meow

Perhaps the author is playing with French/English translations?  A ‘row’ can be a term for Street — Like Ave, or Lane — and “ground” in French translates to “Terre” . . . so, 15 streets until you get to something with “Terre” in the name?  (Also, a ‘down’ is a land discription as well . . .)
I’m trying to remember what I know of the French Quarter, since my father’s side of the family is from that area.  All I do know currently is that New Orleans is not the city it once was, and crime and prices are on the rise.  If anyone goes treasure hunting in the city, they should best go with friends.

I can’t really think of any streets named ‘row’ anywhere in the city. And, if we were using French translations, they’d be ‘Rues’. But, strangely, the streets are labeled “Calle”.

Welcome, Forrest. I guess the namesakes are meeting on this site!

The Giant Squid

…So, in comparison:
Cleveland’s Rockefeller Park and Cultural Gardens:  254 acres.
Chicago’s Grant Park: 319 acres.
…

Using your own words… another point to City Park

If the actual “jewel” parks are a bust, then perhaps Lakeshore park, where the fountain is, is a viable option–though from what I understand, the area sustained a lot of damage from K.
However, in researching the location, I found this:
The Orleans Levee District is committed to the restoration of all properties owned and operated by the District and especially the lakefront.  The current plan is to bring back the lakefront area to its pre-Katrina splendor.  The District has received responses to an RFQ for Architects and Engineers to begin the design phase for repairs.  The funds for the restoration will come from FEMA (90% federal and 10% local) and insurance reimbursements.  The District has submitted damage claims to FEMA totaling almost $100 million dollars.  The roadway, seawall area, boat launch and fishing pier will be reimbursed by FEMA. The four shelter houses,
fifteen pavilions
, and the Mardi Gras Fountain will be covered by insurance.
There are 15 pavilions…though I don’t know how these might be considered “rows” of anything.
I discovered that “Jewel Street” connects the two halves of the park.
Also, does anyone know what the seawall looks like? Is it made of blocks or bricks or stone that can be counted?  Is it perhaps engraved with numbers of any kind?
Also: the ‘namesakes’ might meet at Elysian fields, another part of this area.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elysium
c

The Giant Squid

…From City Park:
1) Maybe
2) Not really ‘feeling’ Storyland. You’ve just got to go there to understand.
3) In late 1982, they gated off the entire botanical garden, so, we’ll have to see.

Forrest

…
Storyland in city park…the clock there is not that close of a match, just the metal flowers. Definitely no way you’re going to be able to dig up that kids park or get in after dark. I haven’t seen the gardens behind storyland, but they’re gated off now (weren’t in 1982.) So I -hope- that’s not it.
…

Squid, Forrest, what is the exact meaning of “gated off”?  can’t access this area anymore?

Unknown

Unknown:
As for Elysian Fields, I’ve given a bit of thought to that. There’s a quote by William Blake talking about the poems of Cowper, saying that Cowper’s work should be read in “Heaven, Havillah, Eden, and all of the places where jewels abound”. Elysian Fields evokes the previously named places, to be sure.

Well geez…this sounds as certain as the quote about the St. Charles hotel!!
For cryin’ out loud…why didn’t this get put on here before? Or did it?  (I find this discussion jumps from v.2 threads to v 5 threads to image threads–it’s sometimes very hard to trace a conversation.)

Unknown

Unknown:
There are a couple of tiny parks on Elysian Fields, and there are the ones in/around UNO. I’ll look next time.

I noticed Ponchartrain Park, Lake Oaks Park and the eastern (?) end of Lakeshore Park. There is also the golf course, but it’s unlikely he’d be able to dig holes in a golf course–that seems like something punishable.  the grounds around UNO are also rife with possibilities.
Something else I noticed: the seawall is quite intact here–and it’s a “stepped concrete wall.” stepped with ’15 rows’ of block maybe?
The thing that tells me this is a wall is the phrase “from end to end.” We’re talking about something with definite boundaries here–something that is viewed by its “length”–from end to end–as they noted about the football field earlier. A football field would qualify, but I ddin’t see one in the satellite pics. But the “15 rows down to the ground” part says that we’re looking for a structure that is composed of components in rows — vertically arranged — and components arranged side to side (from end to end) — horizontally arranged. That just screams “wall”.
Something else occurred to me while looking:  How many
lighthouses
are there? I know there’s one on the west side of the Lakeshore area, and one on the East–is there a third? (“only three stand watch”)  Or was there a third in the 80’s?  Why use the word “only” for something metaphoric? It seems to suggest that three is somehow is not enough–or not enough for the space. If one were talking about the three spires at St. Louis, why say “Only” three? However–if someone is referring to lighthouses along a shoreline, ONLY three is a pretty good observation that it may not be enough for the shoreline.
Sounds like a better bet to me than the three spires at Jackson Square and any other metaphorical interpretations.

I just answered my own question:  there ARE THREE LIGHTHOUSES.   :app)
http://www.atneworleans.com/body/lights-south.htm
Only three stand watch.

eljayo

Squid, Forrest, what is the exact meaning of “gated off”?  can’t access this area anymore?

eljayo:
Oh, I wholeheartedly believe that City Park (500+ acres) is a terrific place to hide treasure,
it’s my top candidate, immediately after Armstrong (32 acres).
As for being gated off, let me explain it as such.
Storyland, the Carousel Gardens, and the Botanical Gardens are all, more or less,
part of the same ‘complex’ of buildings in City Park.
But, each one has a seven-to-eight foot tall iron fence around it, separating it from the others. And, each
has a front gate.
From the looks of things, the fence was installed by the Rotary club of New Orleans in 1982.
I’d be willing to bet money that there was a similar fence before that time, and the one
installed in 1982 was merely a renovation.
I don’t, however, believe it’s in Storyland, but I do believe it might be elsewhere
in City Park.
The main problem with Storyland, is that it’s a tiny area (probably the total size of a
football field), with winding paths throughout. At no point can somebody ‘hide’ while
digging, as you’re in direct view of the attendant who charges admission for the Storyland front gate,
in an enclosed area, and directly visible from the parking lot.
The botanical gardens are similar, with a front gate and attendants and all of that.
There are other areas around that complex that are easily diggable, but I haven’t done
enough homework to match any verse or other image.

shecrab

Well geez…this sounds as certain as the quote about the St. Charles hotel!!
For cryin’ out loud…why didn’t this get put on here before? Or did it?  (I find this discussion jumps from v.2 threads to v 5 threads to image threads–it’s sometimes very hard to trace a conversation.)

I’m actually the first to have mentioned this quote.

The Giant Squid

1) Give it up. Please folks. There are literally thousands of people walking by and through there every single hour. It’s like digging in Times Square.

You’ve got to remember that we are looking for items that were buried over 26 years ago.  Plenty can happen in that time period.  some of the casques could be buried under asphalt or excavated (spelling?) unknowingly by now.  Markers that the author used may have been moved.  Just because it may be wide open and well patrolled now, doesn’t mean that the author didn’t have the opportunity to hide one there back then.  Not saying he did, just that you can’t rule a place out just because it inaccessable today.

The Giant Squid

eljayo:
Oh, I wholeheartedly believe that City Park (500+ acres) is a terrific place to hide treasure,
it’s my top candidate, immediately after Armstrong (32 acres)….
As for being gated off, let me explain it as such…

Thanks Squid.
I agree with you that Storyland is more a confirmer (two flowers, purple sleeve/miss muffet, whale and gnomes in pic) than a spot. For the reasons I said before, I like more specimen garden “
Near this site
“.
The fact is that City Park Fit very well with verse 2 in his first 4 lines and lead us close to Storyland/gardens zone.
I like your effort and I’ll be expecting your thoughts about NO casque.
Thanks again

Fox-
without the blob, the legeater is without context.
(has anyone else found a checkered pattern on site to go
along with their other confirmers?)
This verse and image have very little play.  The verse does not
take one on a journey or tour like some others.
“The place where jewels abound” (not a place)
This single line dictates name recogonition – beyond a location in a city.
A jewel is something small precious fragile and sought after.
(to me – and I might be the only one – fits with race horse)
I can not deny that the Montreal lamp post is an exact fit.
“How many licks does it take to get to the center of a totsie pop?
The world may never know.”

Fox ,
I’m by no means giving up . I’m lost as where to go or do next . Anything you think I should check out let me know . Carol

CMSCHUT

I was looking up train signals and found this . Does it look like the picture ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Johnamacdonald1870.jpg

I still think this guy looks like our picture . I know it’s dated , but hey It’s a portrait .

I mean, those flowers on the columns at Mount Stephens Club.

Boogie ,
You are correct . There is no legeater in St louis .
Trohn,
I appreciate the help in directing me .

Here you go, boogie:

Not much luck resizing the top pic, but other than the music symbol,( or hockey logo), looks pretty good to me.  Can somebody make these the same size?
CMSCHUT, what do you mean about the legeater?
Wow.  Posting this at the same time FB.  Thanks

I was looking up train signals and found this . Does it look like the picture ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Johnamacdonald1870.jpg

Boogie,
You said  Previously that you had the feeling there wouldn’t be any legeater in St louis . I was there all day and I would say not also .

Hey now, don’t give up.  If I read you right, getting a little down.  You’ve been working too darn hard.  All these posts are here to stay so we can go back and forth.  Montreal, St Louis.  We’re all going to enjoy whatever, and whomever finds the next one.

Boogie ,
It’s what it’s going to be . I would love for it to be here , but I don’t see a  Legeater . The one in Montreal  is a perfect match and can’t be ignored .Did you see the troll on pg 6  . I know it’s a bit dated , but he does resemble it and it could very well be in a Museum etc somewhere there in Canada. I do like My hands though as the Old courthouse in St. louis .
Looks like wilhouse is onto the next one .  I know you all are in grave anticipation for that as well as wilhouse .

Trohn, w/o that legeater, I think all of your theories just dont add up.  Take it from the guy who was Convinced (and had all of the confirmers to back it) that P2 was in NM.
We all seem to be trying to hard….we find a place that something just fits and then force the rest.
Dont you dare give up in S.L. Cmshut!  BP confirmed a casque there…..if the legeater P isnt there…another one is.

CMSCHUT

I still think this guy looks like our picture . I know it’s dated , but hey It’s a portrait .

I didnt comment on this the first time because the image did not load but now looking at it….yes, I see a similarity here.  Especially if you look at a lampooned version of the same man.  Gotta love the exagerated nose…
not sure if this is our guy but definitely worth investigating…

Fox ,
I think I like your pic better. Looks like our lady/man. I was thinking on what Trohn said about the Horses and It brought to mind the  KING of beers right here in St. Louis . Those Clydsedales are not living Shabby. I really like the crowns on top of the buildings. Just a thought .

Johann, I agree, let’s try it. Why not? It can’t be any worse than New Orleans!
I say let’s see if there is a wall somewhere in Forest Park or Lafayette Square with ‘fifteen rows’ of blocks or bricks then count them from end to end to find block/brick #21. Consider that the wall may be outside the park, nearby.
That is my first guess. My second one is the addresses on the row houses. if there is a #21 I’ll be very pleased indeed. My third guess would be some sort of number of something–i.e, the 90 trees in Forest Park. My fourth is that 21 means some sort of game–blackjack–or reference to cards that make 21–the ace/face or ace/ten combo. I know there’s a casino near the area as well–and the river has boat casinos–but did they in 1980? I dunno.
Exploration was done in St. Louis as regarding image 9 and verse 7, not verse 2. Perhaps the different verse will lead to different connections.
I would also check out the area around The Muny–according to the history of the place, it was founded as a place to hold “a masque and pageant”–and that could account for the pageant mask in the image. I just can’t find enough info on line to ask the right questions!
Gnomes and fays meeting—that would be the Square, since that is the reason it was set aside in the first place as a park.
The thing that is puzzling is “only three stand watch.”  There are only two statues in Lafayette (if statues are what BP meant, though that’s sort of doubtful here.) I don’t know what’s in Forest Park. The link didn’t work on the home page for the place. Forest Park does have a ‘tree walk’ where you can see over 90 different trees in less than a mile, so maybe it’s talking about three of the same kind of tree–or a kind there are only three OF?  When I was looking into NO, I saw that lighthouses could reasonably be said to “stand watch.” Maybe it’s something like that–or maybe it’s some other type of “sentry” thing–lights, lampposts, spiritual/religious ornament–even EYES.
And look at this page:
http://stlouis.missouri.org/citygov/par … story.html
Look at the third picture down from the top. What is that ‘archlike’ thing in that picture? Is it still there?
Take lots of pictures!!

