My point regarding these double meaning words is that , for instance, “compass” could mean an instrument that draws circles, or it could be an instrument that gives a proper magnetic heading.  In attempting to figure out what type of location the riddle is describing as a whole, the idea of a “compass” takes on two very different meanings if you are trying to infer some type of theme.  For instance “beating” can mean a ship beating out to sea, a ship from the age of sail.  Combined with a magnetic compass, the place being described in the riddle might have a nautical theme.  Using the other (and not the only other) meaning of “compass” the nauticle theme would not necessarily work as well, ( though it might because a compass that draws circles might also be used in navigation at sea). But an instrument such as a compass (to draw circles) might have a mathematical theme, or  might mean something else entirely.   Thus I believe you have to keep an open mind when searching the internet and using these  double meaning words as a basis for solving the riddle.   What type of “compass” will you be passing before you get to the culvert?

Another thing to keep in mind
is that these were designed and hidden
over twenty some odd years ago.
Up until his demise, BP didn’t feel the need
to give out any solves and from what has been found,
the locations have been fairly static.
When I read and free associate, I try and think
what was around a LONG time ago…. turn of the centruy stuff
or an event which has a static location that has had  along distinguished
history.
In this regard, permanence tends to hid in plain sight.
Even Blockbuster wasn’t around in 1982

Slappy, that is an excellent point!! I loved those pictures. I didn’t know there were 8 lions–I thought only 4.
And AP, nice photos of the Ravine Road corner!!  Thirty years ago there would have been almost no trees in that area–those are young trees, not old ones.

Tree info
I’ve been trying to look up how much trees actually grow in thirty years, and whether or not they might look significantly different. Fact is, they wouldn’t. This will definitely work to our advantage with this puzzle!!
From research I did, I found that most trees have an initial growth period where they might double their height and girth. This usually occurs in the first 10-12 years. After that, the tree will not add more than, say, 6 to 7 inches in girth and 10 feet or so in height in the next thirty years.
If the tree is ‘shaped’ oddly in, say, 1981, it will continue to recognizably keep that odd shape in 2001! That means that if BP used unusual trees as markers to bury casques, it is very likely that unless the trees died completely and were taken out, cut down, etc., the trees he used would be recognizable now. They will be taller, but not significantly fatter.
It is not easy to tell the exact age of a tree unless you count the growth rings, or you are a botanist and can use formulas for growth rates in twigs.  But you can estimate. To measure tree age by its circumference, you take the measurement at about chest level. A 40-year-old oak or poplar tree will have a circumference of about 12 to 18 feet. Height is more indicative of age than girth–so if the tree is planted as a 10′ sapling in 2000, in 2010 it will be 20 feet tall, then growth upward will begin to slow down; the tree may only add half a foot each year for the next 10 years–this number will steadily drop, though never completely stop until the tree dies.
This is actually good news for us. If a tree is pictured in the painting
and it was a mature tree to begin with
, then we can pretty much count on that tree looking like the painting, even after all this time! But the undergrowth will be a different story altogether.
The bigger trees pictured in the ravine road area and the lion bridges are probably not much different than when BP saw them while burying the casque. Their roots will be wider-spread, however…so even if he picked a place where tree roots didnt’ seem to be a problem THEN, they may be now.
It would be useful to find out from park administrators if any of the trees that are there now were there then. Then, a more accurate picture of the area could be formulated.

Any clue as to what that sawhorse is there for?

KLBT,
I  think they have been there for a long, long time.
They do not appear to be covering a hole or dangerous area.
It is a convenient place to store them, for when they want
to close-off Ravine Rd.
AP

thank you ck
that guy has some great photos.  i liked the one he took of the lion bridge from the lighthouse, but the ones he took of the lighthouse in the snow were beautiful!

read smiley518’s comment on this picture of the lion’s bridge:
“Beautiful lighting, John! I like how the lion’s mane drapes over it like a hood against the cold. : ) “
http://flickr.com/photos/johndecember/2252994903/
our lady has a hood also.
forest……um, you’ve been quiet on this….haven’t you been there?

A chat with a UWM librarian found nothing on Marietta. But I spoke on the phone with some librarians from the Milwaukee Co. Historical Society. They consulted the book
Milwaukee Streets: The Stories Behind Their Names
and found that Marietta Ave. was named in 1891 by Clarence Shepard. The author does not know why it was named “Marietta,” though. I have the book on order through interlibrary loan. For a small fee the library will do more research, but I have also contacted the Dept. of City Development’s historic preservation folks; perhaps they will be able to help. More later.

Sounds great stercox.  Pictures coming?  Also, is there a way to identify on a map exactly which ravine has the Girl Scout trail?
I’ve got a good contact in the Milwaukee County Parks system, who has been briefed on the hunt since about 2004.  He’s given me directions on who to talk to and how to acquire permission to dig in the park.  The contact info isn’t really the kind of thing I should post publicly, but I’ll PM you (stercox and forest).
Pine

How’s the ground out there?  I had planned a trip the weekend of the 1st of April but didn’t really plan on any digging.  I figured there would still be snow on the ground.  It was more a sort of fact-finding mission.  I may really get fired up, though, if the ground is thawed a bit.  I have to find a Wisconson park ranger uniform so I won’t look suspicious.
By the way I think there was a Marietta indian tribe somewhere, but I could be wrong.  I may be thinking of Marinette.

Just figured out that Girl Scout Ravine is the one to the south of the big parking lots.
(edit:  I was wrong on the original post.  Based this belief off of a Google search where a local birdwatching club had misidentified the ravine)

Unknown

Unknown:
Now, I’m new at this but don’t some of the other verses and pictures reference Lincoln or streets named Lincoln?

Indeed. V12 referred to a sitting statue of Lincoln in Chicago.

Met with Dr. Alfred Bader this morning at the Astor Hotel.  Very nice gentleman, lots of history about the temple Emanuel and about the Woman Playing Harpsichord.  Interestingly, he handed me a printout from an e mail from KP UNC to him, which he found very mysterious.  I about LOL when I saw it.  And then explained the purpose of the inquiry.  Here is what he told me:  He just acquired the painting in 2004 from a man in Coppenhagen and resold it.  It was not in Milwaukee, in 1982.  Nor has it ever in the Emanuel temple or his home.  Dead end.  The beating of the world could refer to the Emanuel temple still.  The temple is across Kenwood from Mitchell Hall, thus “bookending” Kenwood, like a trail head.  My theory is that much of the first part has to do with moving you down the 5 or so blocks toward Lake Park.  The names of the streets are named after people who lived here back during the construction of the park.  Spent an hour at a local book store researching the history of the streets.  The only one I cannot connect to a past resident is Marietta.  And Marietta may be our woman with harpsichord in some way.  I think Blight may have it–Lincoln Memorial cast in copper on the back side of a penny represents Lincoln Memorial Drive which is the border of Lake Park.  Ascend the 92 steps–THERE ARE 92 STEPS–a perfect count– IF you only count the steps connected directly to the staircase (the walls that define it).  There is a clear demarcation of where the staircase begins and ends.  This does not include any steps approaching the staircase.  The stairs are the original steps, nothing added or deleted, this is confirmed by a member of the Friends of Lake Park.

The compass has to be North Point Lighthouse.  There is nothing else in or close to the park that is like a compass.  Here is my theory about the ravines.  There are foot paths down in the ravines which take you down hill SE toward Lincoln Memorial Drive moving under the Lion Bridges.  One ravine has been nick named the “Girl Scout Ravine”, this from the general manager of the Lake Park Bistro at the top of the Grand Staircase.  There is a metal marker embedded in a tree at the top of the hill (GS ravine trail head)  it reads  Milwaukee County Park Systems–
G
irl Scout Trail.  I believe there may have been another marker like this on a tree at the other end of the Girl Scout ravine.  Standing under the Bridge in the first ravine, 100 paces takes you out of the ravine into a flattened grassy area.  There are 5 solid tall trees in this area (one at the end of the trail) and they standout.  Moving west from the 1st ravine and that first tree  toward the 2nd ravine (the Girl Scout trail) you pass three big trees to get to the 5th tree, the biggest monster tree, which if a Girl Scout sign was attached to a tree at the end (like one was at the trail head), it would be this tree.  Is it buried under there??–did some minor digging–very rooty and very open to the public.  Nothing found.  Of course–its all specularion.  Would take some excavation work, the tree of course is 24 years older and bigger than it was.  I think the trees are poplar or cottonwood, but not birch.  Oddly enough–I did find a penny tail side (Lincoln Memorial side) up minted in——you got it—1982.

Suggested areas for further research:
Milwaukee County Park Systems Girl Scout Trail markers
What is 200?  (total stair count does not approach 200 at all, it about 50 ish shy)
Birch trees that don’t look like birch trees–could BP just not know his trees?  (Birch = From the Old German “Birka” meaning “Bright”)
Who is the Harpsichord Woman?
Where is that darn casque??

Two questions, why are you all so sure of “G” being the letter from the country of wonderstone’s hearth?  I know Germany is believed to go along with this verse but a letter could also be an e, r, m, a, n, or y as well.  There are no palms in Wisconson so it can’t be buried under a giant W.  (sorry, I couldn’t resist)  And could a proud, tall 5th be a musical reference?  Alcohol reference?
Also, I thought the grand staircase had two semi-circles at the bottom, CC = 200 (forest_blight’s post brought this up).
If the staircase is a sure bet, couldn’t we just skip how we got there?  I mean, those clues may have been helpful in 82 when there was no internet, but now is a different story.

forest_blight

Indeed. V12 referred to a sitting statue of Lincoln in Chicago.

I read all the forums in one sitting so I may be confused, but didn’t one picture have a profile of Lincoln and didn’t the San Francisco park border on a Lincoln street?  I’d hate to have to read all these forums again….

Unknown

Unknown:
Interestingly, he handed me a printout from an e mail from KP UNC to him, which he found very mysterious.  I about LOL when I saw it.  And then explained the purpose of the inquiry.

Unknown

Unknown:
The names of the streets are named after people who lived here back during the construction of the park. Spent an hour at a local book store researching the history of the streets. The only one I cannot connect to a past resident is Marietta. And Marietta may be our woman with harpsichord in some way.

Unknown

Unknown:
There are 5 solid tall trees in this area (one at the end of the trail) and they standout.  Moving west from the 1st ravine and that first tree  toward the 2nd ravine (the Girl Scout trail) you pass three big trees to get to the 5th tree, the biggest monster tree, which if a Girl Scout sign was attached to a tree at the end (like one was at the trail head), it would be this tree.  Is it buried under there??

Unknown

Unknown:
What is 200?  (total stair count does not approach 200 at all, it about 50 ish shy)

Unknown

Unknown:
Who is the Harpsichord Woman?

Unknown

Unknown:
Where is that darn casque??

