letters in order of appearence , you can get the string:
T E D E F L O E T
you can spell:
OLDE FETTE  (which to me screams Mardi Gras, since ‘fette’ is French for “party”)
So I think after this, I’ll wander over to the “It must be somewhere in the Big Easy”  Camp, and use the same method on the other verses, and post whatever I get in the appropriate spot.  Of course, if I am wrong in my method, as I have been before, then I am wrong and no hard feelings.  But I shall keep researching to see what I can dig up when my copy of the full book comes in

Following up on Forest’s comment —
Sadly, the Secret isn’t about anagrams and coded messages.  It’s about interpreting the verses and images, which is a whole ‘nother animal.  There’s been one verse with an acrostic (SELOY), but that was more of a quirk of that particular solve.  I wish there were more ciphers and less interpretation, because at least there would be solid solves, and ciphers would stand up over the years… unlike having to try to reconstruct locations based on how they looked 30 years ago.

I have read through the entire Image 7 thread and need to go through this one for Verse 2. However, I speculated previously that due to New Orleans being at or below sea level, it is possible that the casque is buried above ground, not unlike Cleveland. This makes me think about two lines of the verse which have everyone stuck:
“Gnomes admire
Fays delight”
Is it possible that the Gnomes would be looking up and the Fays looking down? Gnomes being tiny and Fays (fairies) being larger or in the trees?

I find this association delightful: square containing circle may be hinting towards circle containing triangle. Also, book title: Abroad in America, seems like a hint for A. A.

I find this association delightful: square containing
circle
may be hinting towards
circle
containing triangle. Also, book title: Abroad in America, seems like a hint for A. A.

Fifteen rows down to the ground
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
Rows (pl.noun): a number of people or things in a more or less straight line.
Could be the rows in this case pertain to a series of fifteen paces. Paces use legs. Legs go down to the ground.
“In the middle of twenty-one” follows the line about fifteen rows and so a logical possibility may bring attention to the middle or place where both things meet. “From end to end,” doesn’t have to be a single straight line. It could be two vectors pointing in different directions like the hands of a clock. One vector is length 15 and the other is 21, both meeting in the middle at their origin. It’s not that complicated.

I was watching a Hallmark movie and they were digging up some ancient field. Anyway, someone in the movie said “we would have found the spoon a lot faster if we had a thermal energy drone.”
I have never heard of this before so I looked it up and found an article. Those drones are like $600 but you can get a thermal energy camera at Cabela’s for $200.
It might be an interesting tool to use before you dig….
https://weather.msfc.nasa.gov/archeolog … nsing.html

I’m not saying verse 2 should be paired with image 1.  However I do think the line
Only three stand watch
has a crossover to image 1 with the watch piece on the small tablestand.  Call it crossover or cameo, there is a track record of these one liners at play.

alt,
Not a bad place to take the Kids either. Something interesting on the fence there that surrounds the place. The Clydesdales are also at the Brewery and they are well taken care of. The tour is nice and the 2 free beers ain’t a bad thing either.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/bikeclimbsail/426154051/
Grant’s Farm is free , but probably because the parking is soooo expensive. It’s also on Highway 21. Thought I’d throw that in there.

Hello WhiteRabbit. Thought we could continue the discussion here. With several mentions of “gnomes” in the book, maybe we could tie it into the entire verse and possibly the casque site. I have always favored Montréal for this verse, but perhaps the text could shed some new insight on what “gnomes admire.”

Unknown

Unknown:
If we ordinary people keep our eyes open, we, too, can occasionally see a Tax Burden – escaping through a loophole, to join the Gnomes of Zurich.

…I’ll just repost that possible connection, which is that the last entry in the Field Guide,
The Tax Burden
, ends with the phrase “Gnomes of Zurich”.
(I’m not entirely sure whether that phrase is also used for bankers in general, as opposed to the original context of
Swiss bankers
. *edit*, Oh yeah, that link does imply that.)