Talking about Lat/Log references in Pics…
What is St.Louis latitude? 38º? Do you see any reference to this number on P7? Or what Pic match this verse leading us to St.Louis?

you could make an argument for a 38 in a few places on Image 7.
Here’s just one of them. Remember, the latitude and longitudes are not exact. Nor (apparently) are all of the numbers pointing to them. In Image 2, I clearly got LLs for Canada, but others found them for Charleston SC.  So there’s a lot of interpretation.

shecrab

you could make an argument for a 38 in a few places on Image 7.
Here’s just one of them. Remember, the latitude and longitudes are not exact. Nor (apparently) are all of the numbers pointing to them. In Image 2, I clearly got LLs for Canada, but others found them for Charleston SC.  So there’s a lot of interpretation.

Agree… could be could be. (I’ve my own theory but don’t have a casque, so…)

i’m sorry eljayo, i did do a search on who said it, i somehow got 2fast’s name.  sorry

forest_blight

I like that part of town for this, too, shecrab. But couldn’t “jewels abound” simply refer to New Orleans? I mean, it’s all about the beads down there.

Beads arent jewels, I dont think that makes sens.

You know, bead necklaces at Mardi Gras? Cheap costume jewelry?

point Forest_Blight

Still I think it means the streets named after the jewels
At the place where jewels abound
no place in New Orleans fits that better then the are of NO encompassed by Lakeshore drive, marconi drive and Robert E Lee Blvd. It includes several parks and a levy area, including one park called Harlequin Park.
Fifteen Rows Down to the Ground.
In the Middle of Twenty-one
From end to end
Only three stand watch.
This I believe is the section detailing the exact location of the casque based on objects visible in the area in 1981. My best guess is the Rows down to the ground means something down the slope of the levy, down to ground level…
As the sound of Friends
Fills the afternoon hours.
Indicating a park or recreation area.
Here is a Sovereign people
who build palaces to shelter
their heads fo a night
Quote to definitively associate this verse with New Orleans
Gnomes admire
Fays Delight
The namesakes meeting
Near this site
From this location Storyland in City park is less then 5 minutes travel across the canal and the namesakes of Gnomes and fairies all meet in storyland.

Unknown

Unknown:
Gnomes admire
Fays Delight
The namesakes meeting
Near this site
From this location Storyland in City park is less then 5 minutes travel across the canal and the namesakes of Gnomes and fairies all meet in storyland

You don’t have to go that far….the Mardi Gras memorial is just north of this area…and the Krewes are all memorialized there with plaques. The “namesakes” could be the krewes.
http://mardigrasfountain.com/
http://mardigrasfountain.com/krewes.htm
Check out the Krewe of Apollo–prominently beneath the
arched
sun is a date: 1929.

Shecrab,
How many fountains are there in that Mardi Gras fountain?…21?
I was sure that the harlequin would have been on one of those plaques!
AP

Er, there’s just the one fountain. It has more than 21
jets
of water–but “in the middle of 21” would be smack in the middle of the water. I doubt that would work.
I find it interesting that there isn’t a single Krewe that was founded in 1921.

Shecrab,
I was not thinking of stepping into the middle of the fountain,
but bisecting it on the perimeter…It would be an unusual way
of referring to “the middle” of twenty-one…if there were diggable
areas around the border of the fountain.
Just thinking….
AP

johann

2ast4u2c– I am sorry.  Ihave just noticed your message.  I would like to hear your ideas (we all would) and see the pictures.

Didn’t make it up there over the weekend.  My girlfriend’s daughter got sick.  We are going to try to make it up there within the next month.  There are several areas I’d like to walk around and get some pics.

Hi guys, possible new theory for New Orleans and verse 2. Hope this can be of help!
viewtopic.php?f=32&t=7362

the statue in lafayette is pretty convincing though. it definitely warrants more investigation.

shecrab

Who says he did?  Just because they’re similiar doesn’t mean they were used specifically.

shecrab

The narcissus is Decembers flower, December’s birthstone is Turquoise (the gem) and the clock says 12:00–for the 12th month. Any narcissus is going to look pretty much like that.

shecrab

And any long, ruffled sleeve will also look like that. Why would anyone want to depict just a
sleeve
from Storyland, when there are so many other things that make more sense?

agreed
agreed
and agreed

The problem with Jackson Square is that it would be hard to get into in the midddle of the night and Armstrong Park does not look like it matches or could have matched the verse. I think jewels abound does not mean alot of jewels near the place of the casque but is refering to the jewel you get for finding the casque. Namesakes meeting is a crucial clue. The correct location has or had a statue bust etc of whoever the park or area of the park is named after. I think the mask is the namesakes meeting near the site. I think the ferrytale theam of the image is trying to protray storyland to get you to the right park. As with Jackson Square this area was likely locked up at night and likely frequented by police. Their are three areas of City Park that should be investigated closely Marconie Meadow and Scout Island are two I do not rember the third one off the top of my head.

And something I learned today: “In the middle of 21” might just refer to Lafayette Square again, because there are 21 live oak trees in the park. Actually, there are 22 now. But “in the middle of 21, from end to end” might refer to one edge of the square where there is a long row of hedges or bushes, and the 21 llive oaks are arranged around the square.  I have a pic of this—actually a map. I’ll try to post it later.

ooooohhhh, from the “spanish” sign……….thanks
cw you ole pirate
i think egbert found it behind that big stonework, and it seems the back was like a hill, but i’m not sure, someone who has been there could tell us

You walked right into that one.  😀
(…yeah, good point cw. Guess we shouldn’t interpret flower beds too broadly…)

wow, that sure confuses me, if the litany  points to the verse to use, then look:
Turqoise the Fays of France
keep
:  stone
Rare as a blue midsummer’s day
and then verse 7:
“To the place
The casque is
kept”
http://www.frenchquartercondotrends.com/?p=1470
and she looks like ponce

Hey y’all — I started researching this in 2014 with a few friends, and then we kind of let it slide away. I live in New Orleans and work downtown (right in the middle of Jackson and Lafayette Squares, basically) and am by these sites all the time, constantly being haunted by this damn book. I just got re-caught-up on this thread and wanna get back into it. Anyone have any other new info not posted?

animatedgeoff, it’s great to have boots on the ground. “constantly being haunted by this damn book” pretty much sums up my life for the last 13 years, so I would appreciate it if you could locate and dig up a casque!

Any idea is worth exploration.

If this verse goes with P9 (see image 9 thread):
In the middle of twen  “t”  yone. Does hole 7 have a 15′ or a 15 timber elevated tee box?
Would it be buried in the middle of a tee box? Nah.

travis and i have this down to two spots…and we know how to figure out final spot to dig for sure. there are so many refs to both spots its hard to discount either, im waiting on him to do the last step we need to find out the location to dig.

Whew, just read all 16 pages in this thread. I have to say I am a little surprised that “Here is a sovereign people” hasn’t been talked about as meaning one of the states that has sovereignty, the commonwealths of Massachusetts, Virginia, Pennsylvania and Kentucy.
I read in the beginning of the thread some talk about Churchill Downs matching up with the namesake part so why not have Kentucky also match the verse because it is a state that has sovereignty?

Probably because it didn’t really matter in the context of the places we thought this verse might pertain to. It’s certainly an interesting idea, and one I never thought of, so once again, good job!

insatiable

Whew, just read all 16 pages in this thread. I have to say I am a little surprised that “Here is a sovereign people” hasn’t been talked about as meaning one of the states that has sovereignty, the commonwealths of Massachusetts, Virginia, Pennsylvania and Kentucy.
I read in the beginning of the thread some talk about Churchill Downs matching up with the namesake part so why not have Kentucky also match the verse because it is a state that has sovereignty?

I am the only one to favor this theory so I haven’t been posting about it (much)
and have been persuing the site to allow a review of the spot….
In Priess’ verses, he tends to use synonyms as often as possible
in order to allow subjectivity to the solves – sovereignty in this case probably can be replaced with
‘Royalty’, ‘King’ or ‘Queen’.
Horse racing is the ‘Sport of Kings’
With the same method, ‘Heads’ can also be replaced with a synonym.
(I have selected ‘horses’ obviously)

This is for Fox.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lewis_and_Clark_Expedition
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M._Lewis_Clark

Unknown

Unknown:
Cite Occums Razor, then avoid to address that it applies to this next question?

Unknown

Unknown:
They figured out the city and Lincoln, everything else was very very very vague.

To Eric:
Avoid it?? I did NOT avoid it.
I said that a jewel–an OBJECT, not a metaphor–is more LIKELY the answer than a metaphor. How is that avoiding anything?
To MF:
No it wasn’t.

TenByThirteen

It did take us about 9 months to find the location, but were seriously stumped at the final location. At that point we did call the Author and described all our clues and the locations of the multiple digs. Byron eventually sent us a photograph of the freshly turned earth and we furiously dug a hole about 3′ square and deep. Being frustrated, one of us threw the shovel at the wall of the hole and a little sliver of dirt fell off revealing the casque in the plexiglass box.

Pluse the M&B was wrong.  I’d say they really didn’t actually solve it, but came close and then BP helped them along.
And Egbert said, The Terminal Tower was just a general clevland clue, not connected to the site.
So I stand by my statement. The generic solution hasnt been found yet, Thats what I am trying to come up with.

Malt — why do you think there is a generic solution? I’m not sold on this idea.
It is true that Stadther’s first hunt followed pretty much the same generic recipe for every treasure. Once the formula was discovered, the treasures fell like dominoes. But all hunts don’t have to be that way. In BP’s shoes, I would try to make each one unique.

Why do I think there is a generic solution?
My first clue was when I noticed that The Chicago water tower and the Bowman statue were on the same street.
Then when I found out that the park that holds the Greek Cultural Garden and the Cleveland Terminal Tower were on the same street. I realized that My solution for San Francisco, was totally wrong. I had picked a part of the verse “Giant Pole” and reverse engineered it from there. I realized I truly did not understand anything about the image except the map was Golden Gate Park. Now I new that the Image contains a Path to arrive at the treasure ground, besides, lat/lon, it also must have site confirmers.
So I went back to image 1 and looked at it knowing it had much more to tell me.  I knew in Chicago and Cleveland the start of the path was an famous landmark . I knew the end of the path was another image. In image 1 I had Golden Gate Park and Lincolns head. she was pointint to 34 (in the reverse image).  Following those clues alone I arrived at Lincoln park where careful searching found Site confirmer images.
So by simply using the idea that there is a generic solution I have gotten farther in 2 months than I have since 1982.  I can see it also fits milwaukee, I suspect it works in Charleston as well, at this point I believe it to be universal because the odds on it being different/unique get longer and longer the more we find that follow this solution.
Thats why.

Okay, thanks. That sounds reasonable.

End to end
I think it most simply refers to “beginning and ending”.  Mardi Gras starts at 8am with the Krewe of Zulu and ends with the Krewe of Comus (and Rex).

‘Only three stand watch’

shecrab

I have less trouble believing that it is hidden in the infield of Churchill Downs than I do that it is in Kentucky. I don’t believe it’s anywhere but in New Orleans–but I DO think it might be hidden in the infield of the Fairgrounds racetrack.   The “three stand watch” there too. Three famous racehorses are already  buried there.

Shecrab-
I do not discount that a casque was buried in New Orleans but the verse/image pairing is not this one (verse 2, image 9)
From memory, I think it is (verse 7 – Twain’s Interest, and image 7 – White mask and Clock)
That verse takes you down the Mississippi River Walk from the open air cafe to the Boat Docks near the now casino.