Unknown

Unknown:
Two questions, why are you all so sure of “G” being the letter from the country of wonderstone’s hearth?  I know Germany is believed to go along with this verse but a letter could also be an e, r, m, a, n, or y as well.  There are no palms in Wisconson so it can’t be buried under a giant W.  (sorry, I couldn’t resist)  And could a proud, tall 5th be a musical reference?  Alcohol reference?

stercox, you are amazing! I plead guilty for the KP UNC e-mail; I thought it sounded like a great lead so I sent Bader Fine Arts an inquiry through their web page. Didn’t realize it would go to the man himself, but I am glad it was good for a laugh. Sorry to hear the harpsichord painting is a dead end, though.
Can we assume that the
three who lived there
are Downer, Hackett, and Shepard? There is a Summit Ave. between Hackett and Shepard, but it evidently wasn’t named after a person. I will do what I can to find out who Marietta was. The information was available to BP in 1982, so it shouldn’t be impossible to find today.
And it is extremely exciting to finally get the 92 steps confirmed!
I’d bet a lot that the casque is under that very tree, stercox! Good job. And it may not matter that it isn’t a birch. The verse reads:
Walk 100 paces
Southeast over rock and soil
To the first young
birch
Pass three
{three what? birches or just trees?}
, staying west
You’ll see a letter from the country
Of wonderstone’s hearth
On a proud, tall fifth
{again, fifth what? if “tree,” then we’re good}
At its southern foot
The treasure waits.
Nothing here says the tree we are looking for is actually a birch. To respond to Starthinker’s question, I’m pretty sure the
proud, tall fifth
refers to a tree, since we encounter a “first” and then “three” more, and we haven’t changed nouns yet.
Starthinker is right – the “grand 200” must be the CC-shaped section of stairs.
I’m all over it. I’ll report back.
Under that darn tree! Get a shovel! How long will you be in town?
That’s a good point. I assumed “G” because it is the first letter of Germany, which surely is the wonderstone’s hearth.
I am going there in May, and uh boy, what a great trip it would be if I could dig…
with permission
. Or even just take pictures while somebody else digs. I wonder if there are any other forum-readers local to Milwaukee? If not, stercox, could you use your capital to prepare them to expect me in May, and work to get permission for supervised digging?

Unknown

Unknown:
you may want to get some digging help

First– thanks to everyone for the support.  I worked from information that you guys have freely shared on this board–I feel a part of that group effort.  And a group effort it should be…
Blight are you still thinking May 9th??  That’s a tuesday–which makes it a really tough schedule for me–but it could be done.  Whoever wants to show up–it’d be a blast–If we don’t find it, we can go cry in a beer and go home.  Hopefully, we’ll be celebrating.  I am nervous about asking permission to dig–because they could say “no” and I’ve been-there-done-that down in St. Augustine, and its very frustrating and unfulfilling–I’m still waiting for a “yes” response down there.  We could try Pine
Birch’s
contact without giving the date of the dig, unless he agrees.  That way–if the contact declines, we can cloak-and-dagger it if we have too.  Varin should be there if she can be–I hope so.  I think that the growth of that tree and the harsh winters have crunched up that plexiglass box and ceramic casque–I’m guessing its in pieces–probably enough to go around for who ever helps.
Pine how accomodating would your park guys be–do you think?

I hate to tell you all this but I went to Milwaukee this weekend and dug up the casque.
JUST KIDDING!
Good luck!  I wish I could go but I just couldn’t swing it.  I’m only 4 hours away, too.  Hope you all find it!

Also, a group of lions is called a
pride
, so maybe a single lion could be called
proud
.

Jimerson,
This does make sense.
If the “letter” on the proud tall 5th were obvious,
it would be a slam-dunk.
Slappy, I have probed around the bases of the lions and
have not yet found a “plastic” sound.
Still pursuing the Girl Scout markers on trees
that may have existed in 1982.
My conversation with the Milwaukee County landscape architect on
Sunday has led me to the woman who actually created the Girl Scout trail…
(She has no photos herself)
And she has led me to a woman who keeps in touch with other
Girl Scout Leaders of that decade, who were also involved….
Those leaders (who are now in their 60’s and 70’s)
are having a gathering this Saturday…in which they
will be asked if they have any photos of the Lake Park
area of the trail from the 70’s and 80’s.
It is definitely a world of “connections”.
AP

i was just looking at the lions again in this picture:
http://www.lakeparkfriends.org/explore/ … dges.shtml
in the last picture, it looks like grass where the lions are, and i was thinking…….
southern foot………….south paw…………….left
the lion’s left foot
which woulld mean not at the bottom of the bridge but right there in the grassy area, base of the lion
or, any of the lions left feet

Currently sitting in Caffe Baci, directly across Michigan Ave. from the Chicago casque site. I feel like I am on a pilgrimage (more on that later).
Here are some (but by no means all) of our Milwaukee pictures, to give you a flavor. I have more, and stercox took a few as well. First is the tree, before we did anything:
After de-turfing:
After digging for a few hours:
…and after calling it quits (this time!) and filling in the hole and starting a new one on the southwest side:

I thought it would be there for sure. We met at 9:00 at the base of the 92 steps and walked around the park for a bit, then met up with a park employee. We went to the casque site (?), got out the shovels stercox brought (and there were many!) and begain removing turf, which was duly set aside for replacement later. Then it was dig dig dig!
We encountered some pretty hefty roots, several large stones, broken glass, and about 20 pop-tops. We cleared an area of maybe 5 or 6 square yards around the southern foot of the
proud, tall fifth
to a depth of 2 feet. Yes, it’s true that the book says it could go deeper, but the soil was very dense and heavily populated by large roots. It wasn’t looking promising. And unfortunately I think we used our one and only “dig a hole in Lake Park free” card; several years may have to pass before anyone seeks permission to dig again, but hopefully by that point we will have stronger arguments for a spot and more casque discoveries to use as leverage.
A few passersby rubbernecked; some even came up and asked what we were doing. We just told them we were looking for a flowerpot and that was enough to scare them away.

Upsides:
– General Agreement that you were near the right spot
– Have a contact in the Park System
– Stuck to that ‘no media’ clause
– Have very little chance that the area will be covered in
concrete before the next time you give it a go.
– Can always blame the Harsichord Lady. (she kept silent)

I am sorry you did not find it YET, but I hope you had a lot of fun trying — the journey can be more fun than the destination.
For how long did you guys dig?  Did you prod around the other sides of the tree, just in case?  Give us the details!

There were five of us digging for about 4-5 hours.  I did bring a probe type thingy–but you couldn’t go very far down without hitting
something
.  My muscles are telling me this morning that we moved a lot of dirt yesterday!  Although disappointing outcome–still had fun–the anticipation and excitement, meeting Forest and Pine were treasure enough for this day.  I still believe that its in that area,  but maybe birch really means birch.  The Park Manager, declared our trees cottonwood.  Had to come, had to try, it was well worth the trip.
Sir Egg and Siskel,
We remarked during out efforts when we were starting to get the unsettling feeling that we were not going to find it–that it shows you just how difficult this hunt really is AND what a remarkable accomplishment Cleveland really was.
So, 2 Down 10 to GO!!  Keep working everybody!

forest_blight

Thanks for the good wishes, folks, but we dug and and dug (and dug) with no luck. Just roots, pop-tops, and stones. but I made three great new friends. We’ll post pictures later.

Thanks alot, I had a tenner on you guys.

Can not wait to see the photos.
I just reviewed the logic that went into
this location with both the verse and the image,
and I can not see any reason that it is not
at that tree.  The ‘southern foot’
matches up with the image and the jewel placement.
And with the ground as hard as it was, there
is no likelyhood that someone would have dug it
up recently.
Not that it would be an initial comfort, but I hope
someone can spot something in the photos you’ll post.
“Carpe Dig’um” – Seize the Dirt.

Trohn

Not that it would be an initial comfort, but I hope
someone can spot something in the photos you’ll post.
“Carpe Dig’um” – Seize the Dirt.

Yeah, like a guy standing in the background holding the casque.

How unfortunate.  I too believe this MUST be very near the site.  Too many things fit.  I cant wait for the pictures…they just might hold the key.
Carpe Dig’um…..now that is just too darn funny Trohn.  Looks like we Secret searchers now have a new Motto.

forest_blight

Thanks for the good wishes, folks, but we dug and and dug (and dug) with no luck. Just roots, pop-tops, and stones. but I made three great new friends. We’ll post pictures later.

Oh what a shame! I really feel for you. Hope you dug all around that darn tree (hope you got the correct tree too)!? Looking at all the clues and ground work that’s been done, I was convinced you were right.
Hope you get another chance to dig some more…you MUST be close.
Ade

Trohn

but only
one thing that could be considered a compass.

which is what? the lighthouse?  I must be missing something because I still dont know why everyone is tying in our compass with a lighthouse.  It just doesnt make sense to me.
COMPASS:
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=compass

fox – The name of the lighthouse is “North Point Lighthouse.” It is a clever choice by BP to call it a compass, since compasses “point north.”

Nice map and link that I have used now and again.
Many bridges (iron, concrete, wooden, etc) but only
one thing that could be considered a compass.
http://www.lakeparkfriends.org/explore.shtml

Unknown

Unknown:
View the three stories of Mitchell
As you walk the beating of the world

Unknown

Unknown:
At a distance in space
From
woman, with harpsichord
Silently playing

That reminds me of a Foucault Pendulum, which illustrates the Earth’s rotation as it swings back and forth.  We see them in science musuems and planetariums.
Jan Vermeer, The Concert (c1665-6)
Vermeer’s The Concert (one of the greatest of his remaining 36 paintings) was stolen from the Isabella Stewart Gardener Museum, Boston on 18 March, 1990 – the biggest heist in US history. The thieves dressed as policemen and convinced security they were checking the museum. The priceless work pictures a man playing the lute, a young woman playing the harpsichord and another singer.
So was it still in Boston in 1982?

I haven’t read through every post on this image/verse but I think the veterans lagoon looks like the outline of the dress on the bottom right of the image. And this may be a little out there but I think the lagoon looks like the rough outline of a 3 and the road splits after the lagoon near the Juneau statue. “Pass three, staying west”? Just a thought.

Deuce

I think the veterans lagoon looks like the outline of the dress on the bottom right

You’d need to post up suggested image matches graphically really, as people are unlikely to hunt them down.
I still like this Lake Park match, though that doesn’t do much for my Juneau Park theory…
That dent in the cape halfway down on the left side has always annoyed me. If you equate it with that road intersection on the map, there’s one of the Lake Park signs there.
Walk 100 paces
Southeast over rock and soil
To the first young birch
Pass three, staying west
I’ve always wondered vaguely about the south end of Lake Park. 100 paces from the lion bridge gets you back onto Lincoln, and it’s been suggested that the “birch” was on the other side of the road. If you head west down Lincoln, you “pass three” on a road sign that’s down by the beach. (Top red circle on the map below; forget the lower one. This is towards the bottom end of the cape shape.)
Difficult to know what the tall proud fifth could be in this area though.

Deuce

Something strange happened…
I had a dream last night that a group of us were digging for the casque in Milwaukee. Not sure where exactly we were digging but we went about 10 feet deep! At 10 feet we found a piece of paper that just had verse 8 on it. We climbed out of the hole and Preiss was there. He said we had the wrong location and to look at the proud, tall fifth and pointed to Solomon Juneau. Then he said Sol is the fifth. That’s all I rermember.
Sol is the fifth note of scale and is also short for Solomon.
Wow.