These are all great possible tie-ins for “gnomes admire.” The idea of a bank (?royal bank of Canada) being near the casque site would fit nicely with the verses. …If only we knew where to start at ‘the place where jewels abound,’

“At a place where jewels abound”
current theories being explored:  Jewlery Box, Crown
I do not think a name of Diamond, Ruby, Croix, etc… works
here since it is stating jewels which by its vagueness would assume
variety.
Are there any other ideas?
Being partial to my idea (just my nature)  why would he
later use the term palaces if he didn’t want you to be steer towards
royalty?
Lets discuss…. I feel this is ripe for picking.

“Here is a soverign people
who build palaces to shelter
their heads for a night!”
Why the exclamation point?  Only one or two other
exclamation points in the verses.  Can this be used
for sarcasm, emphasis, surprise??
These peopel are not sheltering themselves, their wholeselves,
just their heads and ONLY at night.  These soverign people
by defiition are free to go about their will and they seem to waste
their resources over building for something seemingly minimal.
That in essence is a commentary on “The Sport of Kings”, Horseracing,
a waste of money termed as sport.  Horseracing, specifically the kentucy
derby was an import from England.  It is a direct model of the Ebson Derby.
Do we have soverign people in the United States, royalty?  Yes, I originally
thought that was pointing to Canada, but I think now that would be
too direct a clue.  And besides, no one has seceded and Canada is more
socialist than other coutries, esp. the United States.
The only other soverign people aroud are the Native Americans.

For a good article of what I am talking
about for those who do not know
horse racing… read this:
http://www.boston.com/globe/search/stor … ntucky.htm
After reading that, image our poet selecting the location
going there and thinking about what to write.

head – 4a.  One of a number;individual
Head of horses is used as frequency as the well known
head of cattle.

Merlot Brougham

Well, if that man over there is Seabass…

Make it four Boilermakers!

MrSeabass

Near this site. = close = shut or sealed = tomb or vault = Tomb Raider = Lara Croft = Angelina Jolie = Gone in 60 Seconds = Gone in One minute = minute = minutemen = watchmen = Dr. Manhattan = Manhattan project = Oppenheimer = Trinity test = Trinity = Neo = one.
The treasure is obviously buried underneath a large number 1 somewhere.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Everything is up for grabs until the casques are unearthed.
This verse though does not give a path to travel,
it places you at the exact spot to dig.
Work it through and tell me the namesakes.

Trohn

Everything is up for grabs until the casques are unearthed.
This verse though does not give a path to travel,
it places you at the exact spot to dig.
Work it through and tell me the namesakes.

Maybe you have something there—the namesakes could be the Krewes names! Check this out:
http://www.novareinna.com/festive/krewes.html
Ther are a lot of things that could be ‘namesakes’ there.
ck

Maybe corvus7corax is onto something after all. Right between that neighborhood (
where jewels abound
?) and Lake Pontchartrain is the Mardi Gras Fountain:
Those little dots around the fountain are tiled emblems of the “carnival krewes” responsible for decking out parades, floats etc. for Mardi Gras. The place was renovated a couple of years ago, but dates back to 1962. I would give a lot to see how those tiled emblems were arranged before renovating. Plenty of the emblems feature royalty, and the main plaque mentions “royal crests,” possibly in line with
sovereign people
.
Here is an animated collage:
http://www.photographicvr.com/mardi_gras_fountain/

The first line:  At the place where jewels abound
Initially it leads us to New Orleans and the float parades, possibly specifically the 1906 Rex float “Where jewels abound”.
Upon locating the casque, think of a kind of jewels being a ‘crown jewels’ representing a king and def. of ‘abound’ is ‘in great number’.  St. Louis Cemetery No.1.  St. Louis King of France and “No.1” is a great number.  His namesakes, the cemetery and the street meet at Basin St.