Namesakes ….
Who is the founder of Churchill Downs?
Block
Best Answer – Chosen by Voters
The track is named for John and Henry Churchill, who leased 80 acres of land to
their nephew
,
Colonel Meriwether
Lewis Clark
, Jr. (grandson of explorer William Clark). Clark was president of the Louisville Jockey Club and Driving Park Association, which formed in 1874. His father-in-law, Richard Ten Broeck, was an accomplished horse breeder and trainer, and introduced Clark to horse racing, attending the English Derby at Epsom Downs outside London.
Downs filled a void in Louisville left by the closing of Oakland and Woodlawn, two earlier race courses.

Meeting….
Lewis and Clark at the Falls of the Ohio: A Timeline
By James J. Holmberg
The Filson Historical Society
Ca. March 1803 – William Clark (and George Rogers Clark) moves across the Ohio River to Clarksville due to financial reverses in trying to help George. They share a house at Point of Rocks (later Clark’s Point) at the foot of the Falls. William sells Mulberry Hill to his brother Jonathan and his mill on Beargrass Creek to brother Edmund (both in May 1803). [George Rogers Clark writes William is settled at Clarksville in December 1802 in a letter to Thomas Jefferson, but other sources indicate and better verify March or April as the apparent time for his change in residence. There was a house that John Clark owned in Louisville (nw corner of Eighth and Jefferson) that was part of his estate in 1799. William might have stayed here when he was in Louisville or he might have stayed with various family members or friends.
June 19, 1803 – Meriwether Lewis in Washington writes William Clark [at Clarksville probably] a letter inviting him to join him as co-commander of an expedition to the Pacific Ocean via the Louisiana Territory and the Oregon Country.
July 18, 1803 – William Clark responds from Clarksville accepting the invitation. Requests that communications be sent/forwarded to Louisville. [This, together with Clark’s later known locations, indicate he essentially established himself in Louisville while preparing for the expedition and arranging his affairs.]
July 22, 1803 – Lewis in Pittsburgh writes to Thomas Jefferson. Direct further communication to him at Louisville.
July 24, 1803 – Clark in Louisville writes Lewis that he is arranging his affairs so they will not have to delay long “after you arrival here” and that he has temporally engaged some likely men for the expedition. That same day Clark writes Jefferson from Clarksville, in which he expresses his pleasure in accompanying Lewis on the expedition and requests that he forward his enclosed letter to Lewis on to him.
August 3, 1803 – Lewis in Pittsburgh writes to William Clark at Louisville. Refers to a possible interpreter that might “join us at Louisville.”
August 21, 1803 – Clark in Louisville writes to Lewis.
August 26, 1803 – Clark at Falls Ohio writes to John Conner. Clark tells Conner to “join us at this place.” [Falls was sometimes used instead of the town name. This was especially true for Louisville, since writing from the Falls of the Ohio had for many years basically meant that one was writing from Louisville. Given that Lewis had requested Clark to have an interpreter (Conner) join them at Louisville, it is logical to conclude that this is where Clark wrote this letter from.]
September 3, 1803 – Clark in Louisville. Signs document assigning his power of attorney to his brother Jonathan.
September 11, 1803 – Clark near Louisville writes to Lewis. [Clark may have been writing the letter from Jonathan Clark’s or William Croghan’s places or another family member’s or friend’s outside of Louisville. He may have located the letter “near Louisville” rather than use the estate’s name. In writing Jonathan he often addressed the letters to him “near Louisville.”
September 28, 1803 – Lewis in Cincinnati writes to Clark at Louisville.
October 14, 1803 – Meriwether Lewis arrives at Louisville. Report datelined Louisville, October 15, published in the November 1 edition of the Kentucky Gazette reports Lewis’s arrival at “this port” on October 14.
October 16 [15], 1803 – Thomas Rodney, Louisville to Caesar Rodney. Arrived in Louisville at 1:00 pm . . . “Captn. Lewis’s boat passed the Falls just before we got here but I am informed he will be detained here all next [week].” [In comparing this letter to Rodney’s journal, he apparently misdated the letter, actually writing it on October 15 but dating it October 16. This would also indicate that Lewis must have landed at Louisville and been there about a day before going through the Falls because people in Louisville already are aware that he will be detained “here” until next week. Rodney’s statement that Lewis’s boat “passed the Falls” would seem to indicate that the keelboat and pirogue were piloted through the Falls on October 15, the day after Lewis reached the Falls. Given the amount of time Clark spent in Louisville preparing for the expedition, arranging his affairs, and waiting for Lewis, it is logical to believe that he would have been awaiting his co-leader’s arrival in Louisville, and that they would have met there on October 14. The haste with which the boats were taken through the Falls is a bit unusual. This might be explained by river conditions which necessitated a quick passage in order to take advantage of higher water and consequently generally a safer passage, or other local conditions unknown. The general procedure would be to stay at Louisville until ready to actually proceed down river. The resources (supplies, accommodations, etc.) needed – and in Lewis and Clark’s case the vast majority of family and friends as well – were in Louisville. If not taken through the Falls due to conditions, it must have been done to fit a plan Lewis and Clark had re: keeping the boat at Clarksville while they “delayed” for almost two weeks in Louisville and Clarksville wrapping up/preparing their affairs preparatory to heading down the Ohio and into the wilderness. Could the keelboat have been damaged in going through the Falls and this accounted for the delay?]
October 17, 1803 – Louisville. Thomas Rodney journal. Lewis and Clark visit him on his boat in the evening and take a glass of wine with him.
October 24, 1803 – Jonathan Clark diary. Notes that he was in Louisville and then Clarksville that day. He spent the night in Clarksville with William. [Why was Jonathan in Louisville and then Clarksville that day? Had Lewis and Clark planned on pushing off downriver from Clarksville on the 24th, but were delayed for some reason? Contrary to what Rodney indicates, was the keelboat taken through the Falls on October 24th and Jonathan came into Louisville and went with the captains on the boat through the Falls? The time frame for taking the boat through the Falls just before setting out downriver would coincide well with the actual October 26th departure, but Rodney’s comment re: “Captn. Lewis’s boat” passing through the Falls on October 15 indicates that the boat went through the Falls on that date.]
October 26, 1803, Louisville. William Clark is at the Jefferson County courthouse to acknowledge the assignment of his power of attorney to Jonathan.
October 26, 1803, Clarksville. Jonathan Clark diary. Jonathan in Louisville and then in Clarksville. “Capt. Lewis and Capt. Wm. Clark sot [set] of[f] on a Western tour – went in their boat to Mr. Temple’s. [Benjamin Temple was Jonathan’s son-in-law who had a farm along the Ohio River in the area of present Lake Dreamland neighborhood in western Louisville.
October 29, 1803 – Report datelined Louisville published in the Kentucky Gazette of November 8 stating “Capt. Clark and Mr. Lewis left this place on Wednesday last [Oct. 26], on their expedition to the Westward.
Near This Site.

A statue is worth a thousand words (apparently)
Lewis and Clark first meet just outside of
Louisville to begin their journey together west….

Trohn, you might not be aware that my Corbett Oregon theory (image 6 verse 5) has an open question that might utilize Lewis & Clark.  The phoca rock formation was first described in their journals and they were early explorers.  Not as early as Ponce or Hezeta but maybe you are picking up on L&C clues for another reason.

I have less trouble believing that it is hidden in the infield of Churchill Downs than I do that it is in Kentucky. I don’t believe it’s anywhere but in New Orleans–but I DO think it might be hidden in the infield of the Fairgrounds racetrack.  The “three stand watch” there too. Three famous racehorses are already  buried there.

erexere

Trohn, you might not be aware that my Corbett Oregon theory (image 6 verse 5) has an open question that might utilize Lewis & Clark.  The phoca rock formation was first described in their journals and they were early explorers.  Not as early as Ponce or Hezeta but maybe you are picking up on L&C clues for another reason.

Sorry, no.  I have known this for close to eight years for this hunt and I have known that
the nephew of Lewis and Clark founded Churchill Downs since I was four years old.
He was named after his Uncle and his Uncle’s partner and they meet to begin
their journey together at Ohio Falls, crossing from Louisville, KY.
‘Namesakes meeting near this site’
There is a plaque with these facts in the paddock area of the track.

Trohn

I do not have a St Louis theory.  Personally, I think it is flat wrong.
Its at Churchill Downs.
The middle of 21 is the winners circle horseshoe (21 = U)
Its been a long time, but that spot has never been changed.

You could find out by next week.
Buy a copy of the book off amazon
http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/ … ition=used
call this number
Churchill Downs
700 Central Avenue
Louisville, KY 40208
Main phone: 502.636.4400
Ask who the head grounds keeper is now. Send them the book and a letter explaining your theory.
You would know if you were right by the following day.  People cant resist a treasure hunt.

Trohn

I do not have a St Louis theory.  Personally, I think it is flat wrong.
Its at Churchill Downs.
The middle of 21 is the winners
circle
horseshoe (21 = U)
Its been a long time, but that spot has never been changed.

You could find out by next week.
Buy a copy of the book off amazon
http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/ … ition=used
call this number
Churchill Downs
700 Central Avenue
Louisville, KY 40208
Main phone: 502.636.4400
Ask who the head grounds keeper is now. Send them the book and a letter explaining your theory.
You would know if you were right by the following day.  People cant resist a treasure hunt.

Trohn

I do not discount that a casque was buried in New Orleans but the verse/image pairing is not this one (verse 2, image 9). From memory, I think it is (verse 7 – Twain’s Interest, and image 7 – White mask and Clock)

I agree with these image/verse assignments anyway…

it does match the verse really well actually.
but what about the site confirmers in the image. should be at least 3 or 4 things you can see from the casque site in the image.

maltedfalcon

You could find out by next week.
Buy a copy of the book off amazon
http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/ … ition=used
call this number
Churchill Downs
700 Central Avenue
Louisville, KY 40208
Main phone: 502.636.4400
Ask who the head grounds keeper is now. Send them the book and a letter explaining your theory.
You would know if you were right by the following day.  People cant resist a treasure hunt.

I can’t believe you have pulled me back into this madness aof chasing a deadman’s secrets.
I had put this into the past years ago.
There a lot of things I CAN do…  its what’s follows THAT always leads to more dirt.

maltedfalcon

it does match the verse really well actually.
but what about the site confirmers in the image. should be at least 3 or 4 things you can see from the casque site in the image.

Have you seen my posts in Image Nine – Churchhill – Double Spires??

shecrab

The “three stand watch” there too. Three famous racehorses are already  buried there.

Right…I bet they’re keeping a keen lookout…

Doesn’t it seem likely that “Louis” is our best candidate namesake?  Louis Armstrong, St. Louis Street, St. Louis Cemetery (New Orleans), maybe even “Toulouse” is a gleichwort for “to Louis”.

erexere

Doesn’t it seem likely that “Louis” is our best candidate namesake?

(Only if it’s the right verse for New Orleans.)
Gnomes admire, fays delight
The namesakes meeting near this site
How about “Brownies”…? Junior girl guides with the same name as fairies…(named from
this book
).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brownie_(Girl_Guides)
http://www.brownie-camera.com/articles/ … igin.shtml
It’s a word that’s also been used to describe various groups that have admired someone called “Brown” at different times – “Gnomes (who) admire”…?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brownie
(On a random note, the St Louis Browns were called Brownies, and there’s a Forest Park connection.)
“The Crusader logo for the Browns is a copy of the statue of Saint Louis (the French crusading king) that sits atop Art Hill in Forest Park (right outside the entrance to the Art Museum).”
http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthrea … and-others

reading these posts makes me realize that I still have yet to post all of my pictures that we took while in the big easy.  My regular comp is in the shop but I will post my pics as soon as we get it back from the shop.  I took lots of photos in both City Park & Jackson Sq area {where I am now leaning to being the casque’s location}.
Storyland is not tooo far from the sundial.  The sundial is however on the back side of a large building.  Let me try it this way.
1.  Do a mapquest search for City Park, New Orleans LA
2.  Dreyfous Ave runs through the bottom portion of the park.  If you do “aerial image”  you will see the Peristyle (oval shaped bldg) just east of Anseman Ave.  Continue east on Dreyfous to the next prominant bldg (at the end of Tennis Court Ln).  This is the old Casino and just south of it is the sundial (you can see a small circle on the aerial image).  The “arch” bridge is just south of the sundial.
3.  To get to Storyland from the sundial, you can either cut across the large parking lot diagonally to the northwest or go north on Tennis Court Ln and west on Victory Ave.
4.  Storyland is the area north of the end of Anseman Ave with what looks like a round tent and a couple of smaller bldgs…it is NOT the area containing the large bldg and arch shaped markings in the grass.
Looking at this aerial shot of the area as well as remembering my visit…I would have to say that it would be nearly impossible to hear children playing in Storyland from the sundial.

forest_blight

Great picture, Jambone. Do you have more? What are the 26 stories?
I look forward to hearing more!