Just found something interesting…
Even after going over this image many times with a fine-tooth comb, I never noticed the bell in the woman’s hand until I saw it mentioned on the forum a little bit ago. I think someone said it’s a reference to a street name. If I missed that in the image, I don’t have a chance with this hunt.
Anyhow, totally unrelated to any theory I currently have, I decided to look up bells in Milwaukee just to see what I could find. I found the obvious, the City Hall bell. Knowing City Hall is in the image I thought it may be worth looking into a little further. There is an interesting history about the bell itself but I won’t get into it.
I found that the bell tones in the key of “G”. Yep, that’s right. “G”, as in Germany. Well isn’t that strange. Kind of a coincidence that “G” is the “fifth” note also known as “Sol”.
And as if that weren’t enough to get me going, guess what the name of the bell is??………. You got it, “Solomon Juneau”!

ON
a proud, tall fifth,
This makes sense as I’m using the hat ON the statue of Thaddeus Kosciuszko as one of the points of reference.
The other is the bell in the tower of the St. Josaphat, that’s how I’m interpretting the bell in the hand.

Thaddeus Kosciuoszko was born in a village and well educated = a man of letters from the country.  This is in the sense of urban vs rural.  He was educated in Warsaw.
He is also decorated as a brigadier general, having 1 of 5 stars rank…a proud tall fifth, tall because he is on horseback.
I think a straight line connecting his pointy hat with the belfry of St. Josaphat us right in front of the south side of the Ash tree at 821 W. Lincoln.

Do you think we need permission just to probe the area? It shouldn’t make a mess or anything. But it would really stink if we think we find something and can’t dig it up.

For this to work you need to find the statue of Kosciuszko and then walk in the direction of the Bell tower of St. Josaphat’s Basilica.  You’ll see this Ash tree  (I’m still speculating on it’s identification as an Ash, btw) and that is where someone should get a probe and test the ground for a casque at the tree’s southern foot.
I pieced together a bunch of screenshots to approximate the best line from the hat on the Thaddeus statue to the tip of the belfry.
Here’s a zoom on that spot:

Deuce

Something strange happened…
I had a dream last night that a group of us were digging for the casque in Milwaukee. Not sure where exactly we were digging but we went about 10 feet deep! At 10 feet we found a piece of paper that just had verse 8 on it. We climbed out of the hole and Preiss was there. He said we had the wrong location and to look at the proud, tall fifth and pointed to Solomon Juneau. Then he said Sol is the fifth. That’s all I rermember.
Sol is the fifth note of scale and is also short for Solomon.
Wow.

I too sometimes think about answers so much that I start to dream about them. Interesting dream though..

As you can see there is a precedent set by image 4 in how the images can work as you get close to you’re area.  The hat shape is probably from a different angle than what I had available to capture, so you’ll have to imagine it’s basic composition and see it does have a similar shape to the collar area.  We basically have three near visual confirmers and two lines in the verse relate to him, a man of letters from a rural village and a hat on a proud 1 star (5 stars max for rank of General) tall statue of a Brigadier General on horseback.  The aerial photo shows the outline of the path that is available from an overhead map of 1981 which fits the basic outline of the decollage.

Deuce

I had a dream last night

What an excellent dream. I like the bell theory too. The hand is one of the most obvious 5s in the pic, and it also uses City Hall.
The Solomon Juneau bell…

Third time’s a charm?
Someday!

you might actually use both downer and kenwood
in that you would go down downer to kenwood then back up to the distance and time.

if you go down downer along kenwood then back up to spot you pass an extra location, which would seem to be the right path.

I’ve posted some recent photos from Milwaukee at Webshots:
http://community.webshots.com/user/quantpsy/

Oh wow!  This idea just tickles me because the tree I am thinking of is where the jewel is in this overlay from an aerial image taken in 2000.  You can see the path outline that fits a shoulder to shoulder curve possibility.
Here is the very tree I suspected earlier, this time I used one of those aging algorithm programs you can find all over the internet to see what the image in the cape looks like 30 years later!
Just kidding about the aging algorithm…but here’s my best attempt-

WR, using your input, I’ve been working through the route more carefully.  Verse and Image are both giving us directions.  The route almost seems scattered, but is actually one path if you are willing to “juggle” the lines of the verse and pair particulars in the image to fill important gaps.
Preface:  I have evolved several early ideas to a point where this is currently my most complete and upto date version.  All points have been checked for accuracy and existed previous to 1980.  I don’t have a solid idea on what would be the culvert…could be Lake Park, could be the crossing at Plankington (waterway).  My guess is that we don’t dig at the southern foot of the statue but the southern foot of a tree nearby just east of the statue on Lincoln Ave.
The 92/200 Stairs is definitively Lake Park.  The compass is the Northpoint Water Tower along highway 32 S which takes you on a path to the (Edit: I got the wrong museum, Charles Allis Art Museum it is not) Cyril Colnik at the Villa Terrace Decorative Arts Museum where you see the fine crafted flower.  The symbolism with the juggling woman is that we are having to find our direction by juggling verse and image, not to mention the key (smithing), cane (carving), and millstone (wind and water) which are clues to find links to that subject matter interpretively rather than visually.  Next, depending on which street combo you take you might find either the Juneau statue (hands and wrinkled fabric at left elbow match image) or you’ll find that the corner of E. State and N. Water is where you find the right angle on the cityhall building in the background where perspective on both spires have the same height. (Note: I was very wrong on my math approach to find Zeidler Union Square…forget that one).  You might observe the Pabst Theater doorway matching the woman’s collar and you might cross to the west side to get a closer look at the Mitchell mansion or the Braille library which I believe links some verse about the harpsichord (but may well be the music center on the corner where you get the view of cityhall).  Here it gets tricky, I believe you have to resume the trail going East down W.Wisconsin (beating of the world) back to 2nd street, cross the Plankinton lift bridge and continue south till you pass the old clock tower (distance in time) and that puts you at Greenfield where you head west (step onto nature) since east just goes into the river and boat yards.  Here you head west until you find a post office (letter from the country) which is just left on 11th and W. Greenfield.  This puts you south for quite a ways until you intersect with diagonally headed Windlake Ave (wind).  This is where you cut southeast 100 paces and that puts you at the NW corner of Koscuiszko Park.  Continue South and you’ll come to your first birch about halfway, continue southbound, staying on the west side (staying west) of the park until you get to Lincoln Ave (cast in copper).  I’m not sure what “pass three” refers to, but there are 3 lamp post that could be considered passed as you approach the Koscuiszko statue.  This has enough continuity to be a possible location.  Lake Park seems like it’s just the beginning of the journey across town.
Swap in the Villa Terrace Decorative Arts Museum for the Charles Allis Museum, they’re not far from each other.

Okay.  My excerpt seems to have missed the cutoff.
My college poetry teacher in 1993 was a student of Hass.  I was just digging through my garage to discover I have two of Hass’ books, one from 89 and one from 96.  I have to retract my comment on his work being available before publication.  Poetry is tricky.  You get use to seeing material in magazines or at lectures and then you see a compilation which includes that work at a later date.
Still, how can you be so sure Preiss didn’t make any last minute changes?

Why would he need to?

I dunno.
It was the hat that got my attention.  Ever since I looked at the ‘capeline’ wikipedia entry about a kind of helmet/cap called a “secrete” and since noticing how the giant in image 5 has a big hat, I’ve been thinking about the Lincoln connection.  Lincoln had an iconic hat called a ‘stovepipe’.  So I got caught up with wondering if the shako was meant to be.  Once again, uncertainty outweigh certainty.

Anyhow, my main interest in the poem was the use of the term ‘shako’.  The date of publication may have been important, but even if its disregarded, the Rilke poem itself carries my point.  The shako is much like a stovepipe hat in terms of it’s high lift.  It’s precursor was known as the Casquette d’Afrique.  I’ve been considering the Kosciuszko theory rather strongly and I saw a picture of him in uniform wearing a casquette.
Kosciuszko is a superb candidate for a “proud tall fifth”.  The thought process in translating that line is about considering the proportionality of a 1/5th in terms of a full 5-star rank general.  A brigadier general is a 1-star rank.  Kosciuszko is a fifth.  On a horse he is tall.  As a hero, he is proud.
This whole casque vs cask word play has to have more of a purpose, don’t you think so?

I phoned the Montessori School in Milwaukee today to speak with the engineer about the history of the wall and fence around the southwest corner of their sports field.  Would be good to know if the 100 paces southeast over rock and soil could apply to this section.  100 paces fits.  Getting to that point and leaving that point fits.  It just seems too likely at this point that there was some means to shortcut through this section.  Perhaps along the outside of the wall and the corner houses adjacent.  I can see that might be an easement of sorts.  The home owners probably don’t like it, but people may have cut through regularly.  Looks like a new shed was placed to block on the south side.

The Collector Theory
The juggler is collecting objects: a couple red balls are standard for juggling, but a key, a walking stick, a millstone, a flower, and a jewel?
Cast in copper = the subject of coins (specifically the penny)
You’ll see a letter = the subject of stamps
The phenomenally valueable US penny known to collectors as the “Birch” from 1792 is a key part of this puzzle. The coin has Lady Liberty on one side and a wreath of laurel leaves on the other.
I believe the reason for the Laureate sculpture’s appearance in image 10 relates to finding a “laurel” type feature. Laurels are common to the purpose of military recognition in the form of metals and insignias. We could be looking for someone who has collected medals or ranks for their achievements.
Ive been thinking about the term “ivy league” as it might relate to pride/prestigious and education for the common usage for the word laureate. I think it would be an elagant choice to utilize the distance a peson walks in one hour, a League or about 3 miles, as a way to locate the general area of the treasure ground from the Laureate sculpture.

No return call.  It looks like it might have been an easy shortcut and it matches the pace count quite well.  Would just be better to know if there was a fence access or no fence at all on the northwest corner.

Another thing we know is the South ravine (and possibly the north) was re-done sometime between 1984 and now. We are currently searching for more photo’s of this area from the 80’s. The ravine’s used to extend a lot further east than they do now by way of a dirt incline. Now the south ravine has steps where the incline used to be.
Also the large circular stone by the Ravine Rd. bridge that some compare to the millstone was in fact there since before 1980. I don’t know if this is supposed to be represented by the millstone in the rebus or not, but it was there in 1980.

What are everyone’s guesses to the literary reference to this city… Maybe an explanation can be found for the Wonderstone’s hearth line. I’ve stood on the treasure grounds many many times and the only letters, ACTUAL letters you would have been able to see in 1980 would have been in the middle of the lake…so maybe there is something else to the clue, something everyone is missing. I’ve imagined letters on trees in many shapes and forms, but there is nothing that one can say for certain that is undeniably a “letter” on a “tree,” there is something missing, it’s some kind of simple riddle either tied to a lit reference or something simple we overlooked.

decibalnyc

What are everyone’s guesses to the literary reference to this city… Maybe an explanation can be found for the Wonderstone’s hearth line. I’ve stood on the treasure grounds many many times and the only letters, ACTUAL letters you would have been able to see in 1980 would have been in the middle of the lake…so maybe there is something else to the clue, something everyone is missing. I’ve imagined letters on trees in many shapes and forms, but there is nothing that one can say for certain that is undeniably a “letter” on a “tree,” there is something missing, it’s some kind of simple riddle either tied to a lit reference or something simple we overlooked.

Is there a letter in the image?