…re: “Only three stand watch”, bit of a stretch, but the Jackson statue is one of three.
http://www.kirchnerprints.com/BRONZE%20 … ANDREW.htm
For “In the middle of twenty-one”, again, bit of a stretch, but I’m still interested in the possibility that it might relate to a position in an “XXI” on the clock, interpreting Jackson Square as a clockface in some way. (I think this might be where that “Plaza” sign is, but I’m not sure.)

Back to the Artillery Park cannon that may be our P7 clock hour hand: inside the two larger circles on the hour hand look to be the numbers 6 and 1. The cannon happens to be an 1861 Parrot Rifle Cannon and it says so on one of the myriad plaques surrounding the monument

WR,
When I was working on this theory in the past I came up with this…
In the middle of 21 from end to end
These used to be stone, but they all existed before 2006 and 1980, each one replaced as years went on
15 rows down to the ground, meaning look down, you’ll see 15 rows.
If you look at the whole area, you’ll notice the brickwork around the monument looks very similar to the face of the clock, with a narrower inner circle (the stone work around the garden the statue is on, and a thicker outer ring.

One problem I found with that, Decibel–the posts seem to have changed over the years. I don’t know if the *number* has changed, but the arrangement has changed. These current iron bollards replaced the former wood ones in 2008 because of water and termite damage. You can see the old ones in Google Maps if you go back to 2007.
Now, what *hasn’t* changed, I don’t think, is that Lafayette Ave. is 21 blocks long. 11 blocks one direction from the park, 9 the other, and the park would be the 21st. And Gallier Hall (across St. Charles St. from the square) has 15 steps.
I’m big on Lafayette Park, and I like the idea that the walkways inspired the hour hand, but it’s hard to ignore the possibility that the Artillery Park cannon may be the inspiration for the clock hands.

I have found faint markings on all of the images. It appears to show the exact location of the casque. If you look below the post on the image for Chicago you can make out a faint V underlined by and arrow. If you look at the image for the casque found in Cleveland you will find a circled cross underneath the wall where it was found.
In the new Orleans picture near the dog head(or Guardian) you will also find a circled X, a cartoon of Louis Armstrong, what appears to be a river, and other drawings in that area of the picture. Maybe that is the map..it also looks like there is a drawing of the park (looks like Jackson Square) in one of the faint markings. I think the reason the author thought it would be easier is because he made the exact locations known by these really faint markings. Just a guess…

Frisco

I think the most likely explanation is the plaque that 421 mentioned has the words “near this site” on it and where the French and Spanish soldiers met during the Civil War. (
http://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/ … illery.jpg
)

WTF? Is that the plaque above the fifteen steps? I love that.
If you consider the random sign quotes in the FOY verse, I don’t think “the namesakes meeting” necessarily has to be directly related to the “near this site” quote. The namesakes could be anything really; maybe the
four seasons statues
in the square…?
I still like these signs on Jackson Square, for the flowers, and the “keep stone” (stone keep?) from the litany, and the “Place” (Place d’Arms) where jewels abound (crown), and the arm/Armas. I’d be interested to know what that plaque on the ground behind the fence says.
…and let’s not forget the “Preserved” inscription in the centre of the square.
Re: the gnomes and fays, the latter could just be a French link; the “Fays of France”.

There seems to be enough evidence for Salt Lake City for this painting to try the next step of matching a verse. A few things about Verse 2 seem to ring true for me.
Here is a sovereign people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their heads for a night!
These lines always fit the Mormons of Salt Lake City for me.
My real purpose for this post is not those lines though. I want to share some thoughts on:
Gnomes admire
Fays delight
These lines seem so out of place. As gathered from dictionaries and Wikipedia a
Gnome is dwarflike creature who lives underground and guards buried treasure.
So what is would a gnome admire? Gold color? Gems?
I use to think Fay was only a reference to Fairies, but a recent internet search revealed another interesting Fay. Fay Wray was an actress best known for her role as Ann Darrow in the original
King Kong
movie. It turns out Fay Wray grew up in Mormon communities including Salt Lake City. I’m not sure what that all means, but I thought I should share in case someone can make sense of it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fay_Wray