Actually, that pic came from flickr – it was better than mine.
“Fifteen rows down to the ground”
“Fifteen rows” could be a levee (15 rows of stones, blocks, etc.), and “down to the ground” could mean coming down from the levee/water to reach the ground.  According to Wikipedia, levees were built along the south side of Lake Pontchartrain (which is just north of the Mardi Gras Fountain, Harlequin Park, Tourmaline Park, and City Park) in 1947 and then made higher in 1965.

Hey! This is my first post here. BoingBoing posted about this
http://boingboing.net/2014/07/15/the-quest-to-find-12-hidden-tr.html?fk_bb
and I decided to look into it. I live in New Orleans, so I can definitely help.
Initially the jewel streets in Lakeview came to mind, but that seems disproven. I’m liking much of the Lafayette Square stuff.
Anyone come up with anything new?

Deuce

Let’s try to expand on this idea…
Ever since I started working on this hunt I always thought there was more to the gnomes and fays lines. It just seems randomly out of place. One idea I had was to take the first letters, G A and F D, and maybe find names or streets that are our “namesakes”. Maybe. Who knows.
I liked WhiteRabbit’s ROMAN IDES GEM anagram so I started looking for possible anagrams for “fays delight”. Didn’t get much out of it so I started both lines from scratch. There’s a million single words you can get out of both line but this is what I got using all the letters.
GNOMES ADMIRE FAYS DELIGHT  =  THE GOLD FAIRY MAIDENS GEMS
May be something to look into even if we just use some of these words and rearrange or anagram others. Maybe FAIR MAIDEN, GOLDEN FAIRY MAID, THE OLD MAID, THE ORLEANS MAID (Joan of Arc?), GOLDEN HAIR MAID (Cinderella? Rapunzel? Storyland?). I’m sure we need to use all the letters but these can be part of it.
Need to work on this…

Unknown

Unknown:
Not shown: Prince Yi, Hsi
Wang Mu, Shin-seen and
the Dragon

Unknown

Unknown:
… Man, who with his weapons of forged iron had
lately murdered, just for sport, what was believed to
be the last, and irreplaceable, Dragon.

FAYS DELIGHT
I am working on ordering the immigrant nations and started using single capital letters for the countries. The map on page 10 suggests one sequence, then the passage to the New World describes the order of departure, and the arrival in the new world is another.
Then there is the order from the Litany of the Jewels
LOTJ Nations order:
England, Celtic, Iberia, France, Germany, Lowland , Russia, Italy, Araby, Africa, Hellas, Cathay,
Code:
Select all
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12
E S I F G L R I A  A  H  C
4 10 – 2  – 1 6 8 5 11 7
F  A ? S  ? E L I G  H R
How about T for Tartary instead of R for Russia
F A ? S ? E L I G H T
Y and D are missing.
on page 10 map it says:
so Y could be Prince Yi
and D the Dragon
All comments welcome…

I don’t know much about this puzzle or verse. Could the 15 rows be the steps from the Washington Artillery Park which go “down to the ground” at Jackson Square? Although, I thought the line was referring to things
burning
“down to the ground”. Were there 15 buildings or churches that burnt down and left the St. Louis Cathedral, The Cabildo, and Presbytere? Maybe they are the three that stand watch? It is an old city. Undoubtedly, there have been fires throughout history. Either way, Jackson Square is right there in the middle, near The Jax – from the kid’s sock. It also looks like a clock from above. If only in its round shape. Maybe that is a tie-in with the clock face?
The Cabildo, St. Louis Cathedral, and Presbytere all face the square. And, of the Square-facing archways, the Front door of the Cathedral is in the middle of the 21 archways. Directly out from there is a square plaque embedded in the ground which looks very similar to the clock face. Sort-of. Not sure when it was placed there, but it looks like it could be the clock face. Also, the mask is covering 6, 7, and 8. 6+7+8=21. Maybe the “middle” is 7, and the dig spot is where 7 falls on the “clock” made by the overhead of Jackson Square?
Like I said, I don’t know much about this particular puzzle. I really only got here from reading the other posts about the email with St. Louis in it.

Fox, Frishkie’s post is from February!  8)
Johann, I like your ideas.  It would be nice to see pics of these things, though, especially the lions who stand watch.  Any way to do that?

I have a theory linking this verse to pic 9 (The Gnome/Netherlands) for the St. Louis treasure.  I wrote an extensive post on the pic 9 thread and (I hope) that works together with this post.
–At the place where jewels abound
Forest Park; Jewel Box gardens; Vandeventer Place
Gate structure, which was backdrop for former rose
garden.
–Fifteen (letter O?) rows (“rose”?) down to the ground
If the VP Gate was the backdrop, then that would
mean one would see it looking down a slight slope
toward the VP Gate when standing near the Jewel
Box.  It could mean rows of roses, and “the ground”
could be the treasure ground.  I hope to find an old
photo from when the rose garden was still there.
–In the middle of twenty one (letter U)
From end to end
The Vandeventer Place Gates (a Dutch name/gnome)
are U-shaped like the eye-wrinkles on the man in
pic 9.  In the middle (rounded part) of the U there
is an opening where once were gates, since donated
to Cochran’s Hospital (formerly/presently a vet’s hsp.).
I’d like to see the gates to clarify (or not) the
“15 rows” line.  Or, this line could mean “in the middle
of the straight ends,” ie-out in the space between.
–Only three stand watch
There are now ONLY three lion heads on an old
lamppost where once were 4 lions.  At some point
one was stolen, and that vacant spot is as rusty
as the present lions and the rest of the post.
Moreover, this lamppost is located next to the
Vandeventer Place Gate, above the U and very
near it, lined up with the opening in the middle
of the U (where the gates were).
–As the sound of friends
Fills the afternoon hours
sound: Muny opera?  the fountain in the garden?
hours: there was a round flower bed with a giant
functioning clock in the middle.  The color of the
flowers spelled: “Hours and flowers soon fade
away.”  The clock is gone, but the sentence
survives on a plaque.  I saw the big clock-flower
bed in a book dated 1985.  (On that note, the
Vandeventer gates were removed in 1985.)
The clock was installed in 1951.  Thus the photo
in the book doesn’t say what was up in 1980-82.
There was also a strange sundial in the gardens.
Here is a sovereign people (crowned St. Louis statue in front
of Art Museum: Apotheosis of St. Louis)
Who build palaces to shelter
Their heads for a night!
TEMPORARY World’s Fair PALACES (1904)
Gnomes admire (Lowland Gnomes, pic 9)
Fays delight (French, St. Louis)
The namesakes meeting
Near this site.
meeting of the Miss. and Miss. rivers??
Well, that is the idea, although you may have to couple ot with my long post on the pic 9 thread to get the full picture.
Please critique and assist.  (I have to logout.  My daughter is crying.)
–Johann

Unknown

Unknown:
While I’m currently stumped by the Philadelphia/Pittsburgh picture (#4),

frishkie, dont know if you have read all the threads yet (yes, there are many) but P4 was linked to V4 and the casque was located by our very own egbert in Cleveland OH.
I too am leaning (for the time being) towards Canada with this V….especially with, like you mentioned, the “sovereign people”.

I may be able to use my wife’s digital camera if she shows me how, or I may be able to get her to come along and then figure out how to post them.  I’ll see what I can do.
Fox–If you can find a solid Canada link, that would help me, of course, by confirming or denying my theory before I set shovel to dirt.
–Johann

Here is a picture of the City Park sundial that I believe is the interpretation for “At the place where jewels abound” and much of the rest of the verse. Here is the way it fits:
At the place where jewels abound
The 18′ sundial. Reference is to a timekeeper like a jeweled watch or clock.
Fifteen rows down to the ground
15 hashes counter clockwise from between the “2” and “1” to the end (ground)
In the middle of twenty-one
The “1” and “2” seen upside-down (from top)
From end to end
From “6” to “6” on sundial.
Only three stand watch
The number 3. There is only one 3 on the watch. There are two “2””1″ combinations on the sundial. We are to dig at the one next to the “three”.
This one was a little tricky to get a feel for at first, but I really like the results. Well done BP.

Here is a picture of the playground to the west of the sundial area. We just had a friend test it. The playground is definitely within earshot of the sundial.
This fits for lines “
As the sound of friends
” and “
Fills the afternoon hours
“.

you’re saying that the middle of twenty-one is the number referenced in the song?
Interesting.

maltedfalcon

you’re saying that the middle of twenty-one is the number referenced in the song?
Interesting.

Yes, it kind of dawned on me that Preiss could be going for an Saint by Louis/Saint Louis/Saint Louis approach in Song/Cemetary/Street.  Tomb No. 21 is a “container” for the Rouelle family.
If you’re a casque, which means you are “Round” (Rouelle in Fr.) then the funeral dirge “When The Saints Go Marchin In” may be playing as you are literally being put “in that number” 21 tomb.  Oh, that’s sweet!

I’m very enthusiastic about the Gardens of the Americas’ three statues, a President of Venezuela, a President of Mexico, and a President of the Federal Republic of Central America. This reconciles very well with the quote by Sarmiento, “Here is the sovereign people who build palaces to shelter their heads for a night!”, since he was a President of Argentina.

I just can’t imagine being able to bury something in the Basin Street neutral ground without drawing a lot of unwanted attention. There wouldn’t be anything to shield you from the constant traffic.

You got to give the guy credit for wherever he sneakily buried the casques..

erexere

You got to give the guy credit for wherever he sneakily buried the casques..

I wouldn’t call digging by the side of the road in plain view sneaky. Gutsy maybe, but not sneaky

I don’t know if your point is to contest my argument about Presidents of the countries in the Americas, namesakes of Amerigo Vespucci, or if you’re saying that the reason Preiss wore disguises in some cases only to select dig spots in places that were completely out of plain view.
As far as I’m concerned, any place thats got dirt is up for consideration barring a place thats completely insane for obvious reasons, in a cemetery, in a beautified flower bed, completely restricted private access, etc. I think he was sneaky, but also very clear about instructions within a context that relies on understanding the verse and not just the image alone.

erexere

instructions within a context that relies on understanding the verse and not just the image alone.

That’s the problem I have with the Basin Street neutral ground as a dig site, it ignores the rest of the verse outside the Sarmiento quote and the “three stand watch.” If you can walk me through the verse, showing how each line draws us to the final spot of Basin street I’d be willing to consider the theory. Looking at the two solved locations as well as the “near solves” we see the verse leading us along a path until we reach the final destination – I’m just not finding the contextual clues in the verse to land us on Basin street.

Here is a sovereign people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their heads for a night!
Gnomes admire
Fays delight
The namesakes meeting
Near this site
Perhaps the namesakes refer back to the sovereign people. Eg it could be the intersection of two roads called Prince’s St and King St, or a point where George Ave runs into Queens Park, or something. Or Philip, Henry, Louis, Dauphin etc.