There are 2 J’s and a P

I think were forced to consider multiple options.
“G” is a definite favorite. (Not mine)
I like the use of the word “hearth”. Thats where you find a stack of kindling, an assortment of tools, poker, tongs, scoop, minibroom. Its the place where you start a fire and keep it burning for warmth and comfort. Maybe a good rebellion or revolution metaphor. Maybe the German history of the Reichstag figures into it. I like how the word “heart” might be implicated as it connects well with the use of the word “beating” in the earlier line.

erexere

I think were forced to consider multiple options.
“G” is a definite favorite. (Not mine)
I like the use of the word “hearth”. Thats where you find a stack of kindling, an assortment of tools, poker, tongs, scoop, minibroom. Its the place where you start a fire and keep it burning for warmth and comfort. Maybe a good rebellion or revolution metaphor. Maybe the German history of the Reichstag figures into it. I like how the word “heart” might be implicated as it connects well with the use of the word “beating” in the earlier line.

Leder… country… heart…

Metal, Girl Scout Trail, disc-shaped signs were nailed to several trees along the hiking trail for many years…but they were removed by park employees wherever possible without damaging the trees. (Some signs had become embedded into some trees and were left.)
AP

I think 421 was asking about letters on the image. I only see Palencars initials, and the O of the millstone, but that’s a reach IMO.

Girlscouts has a nice implication. I remember the campfire symbol was pretty common. The letter G and the campfire and the country…
Wells street interests me most as a solve for line 2. In looking for supporting reasons to fill the gap of why Wells street plays a role in the puzzle as a whole, the idea that it connects to the founding of the early bank company Wells Fargo, I like this as it also fits the Wells Fargo letter and parcel delivery service.

Len,
The Juneau Statue was my first theory. The 5th you’re looking for is that he was a Leo…the 5th sign of the zodiac.
I like the way you think on this. IMO this is a theory that is worth consideration and I will think on this. 2 things that comes to mind in this area of the city for the woman with harpsichord line are the PAC which is right across the street from city hall, and I also believe there is a statue in Cathedral Square Park of a woman holding a harpsichord, and that park is not too far from Juneau.
If you feel the casque is in Juneau Park, I can give you some specifics where it isn’t as I’ve probed that area a bit. Also there is a statue of Leif Ericson in Juneau Park…it’s in a more secluded location. If this theory holds up, it could prove to show a pattern with Statues and these riddles, same as NOLA and Chi and Cleveland.
One thing to consider, as Siskel pointed out…the verse should take you right to the casque. Let me put some of these theories to the test, as I am only minutes from all of these locations right now. Keep in mind I am a big proponent of the Lake Park solution but I have the same reservations as you do…a lack of visual evidence. This is a good theory. Let’s put it to the test!

Hi all,
Relative newcomer here, but I’ve tried to do my homework before posting – including reading the entire threads for the Milwaukee image and verse, and countless hours poring over maps, websites, etc. No full theory yet, but I do have some thoughts on the existing theories, and some partial-theory ideas of my own. Warning – it’s a long post.
First, as plausible as the Lake Park theory sounds, I don’t think it’s as certain as most of you do. I know that’s kind of heretical around here. But a big part of my skepticism is because there’s pretty much nothing in the image that pictorially matches Lake Park (other than a golf motif suggesting the golf course, and some pretty sketchy tree ideas). The theory is almost *all* about the verse, and the verse is so cryptic that it could be used to “confirm” a variety of theories. Let me come back to the lack of image references. But even in the verse, nothing is a true slam dunk for Lake Park.
– Yes, 92 steps seems plausible for grand Staircase, especially since the next line includes the word grand
– Yes, I see why Cast in Copper could reference LMD
– And yes, the North Point lighthouse is a reasonable explanation for the “compass”
But I still have problems with even these. First, there are so few places in flat Milwaukee that could possible have 92 stairs. The grand staircase is almost the only place you could consider – if you truly needed to ascend 92 stairs. And to me, that makes it too obvious. I don’t like the idea that one could jump into the middle of the verse without having to decipher *any* other clues (other than the ones that identify Milwaukee in the first place – rebus and City Hall pictures). It’s too easy for a local to say “I know – the Grand Staircase! Let me skip the whole first part of the verse, and ignore the image too.” That’s not how any of these puzzles work. I don’t like the Plankington Arcade idea, because it’s clearly not ascending. But I like the “kind” of idea that it is: not too obscure, but not too obvious either.
Knowing that Milwaukee is not rife with long staircases, my first thought was to look for a staircase that was built in 1892 (or 1792, I guess). That kind of clue would make sense for BP to use. You’d know it was right only when you saw it (e.g. a cornerstone with a date). No, I don’t have any 1892 stairs in mind, but I wouldn’t be surprised if someone finds some. My point is that if we weren’t all hung up on “92 has to be the Grand Staircase”, then you’d probably never think Step on Nature *must* be “Oak Leaf Trail”. And you’d never think “Pass the Compass” *must* be the lighthouse.
Also, “After climbing the Grand 200” seems a weak match for the grand staircase. For one thing, why is that line necessary (you’ve already been told to ascend the steps – why say it a second time)? And for another, that would be really odd wording – if the grand 200 meant the two C’s that are at the landing, you’re not really climbing *them*. If the verse said something like “After you *pass* the grand 200” that would be more plausible, as it could mean start ascending the 92 steps, but once you pass the double C (partway up) then *leave* the staircase to look for the next clue. But that’s not what it says. (If you think the double C refers to the curving, ascending upper parts of the grand staircase, I think that’s even less likely as they only even resemble C’s from an aerial view, and you’re only going to climb one of them anyway.)
Anyway, basically, what I see in the existing Lake Park theory is “The Grand Staircase must be it,” followed by a whole bunch of (reasonable, but flawed) confirmation bias.
Now let’s get back to the image. The group has identified two possible starting points for this verse – Mitchell Hall, and the Wisconsin Club (formerly Mitchell Mansion). Both reasonable 3-story buildings, etc. But one of them has an exact visual match, and the other has nothing of the sort!
Atomicleprechaun posted this link a while ago:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 5709486983
That’s not just a “if you squint, it almost maybe matches” kind of a thing. It’s a “Eureka! I guess any theory that starts at Mitchell Hall must be regarded as wrong,” kind of a thing. I’m not sure why Atomic’s find hasn’t made everyone shift their energy in this direction!
Similarly, look at all the other visual clues that have been identified by others in the image thread:
– The Juggler resembling the bronze on the Juneau statue:
http://www.december.com/places/mke/album/photojpk4.html
– The hair matching the Laureate at the Performance Arts Center:
The
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laureate_(Lipton
)
– The obvious City Hall.
Those are all close to the city center, and pretty much on a straight line path from the Wisconsin Club. What does that mean? I don’t know. But what I do know, is that the most definite visual clues are all relatively near each other, and not at all near Lake Park. And that while it’s certainly possible to walk to Lake Park from this area, I can’t imagine that’s the walk BP wanted us to take.
OK, so enough of the critique of the Lake Park theory. So where do I think we *should* look? See next post.
-Len

I am downtown today, it’s quite rainy…so I’m not going to walk the mile up the road to the pabst mansion, but I can tell you this…as I stepped outside my building on Milwaukee and Wells, I noticed the same logo on the parking structure across the street.
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.0411857 … e0!6m1!1e1
This logo is also visible on the door of the Pabst theater from Wells st. only. So I think you might be on to something. We will have to see if this parking structure was around in the 1980’s.
I will try to get up to city hall and take a photo through that window.

Hi,
In my last post, I described why I think we should be looking elsewhere besides Lake Park. Where? I don’t know. But I do have some partial ideas I wanted to share.
First, again, I think we need to start at the Wisconsin Club – a 3-story building, formerly the Mitchell Mansion, lived in by Mitchell, his wife, and one son (three people) and, most important, visually confirmed by this image:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scallywag … 5709486983
Interestingly, to see this View (as in View the three stories…), you need to be on W. Wells St. (back of the building). And as others suggested “Wells” certainly evokes a thought of time and space (Time Machine), and also of the War of the Worlds (beating of the world)? I don’t think those are the *only* meanings intended by BP for those lines. But I think it helps get you onto Wells and gets you oriented. Perhaps “walk the beating of the world” means walk on Wells. Which way? “A distance in time” and references to “three” suggest East. That’s not a slam dunk, but makes sense in that all of the famous landmarks of Milwaukee are East, including the visual references in the image (City Hall, Laureate, Juneau Statue) are in that direction.
But how far do I go? Here’s where I’m clearly speculating based on several “loose” clues that seem to all point in the same direction. But I think it’s plausible:
I think you’re supposed to climb the stairs in City Hall! Why? Obviously you can’t dig up there, and have to come down again. But my theory is that you need to climb City Hall in order to see the next clue! Here’s why I think this makes sense:
1) City Hall is in the image.
2) More important, the *entrance* to City Hall is in the image!
https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5096/5452 … 003b_z.jpg
3) City Hall’s address is *200* East Wells, and it certainly is “grand” – tallest habitable building in the US at one point!
4) Atomicleprechaun said in July (quoting someone else) that after 92 stairs in City Hall, you get to a landing with a window that looks west (i.e. allows you to *View* the three stories of Mitchell). If we can confirm or deny that, that would be a big test for this theory.
5) View is a term often implying that you “have a view”, i.e. from a mountain or top of a building.
6) Walk the beating of the world? View at a distance *in time*? You’re literally inside of a beating clock tower.
7) A distance in space? You’re suspended in space, high above the city.
8. Cast in copper? Although this might *also* be a Lincoln reference, it is undoubtedly a reference to the Solomon Juneau bell at the top of City Hall. This article is really interesting – describes how the bell was one of the largest, heaviest copper bells ever cast, and it was a huge source of pride for the city.
http://books.google.com/books?id=CYMoAQ … er&f=false
In short, my theory is that the whole first half of the verse, as well as most of the image, is designed to get you up to the window of City Hall, facing west (in the direction of Viewing the Wisconsin Club).
Again, I think the the most important thing we can do to test this theory is count the steps to get to a landing/window. We should also see if there is anything either on the floor by the window, or on the ground outside the building that could be meant by “Step on Nature” or “Cast in Copper” or “Step on Nature Cast In Copper” (like a picture of a tree embossed into a copper seal on the sidewalk, for example).
BTW, I have no ideas about From Woman, With Harpsichord – perhaps there was something in the lobby once, or outside so that “at a distance in space” could mean above it.
OK, so we’re up there? What are we looking for? Here’s where my theory peters out a bit. However, I do have one idea:
Check out the raised concrete platform on the waterfront at the center of this page:
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Milwa … c19c92c636
Doesn’t it kind of resemble the millstone? A grey circle with a square in the center – roughly in the right proportion. It’s right across the river – to the west of City Hall, and would probably be visible from the window in a similar perspective as the image.
Here’s a ground-level view (with clock tower in the backgrond, no less):
http://www.bethsahagian.com/images/Beth … Grylli.jpg
That tile looks fairly new, but is it? Was there something similar there in 1982? I have no idea. Could be a red herring, or could be important. Wonder how we can find out.
Although I think this idea is suspect, here’s one thing I like about it: It puts you in one of the *very* few places in Milwaukee where you can actually walk 100 paces (200 steps) southeast without walking through a building. Almost no streets run southeast/northwest except right here. And few city parks are large enough to allow 200 steps. And 100 paces is so long, it’s difficult to be precise in direction unless a terrain feature like a river or road is keeping you aligned. And here, staying west would have a clear meaning, as in “stay on the west bank of the river”.
Does the Riverwalk go “*over* rock and soil”? Did it, before the 1990s Riverwalk rennovations? Note that the verse doesn’t say *on* rock and soil – you could be on a raised walkway *over* it.
I don’t like the fact that this area is relatively park-free – a *major* hurdle for this part of the theory. But was there a dirt area somewhere along the west bank of the river before the Riverwalk construction?
Could “pass the compass” mean pass Mason St. (compass being the Freemason logo)?
Lots of questions here, but wanted to throw the idea out there for comments.
Finally, I have some thoughts on the *end* of the verse, that I haven’t been able to bridge into this theory about the beginning. My next post will be about the end of the verse.
-Len

Interestingly enough the bell tower in city hall is 353 feet and there are two 3’s and one 5 mentioned in the verse…LOL

Three threes.