Only three stand watch
I’ve noticed you can find
three
things standing watch many places. I think the part of this line that may help us is the word
only
.
Why did BP use “only”?
Why not just say “Three stand watch”?
“Only” implies there are no more; just these.
This leads me to a monument located in Temple Square. In Mormon history a group of
three
leaders signed a statement in 1830 that an angel had shown them the golden plates from which Joseph Smith, Jr. said he translated the
Book of Mormon
and that they had heard God’s voice testifying that the book had been translated by the power of God. These three men became known as the “
three
witnesses”. A monument for these three witnesses stands prominently in Temple Square.
Witnesses can imply “only”. Since witnesses are the
only
people that would have witnessed a specific event, maybe this has some merit. Does this fit “Only three”?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Witnesses
Three Witnesses Monument

What about this:
http://protophoto.com/picture.html?pic=5656
I can’t tell if there are three at the top or not, though…

Killian32

I can’t tell if there are three at the top or not, though…

According to the website below, there are 3 people on the monument. “On July 24, 1947, exactly 100 years after his declaration, a heroic-sized bronze sculpture of Young and two of his colleagues was placed atop a 60-foot pedestal overlooking the Valley.”
http://www.thisistheplace.org/titp_monument.html

At the place where jewels abound
– Refers to the Sunlife Building which borders Dorchester Sq on Metcalfe St. It is well known that during WWII the British Crown Jewels as well as gold reserves for several European countries were stored here for safekeeping.
Fifteen rows down to the ground
– While the Sunlife Building is in fact 26 stories tall, you can only count 15 rows down to the ground, where you would be standing. See pic
:
http://imgur.com/W3RPt2v
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
– Again, Sunlife. When you stand at the entrance to the building (facing Dorchester Sq), you are standing in the middle 21 columns of windows. (There are actual Romanesque columns on the building, but they do not run “from end to end”).
The columns of windows do run from end to end.
(Notice we are counting rows of squares when counting the 15 rows and 21 columns. This may be why checkerboards are stressed in Image 9).
Only three stand watch
– There are only three human statues in Dorchester Square: Prime Minister Laurier, Scottish poet Robbie Burns, and the soldier restraining his horse on the Boer War Monument.
As the sound of friends
Fills the afternoon hours
-People enjoying Dorchester/Dominion Sq.
Here is a sovereign people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their heads for a night!
– Windsor Hotel, located on Peel St. opposite the Sunlife Building, which also borders Dorchester Sq. The name of Windsor is sovereign as the House of Windsor is the royal house of the UK as well as the Commonwealth (including Canada). The Windsor Hotel itself was lavish and enormous (palatial) before 1957 when it was extensively damaged. It was literally a host to royalty, King George VI and Elizabeth famously stayed here on their royal tour in 1939. The term “sovereign people” can also signify the Square’s former name of Dominion Square, as dominion means “sovereignty or the territory of a sovereign or government”
Gnomes admire
Fays delight
– General knowledge says gnomes live in gardens, fairies live in trees. This is not a specific statement.
There are trees and a flower bed in Dorchester Sq. Old pictures show there has always been a large ring shaped flower bed around the Boer War Monument.
The namesakes meeting
Near this site
– Namesakes of Windsor? There is a Victoria fountain in Dorchester Sq.
Queen Victoria was a member of the House of Windsor. She had the name before the Hotel Windsor was built, so is the hotel her namesake? Again, Dorchester was called Dominion Square in 1980. Possibly he is referring to how Windsor is a namesake of Dominion.
It might not be important.
Verse 2 seems to point to Dorchester Sq, and even gives a general line to follow (the front entrance of the Sunlife).
If you follow that line across the park, it will lead you across the Boer War Monument and on to the Windsor.
The precise location on where to dig may be given by the “X” diagram on Image 9, as that symbol has not led to a physical location thus far. It seems to read PX7. This may refer to the shape of the paths in Dorchester Sq., the “P” may stand for pillar (on the Sunlife building). “P” may stand for Peel Street.