Unknown

Unknown:
just thought i’d throw out another idea on verse 2. at the place where jewels abound… manhattan’s diamond district….fifteen rows down to the ground in the middle of twenty-one from end to end… 6th st and 5th ave…washington square park. only three stand watch… 3 people statuetized; washington (2), holley, and garibaldi. gnomes admire fays delight (fay’s) (fay wray?) pg 193 … the namesakes meeting near this site…2 washingtons on either side of washington arch at the park entrance. just thought somebody might like to play with this. have a good day! (oh yeah, it’s located at -73.9975, 40.7309)

adoks53 over at tweleve.org has some intriguing observations about Washington Square Park, a place we’ve previously raised in conjunction with Image 12:
As for namesakes meeting, Washington Sq. N intersects Washington Sq. E, which intersects with both Washington Sq. S and Washington Pl.
Sovereign
people
may refer to chess kings and queens; Wikipedia says, “Built-in chess tables on the southwest corner encourage outdoor playing along with throngs of watchers … The Washington Square tables form the cornerstone of what is called Manhattan’s “chess district,” as the area around the park (Thompson Street, between West 3rd and Bleecker Streets) has a number of chess shops in addition to the playing location in the park. Also, the renowned Marshall Chess Club is nearby at 23 West 10th Street.”
And, troubling for us: “As of 2005, Greenwich Village is embroiled in a controversy over the NYC Parks Department’s proposed redesign plan, which would cost roughly 16 million dollars. The most controversial aspect of the proposed plan is a four-foot (1.2 m) fence to be built around the park. Other debated points include the relocation of landmarks such as the Garibaldi statue and the fountain, raising the entire park to street level, and the fact that the park’s history as a cemetery means that renovations may “disturb hallowed ground.” In July 2005, a lawsuit was filed against the Parks Department, arguing that their plan to redesign the park is “arbitrary, capricious, unreasonable and illegal.””
Hundreds and hundreds of pictures of Washington Square Park, every tiny detail:
http://www.pbase.com/hjsteed/wsp_fall

Unknown

Unknown:
just thought i’d throw out another idea on verse 2. at the place where jewels abound… manhattan’s diamond district….fifteen rows down to the ground in the middle of twenty-one from end to end… 6th st and 5th ave…washington square park. only three stand watch… 3 people statuetized; washington (2), holley, and garibaldi. gnomes admire fays delight (fay’s) (fay wray?) pg 193 … the namesakes meeting near this site…2 washingtons on either side of washington arch at the park entrance. just thought somebody might like to play with this. have a good day! (oh yeah, it’s located at -73.9975, 40.7309)

adoks53 over at tweleve.org has some intriguing observations about Washington Square Park, a place we’ve previously raised in conjunction with Image 12:
As for namesakes meeting, Washington Sq. N intersects Washington Sq. E, which intersects with both Washington Sq. S and Washington Pl.
Sovereign people
may refer to chess kings and queens; Wikipedia says, “Built-in chess tables on the southwest corner encourage outdoor playing along with throngs of watchers … The Washington Square tables form the cornerstone of what is called Manhattan’s “chess district,” as the area around the park (Thompson Street, between West 3rd and Bleecker Streets) has a number of chess shops in addition to the playing location in the park. Also, the renowned Marshall Chess Club is nearby at 23 West 10th Street.”
And, troubling for us: “As of 2005, Greenwich Village is embroiled in a controversy over the NYC Parks Department’s proposed redesign plan, which would cost roughly 16 million dollars. The most controversial aspect of the proposed plan is a four-foot (1.2 m) fence to be built around the park. Other debated points include the relocation of landmarks such as the Garibaldi statue and the fountain, raising the entire park to street level, and the fact that the park’s history as a cemetery means that renovations may “disturb hallowed ground.” In July 2005, a lawsuit was filed against the Parks Department, arguing that their plan to redesign the park is “arbitrary, capricious, unreasonable and illegal.””
Hundreds and hundreds of pictures of Washington Square Park, every tiny detail:
http://www.pbase.com/hjsteed/wsp_fall

Unknown

Unknown:
“The stones that are worth the most will be the hardest to find,” Preiss said.

Meh. More double-speak from the Master. Ultimately, jewels are only worth what someone is willing to pay for them, and only Preiss knew what he paid for each stone. To the extend the above is true, it only suggests to me that he paid the least for the the jewel associated with Cleveland, since I believe that is the easiest puzzle, by far.

Hello!
I just recently found out about this “The secret” book and was very intrigued!
Ofcourse as curious as I am I immediately started looking for clues.
I read that charleston is most likely the place due to the “skull” on the picture.
but that might not be relevant as I’m not updated on the latest gossip.
Is charleston even relevant anymore?
I bet you guys get alot of new curious people everyday who flood the forums so i apologize in advance if this is annoying.
I guess i can show what i got so far:
IMAGE
I have no idea how old the church is so if it was built in the last 10 years this will be dismissed.
Should be noted that there also is a christian cross in the lions hair so it kinda makes sense?? but you guys probably already knew that.
Thanks for reading guys! –
Simen

I’ve somewhat eased my cannon envy. I was looking into grandfather clocks, and it looks like the hands in Image 7 contain mostly generic patterns, including the mirrored “J”s. Not that there’s not anything hidden in them, but if there is, I think it’s numbers.

so is…
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
what of it?

Ah, I was just losing my way around Montreal.  The football field idea got away from me.  I remember where I left off now, working on a Notre-Dame theory…blast, I know no French.

erexere

Isn’t
fifteen rows down to the ground
just another way of saying “15 columns”?

no, its not,
I teach an Excel class, Rows go accross,
columns go up and down.
Horizontal isn’t the same as vertical

DanaSkully

At the place where jewels abound
– Refers to the Sunlife Building which borders Dorchester Sq on Metcalfe St. It is well known that during WWII the British Crown Jewels as well as gold reserves for several European countries were stored here for safekeeping.
Fifteen rows down to the ground
– While the Sunlife Building is in fact 26 stories tall, you can only count 15 rows down to the ground, where you would be standing. See pic
:
http://imgur.com/W3RPt2v
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
– Again, Sunlife. When you stand at the entrance to the building (facing Dorchester Sq), you are standing in the middle 21 columns of windows. (There are actual Romanesque columns on the building, but they do not run “from end to end”).
The columns of windows do run from end to end.
(Notice we are counting rows of squares when counting the 15 rows and 21 columns. This may be why checkerboards are stressed in Image 9).
Only three stand watch
– There are only three human statues in Dorchester Square: Prime Minister Laurier, Scottish poet Robbie Burns, and the soldier restraining his horse on the Boer War Monument.
As the sound of friends
Fills the afternoon hours
-People enjoying Dorchester/Dominion Sq.
Here is a sovereign people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their heads for a night!
– Windsor Hotel, located on Peel St. opposite the Sunlife Building, which also borders Dorchester Sq. The name of Windsor is sovereign as the House of Windsor is the royal house of the UK as well as the Commonwealth (including Canada). The Windsor Hotel itself was lavish and enormous (palatial) before 1957 when it was extensively damaged. It was literally a host to royalty, King George VI and Elizabeth famously stayed here on their royal tour in 1939. The term “sovereign people” can also signify the Square’s former name of Dominion Square, as dominion means “sovereignty or the territory of a sovereign or government”
Gnomes admire
Fays delight
– General knowledge says gnomes live in gardens, fairies live in trees. This is not a specific statement.
There are trees and a flower bed in Dorchester Sq. Old pictures show there has always been a large ring shaped flower bed around the Boer War Monument.
The namesakes meeting
Near this site
– Namesakes of Windsor? There is a Victoria fountain in Dorchester Sq.
Queen Victoria was a member of the House of Windsor. She had the name before the Hotel Windsor was built, so is the hotel her namesake? Again, Dorchester was called Dominion Square in 1980. Possibly he is referring to how Windsor is a namesake of Dominion.
It might not be important.
Verse 2 seems to point to Dorchester Sq, and even gives a general line to follow (the front entrance of the Sunlife).
If you follow that line across the park, it will lead you across the Boer War Monument and on to the Windsor.
The precise location on where to dig may be given by the “X” diagram on Image 9, as that symbol has not led to a physical location thus far. It seems to read PX7. This may refer to the shape of the paths in Dorchester Sq., the “P” may stand for pillar (on the Sunlife building). “P” may stand for Peel Street.

I have a post here (Page 44 of this thread):
viewtopic.php?f=32&t=953&start=645
It relates to what you are saying. If you haven’t seen it, maybe it has some new info. I’d at least like to compare some notes.
If you look at the “X” diagram in Image 9 and compare it so some overheads of the pre-rennovation, or even historical overhead maps of the diagonal sidewalks in the former Dominion square, it raises some interesting question. Why is one line of the X so much thicker than the other one? I’ve never made it fit to my satisfaction, but it looks a lot like some of those old overheads where the one sidewalk through the park is wider than the other. I’ll try to dig up some pics to demonstrate, but if you know what i”m talking about, maybe you’ve noticed something similar yourself?

DanaSkully

At the place where jewels abound
– Refers to the Sunlife Building which borders Dorchester Sq on Metcalfe St. It is well known that during WWII the British Crown Jewels as well as gold reserves for several European countries were stored here for safekeeping.
Fifteen rows down to the ground
– While the Sunlife Building is in fact 26 stories tall, you can only count 15 rows down to the ground, where you would be standing. See pic
:
http://imgur.com/W3RPt2v
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
– Again, Sunlife. When you stand at the entrance to the building (facing Dorchester Sq), you are standing in the middle 21 columns of windows. (There are actual Romanesque columns on the building, but they do not run “from end to end”).
The columns of windows do run from end to end.
(Notice we are counting rows of squares when counting the 15 rows and 21 columns. This may be why checkerboards are stressed in Image 9).
Only three stand watch
– There are only three human statues in Dorchester Square: Prime Minister Laurier, Scottish poet Robbie Burns, and the soldier restraining his horse on the Boer War Monument.
As the sound of friends
Fills the afternoon hours
-People enjoying Dorchester/Dominion Sq.
Here is a
sovereign
people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their heads for a night!
– Windsor Hotel, located on Peel St. opposite the Sunlife Building, which also borders Dorchester Sq. The name of Windsor is
sovereign
as the House of Windsor is the royal house of the UK as well as the Commonwealth (including Canada). The Windsor Hotel itself was lavish and enormous (palatial) before 1957 when it was extensively damaged. It was literally a host to royalty, King George VI and Elizabeth famously stayed here on their royal tour in 1939. The term “
sovereign
people” can also signify the Square’s former name of Dominion Square, as dominion means “sovereignty or the territory of a
sovereign
or government”
Gnomes admire
Fays delight
– General knowledge says gnomes live in gardens, fairies live in trees. This is not a specific statement.
There are trees and a flower bed in Dorchester Sq. Old pictures show there has always been a large ring shaped flower bed around the Boer War Monument.
The namesakes meeting
Near this site
– Namesakes of Windsor? There is a Victoria fountain in Dorchester Sq.
Queen Victoria was a member of the House of Windsor. She had the name before the Hotel Windsor was built, so is the hotel her namesake? Again, Dorchester was called Dominion Square in 1980. Possibly he is referring to how Windsor is a namesake of Dominion.
It might not be important.
Verse 2 seems to point to Dorchester Sq, and even gives a general line to follow (the front entrance of the Sunlife).
If you follow that line across the park, it will lead you across the Boer War Monument and on to the Windsor.
The precise location on where to dig may be given by the “X” diagram on Image 9, as that symbol has not led to a physical location thus far. It seems to read PX7. This may refer to the shape of the paths in Dorchester Sq., the “P” may stand for pillar (on the Sunlife building). “P” may stand for Peel Street.

I have a post here (Page 44 of this thread):
viewtopic.php?f=32&t=953&start=645
It relates to what you are saying. If you haven’t seen it, maybe it has some new info. I’d at least like to compare some notes.
If you look at the “X” diagram in Image 9 and compare it so some overheads of the pre-rennovation, or even historical overhead maps of the diagonal sidewalks in the former Dominion square, it raises some interesting question. Why is one line of the X so much thicker than the other one? I’ve never made it fit to my satisfaction, but it looks a lot like some of those old overheads where the one sidewalk through the park is wider than the other. I’ll try to dig up some pics to demonstrate, but if you know what i”m talking about, maybe you’ve noticed something similar yourself?