Something else to look at…if you take the riverwalk from wells to Mason St you would be walking southeast below the bridge. You would arrive at that circular dock at the end of Mason st. that could represent the millstone. If you take Mason St all the way down towards the lake, you hit Juneau Park, almost at the statue. Still checking on the verse match up and I am going to walk to city hall and try to snap a picture now.

erexere

Three threes.

You’re right, it was only a funny coincidence.

My last two posts described my discomfort with the Lake Park theories, and a partial alternative theory that requires climbing the stairs of the City Hall tower, and Viewing the Mitchell Mansion at a distance. This post contains my thoughts about the end-game (with no real solution proposed):
1) Foot of the culvert such an odd phrase. A culvert is a very specific word. And why do you have to get into a precise position (at its foot, whatever that means) at such an early point in the verse? I’m not sure I’d be confident I was in the right spot unless I saw a carving of a foot or something, next to a drain pipe. The word foot has to mean something…
2) I really don’t think the treasure is at the foot of a tree, for all the reasons others have pointed out – difficult to dig, dangerous for the tree, and transience of an individual tree (BP’s fears of the hunt lasting only a month notwithstanding). Besides, I think fifth probably doesn’t literally mean the fifth tree. It’s too literal. I don’t buy Exere’s 1/5 star general (because no other clues point to Kos. Park). But I think something *like* that idea makes sense. I.e. a statue of someone who’s the fifth one of something (I’ll come back to this).
3) When is a birch not a birch? This *could* be literally a tree, of course. But I have a different idea: A birch is a pioneer species with white skin. Sound like anyone we know? Someone whose statue has a bronze image that looks like the juggler’s pose? Someone who the bell was named after? Solomon Juneau was a pioneer, often described as the first white settler of Milwaukee. He was also the first mayor of Milwaukee. I think that somehow, Juneau might be our first young birch! But I can’t figure out how. You can’t really walk 100 paces southeast from somewhere that makes sense from the clues, and get to the Juneau statue in Juneau Park. And *from* that statue, I’m not sure what “pass three, staying west would mean”. But maybe I’m missing something. Or maybe there’s another plaque or small statue of Juneau somewhere along the Riverwalk.
4) When I went down this mental path, my first thought was: If Juneau was the first mayor, then we should be looking for the 5th (especially if the 5th mayor was tall and/or proud). The 5th mayor was George H. Walker – one of the 3 founders of Milwaukee. But I can’t seem to find a statue or marker that could be what we’re looking for. It’s too bad, because *Walk*er would fit so well with the verse’s multiple references to “walk” and “foot”, and with the image’s use of a *walk*ing stick. I really want the solution to somehow be at George Walker’s foot. It would be such an elegant solution. But can’t find a place where that would make sense. Was there once a statue somewhere? Any other Walker-related signs in Juneau Park or near the Riverwalk?
5) An alternative to Juneau being the first young birch, is Charles Milwaukee Sivyer – the first white child born in Milwaukee. After all, it’s the first *young* birch. The birthplace is actually pretty close to the Riverfront and City Hall at N. Water and E. Mason Streets. And more or less Southeast. But where do you go from there? There are no parks close by. Or culverts. Again, just an idea to follow up on or discard.
-Len

Len, I like how you treat the material and offer some insightful considerations.
With respect to endgame thoughts, do you you think the last line of the verse “the treasure waits” could be a hint about “waiting” like person serving a table at a restaurant or fancy mansion? It might also play on the line about a “fifth”, since that could be something like a common bottle size for alcohol. For example, Jeeves pours you a bourbon from a fifth. This seems vague and even rabbit-hole-ish, but I want to consider the implication of a “glass”, something which can be filled by a waiter, or alternatively something made from or including a lens, like a spyglass or telescope, or a pair of spectacles. Some scenic viewpoints offer coin operated observation equipment. I recall using one at the Empire State Building. Maybe there was something like this somewhere in 1982 Milwaukee. What if the majority of the clues of this hunt involve following a long distance viewer as it moves across the city from the Wisconsin Club to (or from) City Hall and on to some culvert and then to the treasure spot?

OK…
Here is what I found…
Link to photo’s
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/k1bvvlv6nykf … 0Fuda?dl=0
First off there is a big circular stone right in front of the door to city hall.
If you ascend 92 steps at city hall, it leaves you facing west, but not on a landing…you are in the middle of the staircase. You are however facing a window that gives you a nice view of the giant harp on top of the Pabst theater which also has the neck logo on the door.. Here is a better view of the harp and if you pan down you will see the logo on the door.
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.0409185 … rtz3DQ!2e0
This may be the answer to our Harpsichord line…there is also a second harp on the building itself, and the Pabst is connected to the Milwaukee Rep theater.
As you walk down Wells st. you see the same pattern from the back of the Pabst Mansion on the BMO bank building which used to be a Marshal and Isley bank, and in the 80’s I believe it was called the Marine Bank.
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.0410713 … ejnWyg!2e0
Walk another 2 blocks down wells and there is the parking structure which has a date stamp of 1966 on the corner of it, same pattern…
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.0411778 … vDhOog!2e0
Now we have the problem of the Compass, and the Bridge. Like I stated you can access “under the bridge” on the riverwalk, but this would be taking you away from the 2 visual confirmations further down Wells st. and you would go West from city hall and take the riverwalk to Mason st.
If we can find a “Compass” somewhere along Milwaukee St. south (where the logo on the parking structure turns and starts to run N/S sending you south on Milwaukee) this path may lead us to the next thing…but all of this feels better than lake park because of the visual clues and I like the harp on the Pabst theater.

My only thoughts for “Step on Nature Cast in Copper” is the PAC which has a fountain in front of the concert pavillion which is a park-ish area kiddy corner to the north end of City Hall. The dark structure to the left of city hall on the image could represent the fountain at the Marcus Center for the Performing Arts.

Also the Arrow on the forehead could be a visual for Red Arrow Park…but I think JJP may have made the arrow red if that was the case.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c … waukee.jpg
If you look across the st. from red arrow park you will see the fountain at the PAC
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.0426863 … !5s2011-10

I found something in the image….if you turn this image of the neck a certain way, it looks like a building….
https://www.dropbox.com/s/5qg3n8ycyqv0xgj/neck.png?dl=0
Keep your eyes out for this building or tower of a building with an arch in the middle at the bottom.

Here is the building in the neck, it’s right across from Cathedrial Square Park off of Wells and Jackson St
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.0415073 … qvc2ew!2e0

My building is less than a block from Cathedral Square Park…I am going to take a walk over there right now.

decibalnyc

Len,
The Juneau Statue was my first theory. The 5th you’re looking for is that he was a Leo…the 5th sign of the zodiac.

decibalnyc

2 things that comes to mind in this area of the city for the woman with harpsichord line are the PAC which is right across the street from city hall, and I also believe there is a statue in Cathedral Square Park of a woman holding a harpsichord, and that park is not too far from Juneau.

decibalnyc

If you feel the casque is in Juneau Park, I can give you some specifics where it isn’t as I’ve probed that area a bit. Also there is a statue of Leif Ericson in Juneau Park…it’s in a more secluded location. If this theory holds up, it could prove to show a pattern with Statues and these riddles, same as NOLA and Chi and Cleveland.

decibalnyc

One thing to consider, as Siskel pointed out…the verse should take you right to the casque. Let me put some of these theories to the test, as I am only minutes from all of these locations right now. Keep in mind I am a big proponent of the Lake Park solution but I have the same reservations as you do…a lack of visual evidence. This is a good theory. Let’s put it to the test!

Yeah, I saw that. I think that’s possible (esp. since proud=pride=lion=Leo). But if Juneau is the fifth, then what’s the first? An actual birch? Possible. But either way, I have a hard time getting to the Juneau statue by walking southeast. Following Wells to the park puts you south of the statue, not northwest.
From the thread, it seems that the sculpture is this one:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigrant_ … (sculpture
), which is not harpsichord-related. I think if there were a harpsichord statue anywhere in Milwaukee, someone on this board would have found it by now.
The only clue I found was this:
http://www.pabstmansion.com/history/his … llery.aspx
See the picture on the bottom-right of the gallery on that page. A painting called the Interrupted Lesson, showing a woman who is passing out(?) while playing a harpsichord (i.e. silently?) The painting was part of the Pabst collection, and was on display at one point at the Empire Cafe on Grand Ave. But I left that out of my theory, because it felt like false confirmation to me. It’s not on Wells. And seems too obscure to be relevant.
Yup, possible. I considered an Ericson connection, but it didn’t seem to fit. But who knows…
Cool! Like I said, I think testing the City Hall view part of the theory would be great, because I think it’s really plausible. But the rest (the millstone, for example) is much more speculative. Also, there’s been so much construction in the 90s on the Riverwalk that landmarks and/or casque sites could easily be gone.

OK more info….
In Cathedral Square Park we have a statue dedicated to immigrant mothers, notice the shawl and the shape it makes on the left side, compared to the image…very similar.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/hh4pk8fte7fo9 … 1.jpg?dl=0
Also there is a stage setup in the park…it’s been setup for over 10 years for “Jazz in the park” UNDERNEATH THE STAGE…is a round fountain with a square in the middle just like the Millstone
https://www.dropbox.com/s/3ikw9gb5s2i3x … n.jpg?dl=0
Then we go to St. Johns, the image of the tower in the neck…notice the 2 eagles on the building…could be a match for the eagle in the lower left corner of the image.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/99x8vvf0vjg2y … s.jpg?dl=0
Also there is a relief near the Eagle which would be facing the correct way on the image of a man holding a key that looks similar to the key in the image. This photo is hard to see, the second link is a google image of it, it’s on the right.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/wul0gdagmze15 … 2.jpg?dl=0
https://www.google.com/maps/place/The+C … cf2c985d0b
Well what are your thoughts on all of this so far?

As far as following the verse…this is where I am stumped, and where I never could put any certainty on a downtown location.
If we assume the 92 steps and the Grand 200 are referring to City Hall…we must then find a “compass” to pass and a foot of a culvert to reach, AND a bridge! Maybe it’s a red herring, but I am somewhat convinced the neck image represents St. Johns Cathedral. The problem is, so far, there is nothing that matches the verse enough for me to agree with it. The only bridges you can access the underneath of would be the freeway spurs, and the riverwalk…but even on the riverwalk you don’t actually walk under the bridges.
The Lincoln Memorial Bridge at the end of Mason St. is accessible underneath, but walking 100 paces southeast from there put’s you in the new Caltrava art museum.
So here we have just the opposite of Lake Park where the verse will take you to an exact spot with no visual confirmations. Downtown we have a ton of visual confirmations, but the verse doesn’t quite match up to the visual clues.