At the place where jewels abound
– Refers to the Sunlife Building which borders Dorchester Sq on Metcalfe St. It is well known that during WWII the British Crown Jewels as well as gold reserves for several European countries were stored here for safekeeping.
Fifteen rows down to the ground
– While the Sunlife Building is in fact 26 stories tall, you can only count 15 rows down to the ground, where you would be standing. See pic
:
http://imgur.com/W3RPt2v
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
– Again, Sunlife. When you stand at the entrance to the building (facing Dorchester Sq), you are standing in the middle 21 columns of windows. (There are actual Romanesque columns on the building, but they do not run “from end to end”).
The columns of windows do run from end to end.
(Notice we are counting rows of squares when counting the 15 rows and 21 columns. This may be why checkerboards are stressed in Image 9).
Only three stand watch
– There are only three human statues in Dorchester Square: Prime Minister Laurier, Scottish poet Robbie Burns, and the soldier restraining his horse on the Boer War Monument.
As the sound of friends
Fills the afternoon hours
-People enjoying Dorchester/Dominion Sq.
Here is a
sovereign
people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their heads for a night!
– Windsor Hotel, located on Peel St. opposite the Sunlife Building, which also borders Dorchester Sq. The name of Windsor is
sovereign
as the House of Windsor is the royal house of the UK as well as the Commonwealth (including Canada). The Windsor Hotel itself was lavish and enormous (palatial) before 1957 when it was extensively damaged. It was literally a host to royalty, King George VI and Elizabeth famously stayed here on their royal tour in 1939. The term “
sovereign
people” can also signify the Square’s former name of Dominion Square, as dominion means “sovereignty or the territory of a
sovereign
or government”
Gnomes admire
Fays delight
– General knowledge says gnomes live in gardens, fairies live in trees. This is not a specific statement.
There are trees and a flower bed in Dorchester Sq. Old pictures show there has always been a large ring shaped flower bed around the Boer War Monument.
The namesakes meeting
Near this site
– Namesakes of Windsor? There is a Victoria fountain in Dorchester Sq.
Queen Victoria was a member of the House of Windsor. She had the name before the Hotel Windsor was built, so is the hotel her namesake? Again, Dorchester was called Dominion Square in 1980. Possibly he is referring to how Windsor is a namesake of Dominion.
It might not be important.
Verse 2 seems to point to Dorchester Sq, and even gives a general line to follow (the front entrance of the Sunlife).
If you follow that line across the park, it will lead you across the Boer War Monument and on to the Windsor.
The precise location on where to dig may be given by the “X” diagram on Image 9, as that symbol has not led to a physical location thus far. It seems to read PX7. This may refer to the shape of the paths in Dorchester Sq., the “P” may stand for pillar (on the Sunlife building). “P” may stand for Peel Street.

one idea i had for “as the sound of friends” :
http://friendsofcitypark.com/about.html
started in 1979
notice it also says “Storyland fairytale playground with more than twenty larger-than-life exhibits showcasing scenes and characters from favorite children’s stories. “
“fill the afternoon hours”……something like this sign, that tells the hours of operation, on the outside of storyland
http://flickr.com/photos/rogie_la/2070907577/

Glossiphoniidae

Very well stated, MF.