I did run across that before! I searched this forum for key words to see if anyone else had the same theory, and saw that one.
I ran across these a few times, they’re the 1907 plans for the park:
https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fi … n_1907.jpg
Not helpful, as the paths are the same. I still search for the meaning of that thicker line. You and I are stuck on that, huh?
I mean, there are still so many possibilities. You *can* trace the P and V symbols in the paths many different ways. The P could stand for Peel, paces (steps), poet (Burns), the V could be Victoria, or it’s a 7 which could mean 7th pillar, 7 paces… So yeah man, what could it be?

This all sounds pretty good, but in order for that to be right we would have to ignore the direct quote from the literary reference to the St Charles Hotel, that puts us looking in New Orleans.
Do you have any on site image matches for this? Perhaps some way we can be absolutely sure that you can link this verse to Montreal? Where the jewels abound, that phrase doesn’t specifically scream Montreal Canada. Maybe something similar to what we have at FOY with “the first chapter”? Or what we have in Milwaukee with the tie to Mitchell?
I’m not discounting your theory, just looking for the link where you would match up the verse and image.

decibalnyc

This all sounds pretty good, but in order for that to be right we would have to ignore the direct quote from the literary reference to the St Charles Hotel, that puts us looking in New Orleans.
Do you have any on site image matches for this? Perhaps some way we can be absolutely sure that you can link this verse to Montreal? Where the jewels abound, that phrase doesn’t specifically scream Montreal Canada. Maybe something similar to what we have at FOY with “the first chapter”? Or what we have in Milwaukee with the tie to Mitchell?
I’m not discounting your theory, just looking for the link where you would match up the verse and image.

Unknown

Unknown:
Minor Correction here.
The connection being made is as follows. When Sarmiento was in New Orleans he saw a structure that reminded him of St. Peter’s Cathedral in Rome and thus his quote. It turned out to be the St. Charles Exchange Hotel in New Orelans.
The Cathédrale Marie-Reine-du-Monde (Mary, Queen of the World Cathedral), in Montreal on Dorchester Square, is a scale replica of St. Peter’s Cathedral in Rome.

Not ignore, just a different interpretation. Merlot’s quote from last page:

forest_blight

At the place where jewels abound
Here is a sovereign people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their heads for a night!
Gnomes admire
I consider the bits in red simply clues to New Orleans, and therefore uninteresting for narrowing it down once we agree on the city.

FB, I am curious, and right now I dont have them in front of me so I cant be sure one way or another,
In the Chicago and Clevland verses, are there lines you can point to that were just “City Clues” and not related to actually finding the casque location specifically?
If yes then I agree with you, thats probably what they are…
If no, then I disagree, why would this verse be different…
(sorry at work now and cant check the other verses…)

found these phots on a blog, not sure how old they are, but in the newer, recent photos
ive looked at i dont see this fence. the fence has the emblem on every 18-16 posts, i see light posts
maybe the fence is the 15 rows down and their are 21 light posts. the bad thing is if the fence is gone
and light posts, would be tough to find, with out a blueprint or something of park in 1980.she calls it
lafayette-square, ive seen the park called that recently too.
http://dunestopines.blogspot.com/2008/0 … quare.html

Unknown

Unknown:
Also, who or what are the “namesakes

The namesakes, IMHO, are the park itself: La FAYette (the little fay) and the Mardi Gras participants–who dress like everything from fairies to gnomes and everything in between. Remember, the square and its surrounding streets are a prominent reviewing area for the parade participants. It is no matter that Lafayette actually means something about birch trees…many people would confuse Fay (as in Fae, or Faerie) with La Fayette–and assume it meant “little fairy” even though it really doesn’t mean that. Anyway, it says the namesakes meet “near” the site, not ON it. So that could pretty much mean anything.
CW0909
: that blog I believe is in error—that does not look like LaFayette square, it looks like Jackson Square. The iron fence around Lafayette Square was removed in the early 19th century!  I think the blogger is wrong. You can see early postcards of the square on the Lafayette Conservancy web site and there is no fence.
I think the “21” may be the bollards. It says in the LSC plan that there are “nearly 30” of them. It would be something one could be “in the middle of”.

maltedfalcon

FB, I am curious, and right now I dont have them in front of me so I cant be sure one way or another,
In the Chicago and Clevland verses, are there lines you can point to that were just “City Clues” and not related to actually finding the casque location specifically?
If yes then I agree with you, thats probably what they are…
If no, then I disagree, why would this verse be different…
(sorry at work now and cant check the other verses…)

No to both – good point. However, the same devices need not be used in all the verses. Note that SELOY is the only (we think!) acrostic clue.

I agree completely–and I think this statue is the best interp of the P we’ve had in forever. I think we may have found the casque’s resting place–and I think it was suggested before, but for some reason discarded.
This park is so small you could dig it up completely with a shovel and about 10 minute of time. It’s perfect—let’s get someone with a shovel over there!

I’m not sure if anyone has mentioned this. I looked, so please don’t bash me if they have. But it says in the verse that “Only three stand watch”.
If I’m not mistaken, I believe that their are only three statues in Lafayette square. All three are of people. I know that one is Henry Clay, one is Ben Franklin, and one is John McDonough. Is one of these this statue you guys are talking about?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lafayette_ … ew_Orleans

Guys, this park (Lafayette Square) matches the verse very well so far. I’m extremely sure that we’ve found the location. Now it needs to be narrowed down and dug up. Who lives in this area or close to it? I’m in Gainesville, FL and I doubt my wife will let me go treasure hunting in New Orleans anytime soon…
BTW, I now know that the John McDonough statue is the one you guys are talking about

Here’s some information about Lafayette Square:
There is a hotel on the square, called (duh) the Lafayette Hotel. Go to this website and check out the 360-deg. views–and look at the windows. There is the
top of our clock
(in P. 7)
Here is a sovereign people  Who build palaces to shelter  Their heads for a night!
this phrase was talking about a particular hotel–the Hotel St. Charles, which no longer exists. But why couldn’t it just sort of generically be talking about
any
hotel? The sense of the verse fits no matter what hotel you’re talking about!
http://www.neworleansfinehotels.com/thelafayettehotel/ipix/index.html
Here is the Lafayette Square conservancy (“preservation!”) plan for the square. You can see some of it in pictures in this document.
http://www.lafayette-square.org/uploads/MasterplanAdoptedbyConservancy207.pdf
AND…it has a nice map of the park as it existed THEN–I don’t know what work or how much has already been done.
If we can figure out what the “15 rows down to the ground might be,” I do believe we’ve found our park. Maybe it refers to ROW HOUSES…which it apparently borders (not sure of this, though).
The rest of the verse fits well: the hotel, the “only three stand watch” which could easily refer to the three statues in the park, and the “sound of friends fills the afternoon hours”–the park is used for free concerts and meetings all the time.  It is a centrally located “meeting place” that is well-used and well-known. Here’s a quote from the history of the square:
Lafayette Square, the second oldest park in the City, was founded in 1788 and was originally called “place publique.”
It is across the street from Gallier Hall, which is a building that serves as a reception hall, theatre and is also an official viewing stand for Mardi Gras floats! Look at the pic of Gallier on the website: the frieze above the columns depicts THREE STANDING WATCH.
This is definitely worth more exploration–especially on foot.
I am not really convinced this is the correct verse for the location–I am wondering if the right V. should be V. 7–but I’m definitely open to whatever. If the “rows” can be discovered, then I’m totally convinced.

shecrab

Look at the pic of Gallier on the website: the frieze above the columns depicts THREE STANDING WATCH.

Thats possible but the central figure is lady truth and she is blindfolded, that makes it kind of hard to describe her as standing watch.
Also there are three statues in the park, but that would total five figures as one statue has 3 people…
Still the boy’s pose is right on.

maltedfalcon

Thats possible but the central figure is lady truth and she is blindfolded, that makes it kind of hard to describe her as standing watch.
Also there are three statues in the park, but that would total five figures as one statue has 3 people…
Still the boy’s pose is right on.

True, but the statues are dedicated to the three men. And, looking at each statue individually, it does look like they are keeping watch. Also the statues are in a perfect row across the square, with two on the end and one in the middle. Verse 2 does say “From end to end”. That’s my $.02

where’s lafitte?  doesn’t she live there?

shecrab

Here is a sovereign people  Who build palaces to shelter  Their heads for a night!
[/color] this phrase was talking about a particular hotel–the Hotel St. Charles, which no longer exists. But why couldn’t it just sort of generically be talking about
any
hotel? The sense of the verse fits no matter what hotel you’re talking about!

shecrab

I am not really convinced this is the correct verse for the location–I am wondering if the right V. should be V. 7–but I’m definitely open to whatever.

Oh but it does…do a google map search of Lafayette Park, go to ‘Street View’ on St Charles Ave in front of the park and go less than 1 block North on St Charles Ave.  The adjacent hotel is the Parc St. Charles Hotel.
It was THIS V that got us to this location.
My take {and they are usually wrong
} is that the ’15 rows down to the ground’  may be describing a nearby building whose brickwork, windows, etc..could be described as “rows”.  I also think, and this may make it harder for us because of the passage of time, that the “center of 21” is referring to trees.  An overhead of the park shows areas with clumps of trees.  I think that there is one place to stand where there would be {or would have been} 21 trees surrounding you.  The 3 standing watch are the statues…and the boy on the JM statue is as near to a perfect match as we will ever find.  If this isn’t our casque’s resting place, then it may be the starting point of the trek to the correct location but in my opinion, this park IS part of this puzzle.

shecrab

If we can figure out what the “15 rows down to the ground might be,” I do believe we’ve found our park. Maybe it refers to ROW HOUSES…which it apparently borders (not sure of this, though).

You may be onto something here.  I found this tidbit of info regarding an area of the Lafayette Square Historic District.  It is not right at our park but it is in the same historic district so it might apply to the entire area…
“The earliest remaining houses in the district are located at 535-545 Julia Street, which were constructed in 1832 by John Green. As the development of the neighborhood intensified, speculative developers constructed rows of townhouses for sale. The most noted surviving example of this practice is Julia Row, the thirteen residences that form the even numbered side of the 600 block of Julia.”
http://www.cityofno.com/pg-99-54-lafayette-square.aspx

I read that too–which is what got me thinking about ROW houses! Julia Row does border the park.
And I’m willing to use this V for the location—I just wondered if the other one had been exhausted. I like the idea of the jewels, I like the idea of the namesakes, and the rest–the only thing that bugs me is that ROW thing.
Isn’t the Parc St. Charles a
different
St. Charles hotel than Sarmiento’s? If not, then
whoo hoo
!! It’s still valid! No problem there, then! I was under the impression that the one Sarmiento was referring to was being used as something other than a hotel now. The BUILDING is still there–but the hotel isnt’. Maybe I’m wrong about that.
As for the three on the frieze–I didn’t notice the blindfold–(that’s an “oopsie!”)
No matter—there are still three statues. And even if you interpret that verse as “three individuals” it may not be—it may only mean THREE STATUES. It doesn’t say three of WHAT are standing watch—only that 3
are
.
I like this locale.
Better than any we’ve seen so far. It solves several problems we’ve had with other places–the figure on the clock, the “preservation” the shape of the arch, the jazz-man mask–(this park is home to an annual Jazz Festival!) and the meeting place and the namesakes, the Sarmiento quote–AND the lat/long are EXACT. I love that!
The 15 rows–I don’t know about this one–maybe the wooden ‘bollards’ around the park? They’ve been replaced with concrete ones since 1981–but the layout has not changed!  The bollards are those wooden/concrete vertical posts spaced around the walkways. A bollard is normally found on a dock–to tie a boat to. I’m trying to figure out how you could see a bollard as a “row”–it doesn’t fit in a way I can see, but who knows?
I do think the rows are horiztontal–if they are bricks or stones. If they’re the row houses–then “down to the ground” may only mean there are 15 row houses that lead TO the GROUND where the casque is buried. It’s a stretch–but maybe it’s poetic license?