The question has arisen about whether or not the Oak Leaf Trail existed by that name
to fulfill the part of the verse that says “step on nature”. It is not necessary for it to
have had any sign for it to make sense.
Verse 8 says:
View the three stories of Mitchell
As you walk the beating of the world
You can view Mitchell Hall as you
walk along the south side of Kenwood Blvd
At a distance in time
From three who lived there
At a distance in space
From woman, with harpsichord
Silently playing
You pass the three streets named for famous
people who lived in Milwaukee, and also
Marietta St. ( representing the silent
harpsichord playing woman)
Step on nature
Cast in copper
So you reach Lake Dr…the boundary
of Lake Park. Instead of walking South or North on Lake Dr.,
you ENTER THE PARK by crossing Lake Dr and walking
on Park property so you are “stepping on nature”.
This is where Kenwood Blvd becomes
Lincoln Memorial Drive…”cast in copper”
I won’t finish the verse, but you can see that the
rest of the trek is not far…

I also concur that Step on nature, doesn’t have to be the Oak Leaf Trail…it simply means (probably) step on or cross some grass or as AP says, enter the park. The fact that it wasn’t the Oak Leaf Trail, doesn’t mean anything…it’s still Nature.

Euhirudinea

The picture that you posted of the Grand Staircase is pretty dated. The pictures of the Grand Staircase that Animal Painter posted on page 68 are more representative of what Preiss would have seen in 1981, and that staircase has exactly 92 risers. And if we count the one covered by the brick walkway, the staircase still has exactly 92 steps today. It’s a verifiable fact that no one who is on this forum and is in Milwaukee questions, even a little bit. Doesn’t make it right, but it puts a significant burden of proof on any better theory for this line.

Euhirudinea

On the other hand, we have a hand, or two. But the left hands don’t match at all, and there are enough differences in the right hands (recognizing that there are only so many ways that you can draw an open-palmed hand) that if Palencar was supposed to replicate the treasure ground confirmer exactly, then he missed by more than a little bit here IMO, and for no good reason that I can see. It doesn’t have the same precision that the rendering of City Hall does, which as you suggest, could just be a city confirmer and doesn’t need to be as exact as it is, and yet, Palencar got this almost exactly right. The Laureate is a reasonable match (again, not picture perfect, but close) but that’s on Kilbourn, not on Wells. As for the collar, that’s pretty exact, but the Mitchell Mansion isn’t the only place in Milwaukee where you could find this type of cinder block, is it? Is it possible that this ubiquitous building material was also found on some building between Mitchell Hall and the park, or even Mitchell Hall itself back in the day? So given a choice, I’d have to say that I’m not as convinced as you seem to be that these are clear-cut image matches that need to be reconciled.

Renovator, I think you are misinterpreting Animal Painter’s post on page 68. His post was meant to put to rest the question of whether the first group of steps that everyone is counting as part of the GS consists of two or three steps. He confirmed that it was 3, so therefore the total number of steps from that point on is 92, not 91. Great. No objection. But the fact remains that there is (and was in 1981) a small flight of steps *between* LMD and Animal Painter’s “step 1” of 92. Like everyone else, he was ignoring that set, and calling them “not part of the GS”, because there is a flat landing that looks to be about 20-30 feet long between that first set and his step 1. You can clearly see in Animal Painter’s photos too that the initial set was there back then (you can’t tell how *many* steps are in that set from the photo, but you can definitely see that that initial set was there, and had a railing). That first set *now* has 4 steps, but it stands to reason it would have had 3 back then before the layer of brick was laid over the walkway between that set and Animal Painter’s step 1. In other words, it used to be 3, then 3, then 89 more. And now it’s 4, then 2, then 89 more. Either way, it’s 95 from LMD to the top, and I don’t think Animal Painter (or anyone else who’s been there) disagrees with this. The only disagreement is whether that initial set should be considered part of the GS or not.
What I am saying is that whether you call that first set “part of the GS”, or just call them “steps leading to the start of the GS”, those steps are being skipped in Animal Painter’s count (and everyone else’s) because someone on this board decided long ago that those steps are not “part of the GS”, and guessed (incorrectly according to Animal Painter’s pix) that that lower set may not have been there in 1981. Yet the fact remains that they stand (and stood then) between LMD and the top of the GS. I think it’s very unlikely that BP would have said “ascend the 92 steps” when you’re standing on LMD, with the assumption that you’re going to skip over the 3-4 steps right in front of you before you start your count. Since the entire theory is based on the idea that there are 92 steps between LMD and the top, this seems like a pretty big inconsistency to ignore.
As far as the golf tee markers being the visual confirmer, thanks for the clarification. I agree that’s certainly possible, esp. with the putter also in the image (although a round, red ball is such a simple shape that it’s hard to know for sure). The nearest tee box appears to be about 350 feet from the top of the GS, not 50, (and not visible from the top of the GS, due to the building) when you have to make your decision about what direction to go at the top of the GS. But like you said, if you can see the lighthouse “compass”, and follow that interpretation of the verse, your point is that the balls are just a confirmer, not a signpost you need to have seen to decide.
OK, I understand your perspective now. I do agree that the collar pattern is common and appears lots of places. (Although no one has found a match so far that’s in Lake Park, or anywhere outside of the downtown area). I also agree that the Laureate is not a perfect match (to me it’s about 80% likelihood, not 100%). But as for the Juneau statue, it’s not just the open hand. It’s the position of the hand *and* the posture of the person looking to the right *and* the background texture (which is really not very generic). I really do put that match at close to 100%. As to why not make the open hand match perfectly, I think it was to hide another clue in the palm (the image that people think is a bell or a hoof). JJP needed to alter the hand position slightly to have it both resemble the Juneau statue *and* hide the desired shape in the palm.
I still think that whether or not the “City Hall tower is the 92 stairs” part of the theory is correct, the casque is more likely to have been buried somewhere closer to downtown than up in Lake Park.

Euhirudinea

But it can refer to Lake Park itself, especially if this sign, or something similar was in place in 1981 (
http://tinyurl.com/qjtyd2x
). It’s near the corner of East Kenwood and LMD, right where the verse tells us to “step on nature”. There is some uncertainty as to whether we were supposed to walk along the paths in the park to East Ravine Road, or follow LMD all the way around, but either way, you eventually end up at the base of the staircase. Unless…
Now this I like. Perhaps if we reverse these two lines so that we are instructed to “ascend the 92 steps”
after
“climbing the grand 200”, it could support the theory that we are supposed to follow the Bicentennial Trail through the park and end up on East Ravine Drive, just north of the staircase. Guess what else is there, just as you come out of the woods? Here’s a hint, courtesy of 421 (
http://tinyurl.com/q7lxz8a
). Look familiar?

Good stuff!
I think you are to follow Kenwood to Lincoln Memorial until you hit the park area. That’s where you would get on the Riverfront trail (is there only one path to follow on the Riverfront trail? I’m still looking for the trail layout…) and then climb the 92 stairs. It’s all there, it all lines up. It’s just piecing together old images of the trees there at the roadside. You guys have got this!
The Milwaukee ’76 Trail
http://www.trails.com/tcatalog_trail.as … BGM049-039

News flash: It seems that “Step on Nature” cannot possibly refer to Oak Leaf Trail! According to the link below, the city-wide network of bike trails was called “’76 Bike Tour” or “Milwaukee 76 Bike Trail” from 1976-1996! Before 1976 it was called something like the Milwaukee 64 trail, as it was 64 miles long. It was renamed to the “76 Bike Tour” in honor of the 1976 bicentennial. And apparently, it wasn’t renamed to Oak Leaf Trail until 20 years later.
http://www.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/29432339.html
That gets me to thinking…one of my earlier theories was that “the grand 200” might have somehow referred to the bicentennial, which was a grand celebration that was still fresh in everyone’s minds in 1981. I spent some time last month searching for things like bicentennial park, or bicentennial road, etc., with no success (other than a park that’s not anywhere near anything that seemed relevant). But now knowing that Oak Leaf Trail (which goes right by both Lake Park *and* Juneau Park) used to be called ’76 Trail, I wonder whether the idea that *it* could be the Grand 200 could have any merit. Is there a part of the trail that one might climb?

Unknown

Unknown:
Since the entire theory is based on the idea that there are 92 steps between LMD and the top, this seems like a pretty big inconsistency to ignore.

Unknown

Unknown:
As far as the golf tee markers being the visual confirmer, thanks for the clarification. I agree that’s certainly possible, esp. with the putter also in the image (although a round, red ball is such a simple shape that it’s hard to know for sure). The nearest tee box appears to be about 350 feet from the top of the GS, not 50, (and not visible from the top of the GS, due to the building) when you have to make your decision about what direction to go at the top of the GS. But like you said, if you can see the lighthouse “compass”, and follow that interpretation of the verse, your point is that the balls are just a confirmer, not a signpost you need to have seen to decide.

Unknown

Unknown:
JJP needed to alter the hand position slightly to have it both resemble the Juneau statue *and* hide the desired shape in the palm.

Unknown

Unknown:
I still think that whether or not the “City Hall tower is the 92 stairs” part of the theory is correct, the casque is more likely to have been buried somewhere closer to downtown than up in Lake Park.

Not exactly, that’s just your premise. What I believe is the “staircase”, which is clearly defined and exists today exactly as it was designed and built by Olmstead, consists of exactly 92 steps. IOW, “the 92 steps” is a synonym for “the Grand Staircase”, and not a literal interpretation of how to get from LMD to the pavilion. Also, the area between the staircase and LMD has undergone several changes over the years, as your picture, and the one’s posted by Animal Painter clearly show, which may explain why Preiss didn’t include those in his count. To me, it’s not as inconsistent as you are suggesting. But clearly you are uncomfortable with it, which is fine. Just keep in mind that this particular theory has been rehashed over and over for almost 10 years, and as near as I can tell, no one has come up with anything even remotely better.
Not just shape, but color and quantity as well. I play golf, so this one seems obvious to me. I suppose if you weren’t familiar with the conventions of the game, it might seem like more of a stretch, but a field of these would be pretty hard to ignore. And unless you went on the bridge over Ravine Road, you would see them soon enough once you got past the Pavilion, regardless of whether you went left or right.
There is an awful lot of white space in the image, so he really didn’t need to do anything of the sort. In both Chicago and Cleveland, the assumption is that what we are calling the iconic image is rendered exactly as it would have appeared in the polaroid, and that Palencar would have been instructed to render it as faithfully as possible since it was essential to the solve. To create, if you will, a final “aha” moment before putting a shovel into the ground. A tree with a letter on it would have resulted in such a moment, IMO. A statue with a tortured connection to “proud tall fifth”, not so much.
Clearly. But on this, and for now, we are going to have to agree to disagree.

I like this idea an awful lot. Thinking of grand as “something celebrated” works well for the Bicentennial.
Maybe we’re taking the word ‘climbing’ in the wrong way when thinking it has to do with our legs working up a hill or stairs. This could be something like a flag if being hoisted or raised is the same effect as having climbed. There was a special Bicentennial flag. Is there some particular place in Milwaukee where the Bicentennial flag was raised or did such an event cause some lasting impression that we’d have recognized in 1982?
The Bicentennial dollar has a prominent Liberty Bell on it. Perhaps the shape in the palm of the juggler’s hand is a hint for a coin, as such would rest in a palm, and leads us to the think bell/coin = Bicentennial dollar = 1976…?
Or perhaps the word “climbing” has to do with military rank?
http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Public_Law_94-479
In 1976, Congress passed into law that President George Washington would be posthumously awarded the rank of General of the Armies aka a 5-star General.
I wonder if the idea of ascending 92 steps is to identify a particular set of stairs and then follow that with the idea of George Washington’s achievement of rank in the Bicentennial. So, climb some stairs, consider climbing of rank, specifically that of General, and then resolve the next set of clues with a compass, a tool that may be used to find direction or distance.