I guess I’m not as 100% set in stone as everyone on the verses, although I agree entirely with what you say. I think things can be tweaked slightly and it doesn’t make the new pairings an outright
no
.
There are some ambiguous references that somehow everyone takes for granted now which have reasonable connections to some of the other cities. This is where I think Preiss was a little more deliberately tricky. “Seek the columns” are the columns in Image 4 rather than Image 8. Using Mark Twain to put us in San Francisco rather than somewhere along the Mississippi if that is indeed what he did.
Like it or not, there are two sets of Edwin/Edwina’s to work with.
His “strongest tower” quote is a reference to the author and not the subject matter of the quote.
The Twain Thing
Granted, there are some that are unshakable, such as Verse 11, but I’ll freely admit I’m not quite sure why Verse 12 is considered sacred, other than the Isle of B which wreaks havok on a lot of the NY theories. Spelling grey with an E continues to bother me. I understand Gershwin and all that, but to say this makes us 100% positive and not even entertain other options? I’m still exploring a little bit. Maybe I’m wasting time, who knows.
There was some thought into where the other verses go when I was toying around with verse 2, and I wasn’t completely dissatisfied with the outcome.

Euhirudinea

“Perfect” means without flaws. So unless there are at least three casques in New Orleans, or all three solves lead to the same place, only one can be “perfect”. The other two can not. With all the success being claimed in that city, I’m leaning toward the former.

i mean perfect applications as in matches the whole line…clay being ground doesnt explain the 15 rows, hence my perfectly reasonable response…

14 rows of square pavers then (you can see in the picture with the flowers) the 15th row is a smaller rectangular paver…
So the question for me… I believe you are right about not in a flowerbed… but did it have flowers in 82?
I have a feeling it did…

We can’t even be sure it had the pavers, let alone the flowers.
But probably it did.

Glossiphoniidae

OK, I had too much fun researching and linking the theory to give it away. It’s legit, but it’s creative. Too many connections to write down. I think you all will have more fun figuring it out yourselves… if you enjoy some research anyways; otherwise, don’t bother. That’s just my two cents, well, maybe just a tad more. Let me know if you want to discuss, cause I did find an obvious (maybe too obvious) place in the middle of twenty-one where jewels abound. I think the image is one of those jewels. You’ll probably find it if you look around. Interestingly (imho), just like Chicago and Cleveland, the prominent image of location is large, and directly center.
I am almost certain the spot is correct.

feel free to post the “iconic” image.

Unknown

Unknown:
the “PRES” clue in the wood below the clock face means

what’s a “Pres” clue?

I’m still curious as to what the members think the “PRES” clue in the wood below the clock face means. You know my reason, what is yours?

When I pointed out that the great number of iconic lamp posts specific to Canal Street in New Orleans were very similar in shape to a standard jewel hung type earring, shecrab pointed out that I was choosing a metaphor over an actual object.  She missed the point which was very clear that the actual PLACE of Canal Street is a whole lot better than redundantly relating the first line of the verse to the city itself.  I think picture 7 does its part to pinpoint a city with it’s lat/long and other dominating characteristics.  Cleveland and Chicago also relied on picture based reference to size up the town location.  When it comes to verse, each line fingers a specific detail along a path and with vantage to the treasure ground location.
Verse 2, Line 1, Canal Street.

The
Étienne de Boré
plaque in Audubon Park doesn’t have a “near this site”, but it does at least have a “this site”. Would be interesting to see some pics of the surroundings.

That’s really interesting — thanks gray. I didn’t know about the fountain at all.

directly in front of the building is North South Diamond St…
It is divided by a long block median…
Note this area flooded in katrina,
changed 4 years after the publication when the convention center was put it in.

malted – that building is the Fulton Place Parking Center. Can you find out when it was built? It looks like it may be newer than 1981.

Forrest

I believe that if BP wanted us to dig at the base of something with 8 rows of brick (very possible) he would have just said “8 rows down to the ground.” Besides that, as I have already said, there are not even close to 21 bricks across the top.