Good thinking guys!
Here is the full V2 for reference:
At the place where jewels abound
Fifteen rows down to the ground
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
Only three stand watch
As the sound of friends
Fills the afternoon hours
Here is a sovereign people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their heads for a night!
Gnomes admire
Fays delight
The namesakes meeting
Near this site.
I consider the bits in red simply clues to New Orleans, and therefore uninteresting for narrowing it down once we agree on the city. If you’re right about Lafayette Square, the parts in blue can be clues to that specific park.
If the “three” are the statues, then what are they in the middle of? Are there 21 of them? There need to be, otherwise either the verse is lying to us or this isn’t the right park.
Also, who or what are the “namesakes”?

the black scrawls?, def something, i lose resolution in the zoom but it doesnt look like pres to me.

If “PRES” is there maybe it was going to be where JJP was going to hide “Preservation” and then was like, no I just going to literally spell it out instead.

I like this a lot,
but your rows doesnt add up… but it does depend on how high the soil came up the wall in 1981
the wall is sitting on a cement curb, its possible there was soil covering the curb in 1981
but that would mean that at least a foot of ground has been removed and the casque might have been uncovered….
here is an enhanced version of the wall, so you can clarify your counting…

BRILLIANT!
Do we have anyone there digging yet?

forest_blight

Finally, read my post of May 7. Do we have any hunters in the N.O. area? Wilhouse, isn’t Houston sorta close to N.O.??

uh, no…like a 5 hour drive…
wilhouse (spent from failing in houston…)

boogieman

This point I try to make kind of fails when you think that BP confirmed St Louis, and somebody here swears he also said there’s one in Canada.

I guess I always assumed that by telling us they are across North America, it included Canada. Or else it would have said across the US…
wilhouse

Well, maybe he would not have buried it in disturbed earth, but it’s worth remembering that he didn’t expect these to be in the ground for more than a month or two, tops. He wasn’t planning for decades. Also, it could have been turf at the time. I don’t have any photos that I know are from that period (1981) for sure, only a photo from 1985.
I kind of hope it’s not where I think it is, because I don’t think it’s recoverable if it is.

Forrest

The problem with these obfuscated clues and images is that you can make one or two of them fit pretty much any location on earth.

The old human brain is a pattern-matching dynamo, and there were a number of posters here, just 2 weeks ago absolutely convinced that this V pointed to a horse track.
Currently, Forrest, btregre, and I are placing more value on visual cues from the image (as they undeniably help identify the park more easily).
We’ve also got a theory about the structure of the V’s, and we’ll share that as we move along.

The Giant Squid

From Harlequin and Tourmaline Parks:
1) Give it up. There ain’t nothing there but two empty fields (not even a sign marking the park). Some kids were playing rugby.
2) Maybe it points north, to the Mardi Gras fountain. We’ll see.
From Jackson Square:
1) Give it up. Please folks. There are literally thousands of people walking by and through there every single hour. It’s like digging in Times Square.
2) Lots and lots of police.
3) And, not many places to dig. Several patches of dirt, sure. 4 statues in the corner, plus Andrew Jackson in the middle.
4) There no visual cues from the image anywhere in the common environment to point me to that spot.
From the Riverfront/Moonwalk:
1) Well, again, cops all over the place.
2) And, the Riverfront is under perpetual renovation, if it was ever hidden there, it’s sure as hell gone by now.
3) No visual cues, again.
So, in summary.
1) Feeling still ‘okay’ about Armstrong
2) Willing to give City Park another peek
3) Willing to give Audubon Park another peek
4) Very curious about Mardi Gras Park
5) Ruling out Riverfront, Jackson Square for logistical reasons

Giant Squid, thanks for the work you and Forrest are doing on this Verse. It is great to have hunters on site and sharing lots of pictures no less. I don’t think we can rule out a park based on the ease of a performing a daytime dig without people and police noticing. BP has proven and said he has gone to great lengths, including disguise, (probably nighttime digs) to bury the twelve casques.
Parks for other casque locations have strong landmarks. It seems to make more sense to put a park on the back burner due to lack of landmarks rather than odds of daytime witnesses. So, I like your idea of not focusing on parks like Harlequin and Tourmaline, which are featureless.
Fifteen rows down to the ground
This line could mean all 15 rows go to the ground. (Vertical instead of horizontal rows)

Sonoran

Giant Squid, thanks for the work you and Forrest are doing on this Verse. It is great to have hunters on site and sharing lots of pictures no less. I don’t think we can rule out a park based on the ease of a performing a daytime dig without people and police noticing. BP has proven and said he has gone to great lengths, including disguise, (probably nighttime digs) to bury the twelve casques.
Parks for other casque locations have strong landmarks. It seems to make more sense to put a park on the back burner due to lack of landmarks rather than odds of daytime witnesses. So, I like your idea of not focusing on parks like Harlequin and Tourmaline, which are featureless.
Fifteen rows down to the ground
This line could mean all 15 rows go to the ground. (Vertical instead of horizontal rows)

We’re not ruling parks out based on size. But I don’t think we’re going to waste any more time on them until larger more likely parks are ruled out, especially since I’m not seeing many strong matches for the clues. Also, if we have to dig in front of that federal building…we may end up on the news long before we find any buried secrets.
The problem with these obfuscated clues and images is that you can make one or two of them fit pretty much any location on earth.
Bottom line, don’t worry, we have a large scoreboard and cross references for all the clues and which ways we can make them fit every park we’ve been to. Let’s focus on the most likely locations first, though.

Shecrab,
Here’s  a link. I checked out Tower grove park awhile ago and actually it isn’t that far from Forest park, Just down the road a bit.
[/urhttp://stlouis.missouri.org/parks/tower-grove/Welcome/map.html]
Carol

Well, Carol…heheh…had just a bit of trouble with that link. Here’s one for the map.
I read up on the statuary in the park and according to the website, there are four, not three, statues. However, the map only shows three.
There are numerous busts of composers, scattered all throughout the place, though–so maybe a grouping of three of those is what the verse refers to.
http://stlouis.missouri.org/parks/tower … me/map.htm

Johann, see what you can find in the JEwel Box area….but here’s another place to explore, and I wasn’t able to get too many images of this one–but there’s some intriguing information.
Tower Grove Park. There are three statues in this park–apparently it’s the
only
park in St. Louis with 3. They ‘stand watch’ down the middle of the park. it’s just a few blocks from Lafayette Square.  What’s interesting here is that there is a “mock ruins” in the park, made from the limestone blocks from a hotel that was torn down, and they also have 10 ‘whimsical’ pavilions.  This seems just the place to hide the casque…fays and gnomes admiring and meeting—that sort of place.
I know Lafayette square is small–and probably not the ideal hiding place. But this place might be.

I have spent much time in the Jewel Box area, but perhaps I should revisit the area and Lafayette Park.  I did not find any 15 or 21 walls in Forest Park.  The arch-like structure in the 3rd picture is the Vandeventer gate construction.  Alas, nothing 15 or 20 in that thing.

Yeah, I’ve been there. (or should I shout this?????)     :-*
HELLLLLLLOOOOOOOOOOO….anyone home?????
LOL…
I know there are some little things—little trees, little trash cans…etc. Nothing, however that would actually be used as a marker to hide a casque. I proposed this location some time ago…and everyone told me then that the location was just too empty of features to fit into the verse or the pic. so I kinda shut up about it then. However, there were other things that I also thought about then that may be of importance here.
There are more than two parks: Tourmaline and Harlequin are like the big back yards in the nieghborhood. Nothin’ there, just grass and a few trees. No benches, or statuary, no buildings etc. The other two parks are Tiara Park and Peridot Park. There is a strange barrel-shaped park “gate” ornament thingie at the corners of each. However…..down the middle of Canal Blvd, there is open, grassy, park-like area that runs for the full length of the Boulevard
—FROM END TO END
. (!)  There is also statuary there–I have seen something that looks like a monument, memorial–whatever–on one of the blocks. And the land in front of the levees, to the north of Lakeshore Dr. and at the North End of Canal Blvd, is park-like and treed…and may yield something. Trouble with this, is that the area isn’t “named” anything so you can’t find anything definitive on Google. The neighborhoods were devastated by Katrina, as was the shore of L. Ponchartrain–and anything that was there is gone. Restaurants, businesses, etc.
I don’t think the casques are in any of these four parks. There wouldn’t have been anything to “tie” them to there–verse-wise. But the area in the middle of Canal Blvd could be fitted to a line or two…
Oh…and I almost forgot to add this: The length of Canal Blvd’s grassy middles runs from Canal Roadway at the South End of it, (just S. of I-610)
to the shore of L. Ponch—and there are exactly 21 “blocks” of area on the Blvd. In other words,
it’s 21 blocks long.
(In the middle of 21?)

Shecrab
Im sorry, I do read everything you post! I just posted my picture a short time after yours and hadnt read your message in the other thread yet.
Why does there have to be “something” in the park.
There are those little square buildings throughout the area. (I assume they are pumps)
perhaps those buildings are made of 15 rows of cinderblocks who knows
3 stand watch could be trees, or signs or rocks… I’m thinking the spot to dig is equidistant from whatever the three things that stand watch are, (they are standing watch over the burial spot)
those barrel shaped gates are bus stops I think.
I like your thinking on 21 blocks… that makes sense.
BTW the jewel area, harlequin park, et all didnt flood during katrina…

If I were going to dig a hole in a park, I would
rather have it be “off the beaten path” to not
draw unwanted attention.  This area around
the Harlequin Park would have been perfect for
BP to bury a box.
All of the images in P7 give us the New Orleans
location…narrowing down the search area from
an entire continent…The verse brings us into
focus  on “where jewels abound”.
This place has my vote.
AP

I tried that AP. Here’s a good view of the fountain from Google Earth: There’s no “21” anywhere to bisect. I mean, there are more than 21 lampposts around it, there are only 16 Krewe plaques on the top (horizontal) row of plaques on each side–so you can’t use it there, and there are 14 Krewe plaques on the row closer into the fountain itself than the outer row. The rest is pretty much featureless expanse of grass.
I have seen pics of this fountain before and after Katrina. The general layout is the same. Nothing was there in 1981 that isn’t either still there or insignificant–(i.e. the shelter houses.)

I’m sorry–what buildings??? There are no bulidings in Harlequin park! those structures that surround it are private homes! And both parks are surrounded on all sides by private homes–and no casque was buried on private property.  The “things” on the satellite pic of Tourmaline park are Semi Trucks–probably removing debris. The last satellite pic was taken some time after Katrina.
There are
no buildings
in either Tourmaline or Harlequin park. This is extraordinarily clear from the street view.
There is only one structure in Harlequin, and it looks like it might be a public restroom, or perhaps a maintenance shed–no bigger than a small lean-to. It doesn’t look like it’s made of blocks, AND it’s right next to Jewel Street–so I’m voting here for public restroom–I doubt it’s anywhere near there.
And it (the casque) has to be near
something
–BP didn’t bury these in the middle of an open expanse of grass! How would you be able to dig it up?  Get a bunch of boy scouts with shovels to dig a hole every 3 feet apart?  (This is getting surreal in a way–like the plot of the movie “Holes”)
You do need something to key onto, MF—you can’t just say “it’s in a park.  Find it. Dig a hole somewhere.” you have to be able to sight to the location, and then
pinpoint
it.  Remember, these boxes are not that large–maybe a foot square? and the hole was only 3 feet deep. That’s not a large area. AP, I don’t see how the area around Harlequin is “perfect” since it’s all private houses–please explain. Are you talking about the park itself? Or outside of the park?

Well either storyland or the fountain, the point being that is nearby, not the location of the casque.
it is merely an area confirmer.
The characters of storyland make more sense to me as gnomes and fay’s namesakes then the krewes which unique, arent very fay and gnomelike. but no matter as it is an area confirmer.
at the place where jewels abound,
to me pretty much places it inside the levy. outside the levy the streets are not named for jewels.
15 rows down to the ground.  maybe the levy itself, a wall, a staircase, a sign…
here is a wall/gate set into the levy…
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&g … 8&t=h&z=20

I also notice harlequin park actually sits on jewel street.
if you are in the middle of the park you are surrounded by right around 25 houses.
I wonder if in 1981 there were only 21 houses there.
Also if you use google maps street view, there are 3 things in the park, I have no idea what they are,
might be just trash or some work equipment, or maybe they are 3 permanent fixtures ie rocks or something else.
could that be 3 that stand watch?  probably not but just throwing it out…

maltedfalcon

I also notice harlequin park actually sits on jewel street.

maltedfalcon

Also if you use google maps street view, there are 3 things in the park, I have no idea what they are,
might be just trash or some work equipment, or maybe they are 3 permanent fixtures ie rocks or something else.