Unknown

Unknown:
News flash: It seems that “Step on Nature” cannot possibly refer to Oak Leaf Trail!

Unknown

Unknown:
one of my earlier theories was that “the grand 200” might have somehow referred to the bicentennial, which was a grand celebration that was still fresh in everyone’s minds in 1981.

But it can refer to Lake Park itself, especially if this sign, or something similar was in place in 1981 (
http://tinyurl.com/qjtyd2x
). It’s near the corner of East Kenwood and LMD, right where the verse tells us to “step on nature”. There is some uncertainty as to whether we were supposed to walk along the paths in the park to East Ravine Road, or follow LMD all the way around, but either way, you eventually end up at the base of the staircase. Unless…
Now this I like. Perhaps if we reverse these two lines so that we are instructed to “ascend the 92 steps”
after
“climbing the grand 200”, it could support the theory that we are supposed to follow the Bicentennial Trail through the park and end up on East Ravine Drive, just north of the staircase. Guess what else is there, just as you come out of the woods? Here’s a hint, courtesy of 421 (
http://tinyurl.com/q7lxz8a
). Look familiar?

I don’t mean to dampen anyone’s day. but I have to chime in for a second on a few issues…
The Lake Park Friends were not formed until 1994 so that sign about nature wouldn’t be there.
http://www.lakeparkfriends.org/aboutus.shtml
I don’t think the Grand 200 refers to the Oak Leaf Trail, I think it’s City Hall at this point. New information I received yesterday (but un-verified) says there is a 92 step spiral staircase leading up to the bell tower of 200 Wells St. or City Hall. I need to check this out.
The reason for the image on Kilbourn St. might be the fact that we have to be Northwest of the treasure grounds before entering as we have to walk southeast 250 feet to get there.
Mainly I wanted to discuss this issue of the pattern on the neck. I need someone to show me how this is not significant. When you find a pattern of something from the image, ON a 3 story building built by the Mitchell family…and NOT on Mitchell Hall, or any other 3 stories of Mitchell.. HOW CAN U SAY THAT IS COINCIDENCE?
That pattern is specific to architecture I agree, but it is NOT a common pattern, and the only info I could find it that it is a swiss style grid pattern…it can be seen on this gate at Harvard.
http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2 … by-design/
I have looked ALL OVER for this pattern, in hopes I could find several examples, ruling it out as a good clue. I have only found 6 examples it in 2 areas in the city (5 in one area and a straggler to the north)…so far and here they are
1 On the back of Mitchell Mansion seen from Wells St.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/tytindkcfljt3 … k.jpg?dl=0
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.0402394 … hFWRnQ!2e0
2 On the Pabst Theater Doors on Wells St. (not an exact match, but close enough for me)
http://www.december.com/places/mke/imag … tdoors.jpg
3 Inverted on the M&I bank parking structure across the st. from city hall main entrance
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.0410713 … ejnWyg!2e0
4 The parking structure on Milwaukee and Wells
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.041159, … Hv0ikg!2e0
5 A parking structure on 7th and Highland
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.044363, … qclPMg!2e0
6. A small wall on Capitol Drive (this is the closest area to Lake Park that I found it while looking for it on and around Kenwood)
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.089219, … !5s2011-10
This is obviously a certain type of architecture, but I don’t think JJP or BP put it there by accident…why go into all that detail to show a pattern if it doesn’t mean something. I found this pattern all over downtown, I didn’t find it at Mitchell Hall or anywhere by UWM or lake park except that small little wall on Capitol Drive.
All I am saying is I feel this pattern is significant to SOMETHING, and it’s not just everywhere in the city. It’s not as common as other brickwork here, it’s a somewhat unique pattern. Maybe some of you can do some virtual searching for this pattern. It would be nice to know where it could be found in Milwaukee. It’s one of the few distinct patterns we can look for.
Also I wanted to discuss City Hall for a second. All of the images have a “prominent building” in them. For Chicago it was not disguised, right out in the open….Cleveland it was disguised. I have read some solves where the water tower is involved in the solution for Chicago, and others where it is not…maybe Robert (tenbythirteen) could comment on if that was in fact the starting point for them. City Hall would certainly be a city indicator…and since we have no solid evidence for coordinates we must assume the rebus code is what we get for a location finder. City Hall may or may not be part of the puzzle…but it’s in the image, it’s address is 200, and it supposedly has a 92 step spiral staircase to the observation deck, and then MORE stairs to the bell tower. It certainly would be considered “grand” even a midst all the grand buildings in downtown it stands out as the most ornate and it towers over downtown…like a big grey giant
I have a partial theory that takes us from 9th and wells and puts us in a park downtown…I can account for the Bridge, Culvert, Compass, 92 Steps, Grand 200, and Woman with Harpsichord. I have at least 2 unmistakable solid visual confirmations (neck pattern and Juneau Bell), and a handful of similarities which I can’t be 100% on, but they are intriguing.
I am going to keep working this theory, I hope others would join in and at least look for some things that match the image…ANYWHERE…either downtown OR by lake park. The only way to solve this is to keep exploring options till something fits.

This Pogues song pops into my head each time someone mentions ravines, Navigator – The Pogues:
http://youtu.be/Fh0F41AvO_Q

I was wondering just now what is so important about viewing the 3 stories of Mitchell. As we view it, is there some special significance other than it’s location in Milwaukee that informs us of our course towards the casque location and/or more importantly how it’s hidden?
I never really gave the Wisconsin Club more than a glance. Now as I look at it, I noticed it reminded me of the old building on my University of Oregon campus: Deady Hall. Both have Italianate style and a prominent belvedere. Again I think of the Bell and Flower used in Cleveland to describe the nearby road boundary to the general area of the casque: Belflower Rd. Perhaps the bell shape in the juggler’s palm is a clue to draw focus from a belvedere? Bel-: beautiful + -Vedere: to view. Later in the verse we see the use of ‘wonderstone’, perhaps that’s more in the theme of beauty, or looking at something for the reason that it is attractive with it’s marblelike variation and polished surface.
I wonder if the Italian aspect of the Wisconsin Club’s architecture is of some importance in detecting the final location?

If it were German Architecture, maybe…seems like the book tells us that Milwaukee is representative of Germany (no stretch there) and the verse also references it…I think if anything I would be looking for a public garden that has something to do with Germany…I wouldn’t guess it to be a Beer Garden (I know that’s what you were thinking Erexere you beer-o
)
I see a pattern here with public gardens…the area in Grant where the 1st one was found is part of the Art Institute’s public garden, Cleveland was a garden, and I believe there is strong evidence for SF to be in the Japanese gardens….maybe this is why Preiss thought it would be easy.
Talking more on this on the Methodology forum.
I went to the Mitchell Gardens (domes) yesterday and even though there are some AMAZING clues there…it doesn’t pan out as I can’t find a bridge that would work.
Right now the 92 step spiral staircase at city hall seems to be a main point of interest, but nothing else has developed, planning a trip to the observation deck to verify the stair count and see what I can see from up there that might lead me to another clue….Also City Hall is still skipping a few steps, but the staircase leading up to the observation deck has peaked my interest so to speak as it’s one of the only public places that has such stairs.
No idea as to why he would have us go up there unless the next clue was waiting there to see from the observation deck or the bell tower. When you get to the Bell Tower you would see the match for the bell in the jugglers hand, but I don’t think he would send us up there just to see that. If city hall is in fact part of the equation, then there must be something up there to see.

Ok moving on…..
You’ve found the Germainia building on 2nd and Wells, now what?
Go

decibalnyc

Ok moving on…..
You’ve found the Germainia building on 2nd and Wells, now what?
Go

I already asked that question and Four21 did an excellent job answering it with “…” and “
“. You yourself seemed to express that the answers are easy. Its strange as all hell that you and others complain about my posts as being obfuscating while yours meet the criteria of being so simple it needs no explanation. Now you’re asking the same question I asked?

“This post was made by erexere who is currently on your ignore list.”

erexere

I already asked that question and Four21 did an excellent job answering it with “…” and “
“.

erexere

Four21, where does your theory lead after your theory leads to the Germania building?

erexere

Which 92 steps are ascended?

Don’t misquote me, douche. It actually went down this:

How bad of a misquote is that since I clarified that you did explain and answer the question, and you did in fact use ellipses and an emoticon finalize your thoughts. Are you that hurt that you have to call me a douche? I don’t really feel that way towards you or anybody here on the boards. Actually appreciate most of your responses.
Also, I apologize for that, since I did decontextualize your words to that extent. I got carried away with creative license, because you and I have given eachother guff for a long time.
Still, I wonder why decibalnyc needs to ask where to go after the Germania building…
I want to apologize to decibalnyc to, because he’s clearly been under stress and anything I say that contradicts his ideas is like pushing his buttons. I appreciated his PMs a couple months ago as he expressed a lot of interest in the Milwaukee solution. Im sorry that I dont fully agree with his solution.
Its very interesting when someone puts so much confidence in a solution. If we defer to that, perhaps a casque will be found.

erexere

How bad of a misquote is that since I clarified that you did explain and answer the question, and you did in fact use ellipses and an emoticon finalize your thoughts. Are you that hurt that you have to call me a douche? I don’t really feel that way towards you or anybody here on the boards. Actually appreciate most of your responses.
Also, I apologize for that, since I did decontextualize your words to that extent. I got carried away with creative license, because you and I have given eachother guff for a long time.
Still, I wonder why decibalnyc needs to ask where to go after the Germania building…

He is prompting you, not asking for his own benefit. It’s a context thing… you wouldn’t understand.
And yes, being misquoted hurts me, as I pride myself in honestly answering all but insanely stupid questions. Your question about the 92 steps was just that and thoroughly deserved the
.

Well, sorry, four21.
When you mentioned the “Light building”, was that in reference to the North Point Lighthouse? (Fits the line “pass the compass and reach”)
Am I correct in assuming you do have an exact dig spot in mind and you’re electing to keep it off the boards? That makes sense for some of your brief commenting and the confidence you seem to be sharing about these verse lines.

erexere

Well, sorry, four21.
When you mentioned the “Light building”, was that in reference to the North Point Lighthouse? (Fits the line “pass the compass and reach”)
Am I correct in assuming you do have an exact dig spot in mind and you’re electing to keep it off the boards? That makes sense for some of your brief commenting and the confidence you seem to be sharing about these verse lines.

Here it is, buddy – last time:
As you walk the beating of the world (As you are walking Wells St.)
At a distance in time (Hit Second St.)
From three who lived there (Where you see the Germania building)
At a distance in space (Cross the bridge to the Light Building)
From woman, with harpsichord (Where you see the Grand Olde Lady Building with a harp)
I’ll let you take it from there.
I have elected to no longer participate in the boards, except for minor bouts of trolling, because 1) you have made it impossible to have a coherent dialogue, and 2) there are too many feet on the ground. A small, focused group seems to work much better. So, yes, except for this gift to you that was intended to display your nonsense during a bout of trolling, I keep all my thoughts and finds off the boards.