I was refering to counting the bricks and mortar on the bottom row to get the 21 in the same manner as we are suggesting to count the 15 rows (brick and mortar)
I specifically said NOT the top.

i haven’t ruled out City Park!
i’ve been wondering if the boy in the picture could be a “passing fancy” from p. 108.  the baseball hat, argoyle socks, and the knickers could all be passing fancies (trends)  ;D
passing fancies are French/German/English and could be anywhere.
they are also cultural, which makes me think of sculptures and museums
Forrest, is it possible to dig behind the sarah lavinia hyams sculpture?  it was put there in 1921…………………19…….
21
………..that could be our “21” ……even tho’ it was built in 1914, it was opened in 1921..:
http://www.neworleanspast.com/art/id14.html
it says to the “little children”………..you know,  “little people”
i’m so glad we have a hunter there in new orleans!
here’s another picture, says 1914, but maybe somewhere there is a plaque that says opened in 1921:  (22nd row of pictures)
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl= … l%26sa%3DN
btw, there is the same exact sculpture/fountain at audubon park
the fish tail on the fountain kind of reminds me of the flowers in the image, and the shape of the fountain bowl is sort of like the shape of the clock in the image

slappybuns

i haven’t ruled out City Park!

slappybuns

i’ve been wondering if the boy in the picture could be a “passing fancy” from p. 108.  the baseball hat, argoyle socks, and the knickers could all be passing fancies (trends)  ;D
passing fancies are French/German/English and could be anywhere.

slappybuns

Forrest, is it possible to dig behind the sarah lavinia hyams sculpture?  it was put there in 1921…………………19…….
21
………..that could be our “21” ……even tho’ it was built in 1914, it was opened in 1921..:
http://www.neworleanspast.com/art/id14.html

slappybuns

i’m so glad we have a hunter there in new orleans!

I’m glad someone hasn’t.
p. 108 of what? Be happy to look into that.
It’s possible to dig behind the one in Audubon Park, but harder for the one in City Park. The reason we have checked these out is because there is an inscription detailing how Hyam donated her
jewels
to have both fountains built. The one in City Park is locked behind a gate in the amusement park area, next to Storyland. It is not open all the time.
The one in Audubon is still a possibility, but we haven’t been able to come up with a great fit for anything else near it yet.
Thanks, although it seems like you are in the minority.

Forrest, “passing fancies” are one of the fair people from the field guide in the book.  on page 56, they say they are “cultural” and on page 222 it says they are french/german or english. on page 109 it shows them flying around, and on page 108 it tells about them.
oh wow, i just saw the “love” on that page and i’m sure i’ve seen that in the sydney and waldo besthoff sculptural garden, brb
http://www.sawyerberson.com/Press/Press … d.park.pdf
p. 12
the word “love” is on p. 109 on the shirt of the big smiley face person
i really think that is the same!!!!
but, um i thought that sculpture garden came after 1981………Malted?
i’m sorry, right now i don’t have a scanner or printer
i always liked that archer in the sculptural garden because of the hand in the book….
i also liked the path from the museum to the sculptural garden

Forrest

I’m glad someone hasn’t.

I haven’t either Forrest.  If you remember correctly, while on an unexpected stay in the Big Easy, I DUG there.  I DUG where people believed to be a good candidate for a casque site.  Unfortunately, I came up empty handed and sadly left muddied but excited that I DUG where a casque ‘may’ have been.  I even thought I found our 15 & 21 nearby…but talk about a streeeeeeetch!  The difference between us is that I DUG.  Does this mean that we should toss City Park into the trash file and move on to another park?  Of course not, there is plenty of park left to explore…as is with Lafayette Square.  Before you get onto your N.O. residential horse and chastise me for trying to liken City Park to Lafayette Square….Yes, I know that City Park is MUCH larger than Lafayette Square.  Just because my wall idea may not be our 15 & 21 {it still may be…we just don’t know} it doesn’t mean the casque CAN NOT be buried next to Clay, McD, any one of several trees, or anywhere else in the square.
The only reservation I have with City Park is that it is sooo far away from most of the visual and written confirmers.  It is nowhere near Preservation Hall, it really has no tie ins with Mardi Gras, it {to my knowledge} is not on St. Charles Ave or anywhere near the SC Hotel, etc.  It is a great park for a casque but it really does not have a lot to get us there and I know how much “initially getting there” is important to you.
P7 just does not seem to have the plethora of visual confirmers as the Cleveland P did.  That is why I am soooo excited about the clock boy.  In relationship to other images used in other P’s, I think this is pretty much a dead ringer to the McD statue.  That is why I really like Lafayette Square…or perhaps very nearby.  If City Park were just down St. Charles Ave, I would be ALL OVER it because it is a better park.

slappybuns

but, um i thought that sculpture garden came after 1981………Malted?