Did you notice what the street on the other end of the park was called?  Turquoise St…yup, P7’s jewel is turquoise.
I see what look like 2 large electrical boxes and the 3rd is an elevated thing with stacks or barrels atop.  They all appear to be permanent but do they stand watch?

Sorry, one other little tidbit I find interesting.  When trying to find pics of Harlequin Park on Flickr, I was innundated with pic after pic of a rugby team named the Harlequins……
……..from…….
OTTAWA
don’t you love
how these pics all seem to be tying together?

There are no pictures of Harlequin park because there’s nothing there.
And the floodgate MF posted—is the same one I posted a pic of.
Isn’t anyone listening to me at all?

shecrab

Isn’t anyone listening to me at all?

did someone say something?
here are some maps of the area in question and yes, it does look quite barren…but…on a couple of these maps, click on the “birds eye view” for some really neat looks at the park.  This also comes in handy if you drag the map on over to City Park or even Jackson Sq.
http://www.placenames.com/us/p535528/

actually Animal painter said perfect,
I said possible.
There are at least 3 structures in Harlequin park, If you are using google earth they dont show up very well.
street view on google maps works better. If you are using street view go around to the other side of the park.
I agree the casque has to be near something.
that something could simply be a tree or a rock or a lean-to type shed.
the small square buildings actually are pump stations they are located throughout the area.
If you are suggesting that from street view in google maps you can see what the buildings are made of, you cant. I have a large screen monitor so I can blow up the street view quite large, but the resolution is not there to show what the construction is. someone will need to go look. It could be cinderblock or poured concrete or perhaps is just simple siding.
I am not suggesting digging up the whole park-
I am suggesting we solve the verse and dig exactly where the casque is. the things I am suggesting are really quite specific. ie 21 houses around the park, cinderblocks for rows, 3 objects in the park. I realize the verse needs to key into something so I am making specific suggestions.
you said there are no walls on the levee, I pointed out several. you said there are no markings on levees I pointed out several ways for there to be markings. you said there are no buildings in harlequin park, there are at least 3 yes they are small but they are still structures in the park.
At the place where jewels abound, is quite clear, meaning this neighbor hood,
the harlequin on the clock matches the name of the park
I am not saying it must be in harlequin park, but I think it is in this neighborhood perhaps in a park there are at least 4 here or perhaps on the levy, or perhaps along the center street (canal?)
Again while it needs to be buried near somthing for reference ( 3 things keeping watch) those things dont need to be huge important objects.  cleveland was buried in the back of a planter and chicago was in a non-descript corner of a park, kind of like harlequin…
Again I am not saying it has to be in harlequin park, but I am pretty sure it is in this neighborhood.

i also like the 21 blocks of grassy area. is there anything noteworthy at the halfway point of this area?

I didnt see anything and it was south of the jewel neigborhood, but still worth investigating more.

i still like the second line being a road (roads),
fifteen rows down to the ground………..15 roads down to the ground from harlequin park to city park (as someone mentioned long time ago)

Turquoise the
Fays
of France
keep
: stone
Rare as a blue midsummer’s day.
Now that I’ve got it sorted, the crescent shaped turquise in image 7 and New Orleans’ France born heritage, I may look more closely at verse 2 for location specifics.
At the place where jewels abound
Fifteen rows down to the ground
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
Only three stand watch
As the sound of friends
Fills the afternoon hours
Here is a sovereign people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their
heads for a night
!
Gnomes admire
Fays
delight
The namesakes meeting
Near this site.
Outside-the-box: Does the word “keep” from the LotJ come from a children’s bedtime prayer?  Both the prayer and the verse reference where heads go for the night and both relate to the word “wake”.
Now I lay me down to sleep,
I pray the Lord my soul to
keep
,
If I shall die before I
wake
,
I pray the Lord my soul to take. Amen
My idea stems from the alternate sense of the word ‘wake’ as a vigil relating to a funeral.  Is the sound of friends in afternoon hours the sound of a wake? I previously referred to the use of reference to the Preservation Hall most requested and Louis Armstrong favorite: When The Saints Go Marching In.  This is a funeral dirge, basically an upbeat wake tune.
Oh, when the saints go marching in
Oh, when the saints go marching in
I want to be in that number
When the saints go marching in
In the middle of twenty-one = “in that number”.
This brings me back to the the Fays of France keep:
stone
and At the place where jewels
abound
, both being end-of-line words, I find there’s a commonality and possibly a major wordplay leap that will be hard for some to swallow.  Abound means “great in number”.  I ask, what is the greatest number?  Posed as a mini-riddle, I think the answer is “No. 1”.  Even though it’s considered the smallest whole number, it’s also used to represent the number everyone wants to be, better than the rest, or winningest.  Is the word ‘stone’ a play on words?
stone = st.one = concatenated version of “Saint One” or “Saint Louis Cemetery No. 1”.
The next line “rare as a blue mindsummer’s day” may be using the word ‘rare’ to mean ‘unique’ or “only one”.  A midsummer’s day only happens once a year?

Turquoise the
Fays
of France
keep
: stone
Rare as a blue midsummer’s day.
Now that I’ve got it sorted, the crescent shaped turquise in image 7 and New Orleans’ France born heritage, I may look more closely at verse 2 for location specifics.
At the place where jewels abound
Fifteen rows down to the ground
In the middle of twenty-one
From end to end
Only three stand watch
As the sound of friends
Fills the afternoon hours
Here is a
sovereign
people
Who build palaces to shelter
Their
heads for a night
!
Gnomes admire
Fays
delight
The namesakes meeting
Near this site.
Outside-the-box: Does the word “keep” from the LotJ come from a children’s bedtime prayer?  Both the prayer and the verse reference where heads go for the night and both relate to the word “wake”.
Now I lay me down to sleep,
I pray the Lord my soul to
keep
,
If I shall die before I
wake
,
I pray the Lord my soul to take. Amen
My idea stems from the alternate sense of the word ‘wake’ as a vigil relating to a funeral.  Is the sound of friends in afternoon hours the sound of a wake? I previously referred to the use of reference to the Preservation Hall most requested and Louis Armstrong favorite: When The Saints Go Marching In.  This is a funeral dirge, basically an upbeat wake tune.
Oh, when the saints go marching in
Oh, when the saints go marching in
I want to be in that number
When the saints go marching in
In the middle of twenty-one = “in that number”.
This brings me back to the the Fays of France keep:
stone
and At the place where jewels
abound
, both being end-of-line words, I find there’s a commonality and possibly a major wordplay leap that will be hard for some to swallow.  Abound means “great in number”.  I ask, what is the greatest number?  Posed as a mini-riddle, I think the answer is “No. 1”.  Even though it’s considered the smallest whole number, it’s also used to represent the number everyone wants to be, better than the rest, or winningest.  Is the word ‘stone’ a play on words?
stone = st.one = concatenated version of “Saint One” or “Saint Louis Cemetery No. 1”.
The next line “rare as a blue mindsummer’s day” may be using the word ‘rare’ to mean ‘unique’ or “only one”.  A midsummer’s day only happens once a year?

Its not that I find wordplay hard to swallow,  but
out of the 31 words in the prayer, why do you choose wake ?  Keep would more logically be associated with sleep as that is it’s rhyming pair
You chose wake , not logically and through a methodology but because it is the most likely word to fit your final solution.
it seems like you came up with your solution first and then are trying hard to come up with ways to support it.

Hi,
I’m sorry to understand I get perceived as a troll. Yes, it can be a rookie mistake, as I don’t usually use forums if not for reading, and even though I’ve been lurking here for years I never felt I had anything very important to add to the theories, maybe I wrote once or twice in years.
I can easily explain why I posted on any relevant-to-my-theory thread:
I don’t usually check all the threads, and I only check the threads that are relevant to me. Or receive notifications only for the threads I subscribed for.
So in my case I would have never known about an interesting theory for something I could be interested into if not posted inside the very thread I’m following. Therefore I thought that could be useful for those only checking “their” thread. Probably my bad. Sorry.
I posted because I thought it was a solid theory, and fortunately I also received some positive feedback, otherwise I would have never posted as I never felt the urge to do so in many years.
I don’t care about likes or views (I basically never use socials apart private Facebook, seriously, never cared for them!), I don’t get any benefit from them, I just wanted the people that could have been affected by my theory to know that maybe there was a different direction to look at. That’s all.

strike13

So the ground isn’t “Clay’? I also do not know enough about NO, but have been curious as to people’s thoughts on if it could be reference Henry Clay?

Well yes, that is another connector Strike. The ground is in reference to Lafayette Square where there is the center statue of Henry Clay. As you stand on the side of the Henry Clay statue and look around you can see many, many of the clues in Image 7 and Verse 2. I like your thinking.

Delilah84

Hi,
I’m sorry to understand I get perceived as a troll. Yes, it can be a rookie mistake, as I don’t usually use forums if not for reading, and even though I’ve been lurking here for years I never felt I had anything very important to add to the theories, maybe I wrote once or twice in years.
I can easily explain why I posted on any relevant-to-my-theory thread:
I don’t usually check all the threads, and I only check the threads that are relevant to me. Or receive notifications only for the threads I subscribed for.
So in my case I would have never known about an interesting theory for something I could be interested into if not posted inside the very thread I’m following. Therefore I thought that could be useful for those only checking “their” thread. Probably my bad. Sorry.
I posted because I thought it was a solid theory, and fortunately I also received some positive feedback, otherwise I would have never posted as I never felt the urge to do so in many years.
I don’t care about likes or views (I basically never use socials apart private Facebook, seriously, never cared for them!), I don’t get any benefit from them, I just wanted the people that could have been affected by my theory to know that maybe there was a different direction to look at. That’s all.

Fair enough. Thanks for the reply.

MrBackstop

Yeah I forgot that I adjusted my thinking about the Jazz walking tour itself. I haven’t looked at this one in quite awhile since I posted my solve.
The history of the Jazz walking tours have been around forever according to a friend who grew up in NOLA but didn’t become official Jazz tours until the mid 80s I believe. So as I thought more about it I’m more inclined to believe BP was talking about the row houses that go down St. Charles St from Lafayette Square. I haven’t been able to find any history on what has or has not been torn down over the last 30+ years.
For me though this line in the verse:
Fifteen rows down to the ground
simply refers to row houses…these could have been 15 rows on the St. Charles that went from Canal St down to the ground (Lafayette Square) or perhaps 15 rows on Camp Street. I just have no way to quantify 15 with so many changes over the years.

So the ground isn’t “Clay’? I also do not know enough about NO, but have been curious as to people’s thoughts on if it could be reference Henry Clay?

youd have to explain what the fifteen rows are, but its not a terrible idea. not as good as at least 3 other readings which are very clearly perfect. but there are probably several applications overall.

Unknown

Unknown:
not as good as at least 3 other readings which are very clearly perfect

“Perfect” means without flaws. So unless there are at least three casques in New Orleans, or all three solves lead to the same place, only one can be “perfect”. The other two can not. With all the success being claimed in that city, I’m leaning toward the former.

Delilah84

Hi guys, possible new theory for New Orleans and verse 2. Hope this can be of help!
viewtopic.php?f=32&t=7362

Okay, I have been off this board for a bit and I come back and notice that you are just posting the same thing again and again across threads. Maybe a rookie mistake, but there are some unspoken rules here.
Post into a thread your thoughts.
If you believe that there is a connection, post into the corresponding Image or Verse thread, but not leading back to a thread that makes no sense to begin with.
This board is about discussing solid theories and how they apply to this puzzle. not about views and likes, ala Twitter or FB.