The sculptural garden came long after 81, unfortunately. Hopefully it wasn’t built on top of the markers we were supposed to use!

look forrest,
it’s been open to the public since the beginning,
http://www.noma.org/sgarden/thecollection.html

not clear here but it looks like all the sculptures were moved in 1992 from their original locations.

maltedfalcon

not clear here but it looks like all the sculptures were moved in 1992 from their original locations.

Correct. The Sculpture Garden wasn’t located in City Park in the 80’s.

Cormac

Consider this though….
There are 15 ROWS….brick, mortar, brick, mortar, brick, mortar…etc.  DOWN TO THE GROUND.
Not 15 rows of BRICKS, but 15 ROWS. Count from the top row of mortar, under the horizontal bricks.

I believe that if BP wanted us to dig at the base of something with 8 rows of brick (very possible) he would have just said “8 rows down to the ground.” Besides that, as I have already said, there are not even close to 21 bricks across the top.

forest_blight

I looked, but Google books has nothing better to offer (yet) than this very book.
Have we really ruled out Story Land? Some points in its favor:
1. It has giant narcissus flowers that look just like the ones on the clock.
2. Three little pigs are there, and they surround an ideal-looking burial site (three stand watch / namesakes meeting).
3. It’s in City Park, a great setting for this sort of thing.
I don’t know how many fairy tales are depicted at Story Land, or the layout of the park, but if it’s arranged along a trail, and there happen to be 21 of them, well… need I say more?
NOLA locals??

Maybe we’ll run into some display at one of the possible sites. As you can see, all that the book tells us is that it was a Rex float in 1906.
Storyland looks great from the pics, I know. Besides the pigs and flowers, there is a grandfather clock, and several gnomes. The gnomes admire line has been driving me up the wall, I would love to get a good match for that.
Unfortunately it’s a gated theme park where they charge admission. At some point I found evidence confirming that it has been this way since it opened. There is no way you’d get away with bringing a shovel in there (without permission, at least.) So, you tell me…
I’ve been inside before, but not since reading The Secret. (Every time we go down there, it’s closed for some reason or another.) If we could find a decent match for the whole verse, I’d try to convince them to let us dig, but I don’t have very high hopes about the response.

forrest, i don’t guess you could dig around lee circle, huh?  but looking at lee circle from google earth, it looks like 15 rows to either edge, and it’s round and looks like our clock, lol…………just partially kidding.

this is the way i was reading the verse, which is prob the wrong way to read it
as for counting the blocks i was looking for something to count, and clay happen to be
in the center of count, then i saw the sign on clay of where he use to be, just throwing
counts out there ,as im runnig out of things in park besides the boy to make it work
the only other thing i can think of is, maybe something has blown away or replaced
for a count of 15 rows and 21 end to end
i have been looking at other parks also, not getting anything though
forrest thanks for feedback, and the pic of building too
At the place where jewels abound
Fifteen rows down to the ground
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
Only three stand watch
As the sound of friends
Fills the afternoon hours
Here is a sovereign people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their heads for a night!
Gnomes admire
Fays delight
The namesakes meeting
Near this site.

slappybuns

forrest, i don’t guess you could dig around lee circle, huh?  but looking at lee circle from google earth, it looks like 15 rows to either edge, and it’s round and looks like our clock, lol…………just partially kidding.

I really don’t think you could dig there, no. I have seen some other things that look really good from the air but not so much from the ground. I also think it’s important to keep in mind what BP had access to when he wrote the verses.