I know everyone is going to think I am crazy, but I think I figured it out and found the spot. I found the neck design, the silent harp, the wonderstone, the letter of the world and the trees all in one area.
I would post pictures but I honest to god think I found the spot.
I need to find a sonar machine now to see if I’m right. Going to make a few calls this week and see what I can come up with. If nothing else, I will have to do this later at night when I have a smaller chance of being caught.
I know you are probably all thinking this kid comes on the board and claims to know where it is. I will be the first to say I could be totally wrong. But without going into too much detail, once I saw the clues right in front of me and everything starting to click together I got a chill. I will say this. The letter of the world line in my opinion has been misinterpreted and if I for some reason am right, the solution to the hint will smack everyone in the face like “oh duh, of course that’s what it meant.”
I will shut up for now, but if anyone wants to offer input on how to dig or find this sonar machine I would love to hear it.

Hello everyone. New to the board but not new to this puzzle. Just wanted to say I will be doing some looking around and taking some pictures on Thursday morning and hope to see something that pops out to me on my walks. I emailed JPP and he actually replied to me. I pretty much told him since he is literally the last person alive that could help out with this thing that it would be nice if he maybe released some of the photos he was given to make his illustrations. He replied :
“I can no longer comment on any of the treasures or locations. Byron’s “properties” and “IP’s” (intellectual propety) were purchased in the bankruptcy by another publisher. I would be in violation of the contract I signed if I divulged any information.
Sorry – Good luck!
J”
I think I might reach out to the new publisher if I can track who that exactly is and see if I can get anywhere there.
Just wanted to thank everyone on here for all the great work they have done over the years, and I plan on making this a weekly or bi-weekly thing where I just kinda tool around in the 3 areas I think they might be.
On a side note, I decided to go to the Domes last week. The 4 stairways and the stairway that goes under the 35th street bridge I believe adds up to 92. I had to quickly leave the stairs under the bridge because what I was not aware of is the HUGE homeless population living under there and when they saw me and my girlfriend I kinda felt the look of “fresh meat” so we left. There is a huge compass in front of the Domes. However, after reaching out to the Domes I found out that it was installed about 10-15 years ago. But hey.. I’m trying.
Anyways.. just wanted to introduce myself and say hello.

forest_blight

A great article – I’m not sure if this has been posted yet:
http://urbanmilwaukee.com/2013/10/07/milwaukees-secret-treasure/

Actually, Egbert did, in the Image 10 thread. No harm to relink it.
viewtopic.php?p=127236#p127236

Making progress on MKE today…many meetings and some new information. Will keep everyone posted.

Also I wanted to make a post about the birch reference….
MANY people think this casque is buried at the southern end of a large birch tree. In the Cleveland verse a birch was mentioned…maybe it had nothing to do with solving the puzzle, maybe it did…Siskel and Egg would know better than I. I have to believe these things tho…
If he didn’t know his trees, why use a specific breed name for a tree…it would be purposely misleading. Also if the Milwaukee casque WAS buried next to a birch tree (if the assumption is correct about going to the first birch, pass 3 more trees, and find a large 5th) then I am positive he would not have buried it next to a cottonwood tree and called it a birch. Now if he meant pass 3 more trees and find a 5th tree as birch isn’t mentioned specifically for those lines, then the big cottonwood could make sense.
The key to this is understanding what he meant by Pass the Compass. Also there aren’t many birch trees in the area, so if he was using a birch tree as a marker, my guess would be that it was a birch tree somewhere in the forest of one of the ravines where you could walk to on one of the foot paths. Birch tree’s grow at a rate of about 30 feet over 20 years, reaching a maximum height of about 60 feet. If the “proud tall 5th” was a birch tree in it’s prime in 1980, it would be close to 60 ft tall by now, or it would have fallen over or been cut down. The young birch, would now be a full size tree that would be easy to spot.
Also the bell shape in the hand looks just like the overhead view of the grand staircase. Don’t know if anyone picked that up or not yet. Again the key’s to this puzzle are figuring out what is meant by “Pass the Compass” and “Pass 3 staying west” The most simple, common sense answer is usually correct…and the light house makes more sense than anything, but I would still be checking historical photo’s just in case…there could be something that is being overlooked here.

The more I watch progress get made on the puzzles the less and less I think you can really solve it based on the verses. It almost
has to
be an image that leads you to a correct park or area in a park, possibly with a
little
help from the first lines of the verse.
I think trying to shoehorn in “pass the compass” is impossible because the clues rarely make sense outside of the specific location. I’m not sure that Cleveland or Chicago were solvable in this method, and considering both solves either have completely un-understood parts of the verse or misunderstood (M&B!) verses, I just don’t think it’s the way to solve them.
As I make progress on Boston (standing on 421’s shoulders) and have located what appears to be a map of the park in the painting I truly think that’s the key to all of these. Look at the more recent finding of a map in Image 9 (Montreal) – and the hat in Cleveland. We’re missing really “big” clues and they can be solved without all of the “small” clues as well.
For example, I’ve heard an almost infinite # of suggestions for what “Eighteenth day, twelfth hour” means in Verse 3. All of them
make perfect sense
based on the proposed dig site, but don’t work out. For example mine on Cambridge Common – the park is located 10 feet from “Dawes Island” – a traffic island and plaques commemorating the ride of William Dawes (the other ‘midnight rider’ besides Revere). His route on the ride literally takes him past Harvard Stadium (“near those who pass the collesium with metal walls”) and his route is engraved with holden hoofprints in the sidewalk.
That’s a
perfect
and excellent match, that fits with Preiss’ cleverness (the poem isn’t about Revere or Longfellow, but it’s still directly gathered)… yet I’m now almost positive the casque isn’t even in Cambridge, let alone on the Common. If you told me that verse solve I’d still applaud and say it sounds great.

I sat and discussed this for 6 hours last night and yes…the verses and pictures are full of dual meanings…luckily I was able to interpret one of those BIG CLUES for Milwaukee a few days ago, and again, it makes total sense and is not reaching from what BP may have very well intended. It also gets you near the location once you’ve located the park correctly without having to follow every step of the verse.
The problem(s) with the Milwaukee puzzle are the same with all…time has passed and things have changed, but when you go back and do the research (look at old pictures, gather info from historians etc..) and piece the thing back together using the verses and the picture, at least I was able to find one of those ah-ha! moments. Like Siskel and Egg have said…when you find the location, you will know. I have been somewhat quiet about this, taking advice from Egg about not trying to be too confident or boisterous about it until I can prove more…but I have stood in a location and could see visual clues that made me feel like I was in the right spot. Using historical photo’s it felt even more correct. Even though I am 95% on my location, as recent as this morning I have come up with a 2nd option that also relates to the verse and picture but could put me at another location close to my original location.
You may be right, it could be unsolvable…but I think there are enough visual clues for each site that if you did find the correct place, it would be hard to dismiss. JJP was a great illustrator, there are probably many hidden clues that no one has seen. Go back and look at old “highlights” and “Mad” magazines and do the picture puzzles, it will train your brain to look at stuff differently. Also if there was such an obvious clue that many people (including myself at first) missed in image 10, there are probably obvious clues in the others…
Also was it ever concluded that M & B were Mozart and Beethoven…or did it mean Man & Beast ?
Lots of dual meanings that can be correct…almost every line of the Milwaukee verse has a dual meaning.

Preiss had said that M & B mean Mozart and Beethoven, but the finders of the casque disagree (as far as I know to this day) and said they solved it with Man & Beast. I’m happy it’s not that, because honestly that starts to get very very tricky and requires coming up with the same “verbal tricks” as Preiss, which I also don’t think he’d do. If that statue isn’t called MAN AND BEAST (and I forget if it is, or if it’s just a statue of a man and of a beast) then you’re required to look at it and come up with ‘man and beast’ when you could easily come up with something else.
I don’t think it’s unsolvable at all, I think most of these can be solved or solved to where they were (if gone). I just think that it needs to come from the images, and the verses are so so so specific to the park. You can lose your entire life trying to find “men of hard word” in NYC, and no shortage of compasses for example.
Would love to hear more about your spot in WI – Milwaukee is probably the city I know least about in this hunt and the casque I know the least about. I feel strongly about your point about “just knowing” – visiting 421s site in Boston it just felt wrong. Working off of his, I’m currently staring at a solution that slaps me in the face and has just tremendous visual matches to the
big
details in the picture. Not the small “dig heres” but all of the big landmarks are there. There is an almost too easy connection to Longfellow (surprise, welcome to Boston) that strikes me as really, really clever if correct. And this was achieved not through a ‘verse solve’ but through nailing down the park via imagery and finding a map.
My post was mostly to caution against going for ‘blind’ “verse solves” as I like to call them – reading the verse and then trying to find the treasure based on just the verse. You can shoehorn in a solve around almost any 1-mile square area in the USA doing that.

Are people still solid on thinking “beating of the world” means Kenwood St.?

Not me.

What then? How do you like the idea of a cobblestone street?

A great article – I’m not sure if this has been posted yet:
http://urbanmilwaukee.com/2013/10/07/milwaukees-secret-treasure/

Google makes it too easy to find information such as who a street is named after. In 1982, how would a Milwaukee person access this fact about Wells street being named after a brave soldier who fell in the War of 1812?
Im driven by some fairfolk fever to think this has significant bearing on Wells as a reference to Tchaikovsky because he wrote the 1812 Overture and the tool to measure distance on a map also looks like a nutcracker. It seems confusing to parallel the American-British conflict with a music work more about the French-Russian conflict, but the point if being about Thaddeus Kosciusko’s statue works since the principle reason for the European conflict was to liberate Poland from Russian control.
The best connection I can come up with for the words “from woman, with harpsichord / silently playing” is the Nutcracker ballet, since its a non-speaking or “silent” play with the music of Tchaikovsky. The one major problem I have with it is the confusion of a Celesta with a Harpshichord. Both look like a piano keyboard but are very different, one with bells, one with strings.

This depth of theory is beyond troublesome. All the while I have this strange notion about how Napoleon makes a great late age Bilbo Baggins…
In terms of puzzle design, I can understand BP seeking the most German-centric subject in Milwaukee and working off the Wisconsin Club. BP comes at everything at an angle rather than head-on. Its his methodology in emulating the Fairfolk hiddeness or underlyjng existence. Wells street is the backside or parkinglot side of the Club and it connects to downtown’s greatest piece if architecture, City Hall on 200 E. Wells. (Not to be interpreted as the Grand 200). I think the goal is to use the image or sillouette of City Hall as a way to find a rough location on the map, i.e. just north and slightly west of the City Hall proper. That spot is then compared to the Plankington rotunda of 92 steps in a building bound by the 200-block west on Grand Ave. This is where it gets funky as ever. 200-degrees is a heading that coonects the VIEW of City Hall to the Plankington rotunda and wishing well. This heading may be extrapolated by passing the compass southwest across the map along the 200-degree heading. The first step of the compass’ leg lands on the river bank adjacent to the municipal city sewers, the lowest point or “foot of the culvert”.
What a wicked puzzle.

The Kenwood Chef was developed by Ken Wood in Britain and the first model – the A700 – went on sale in 1950 with an array of attachments to whisk, mix, mince and liquidise food. It was an instant success and after numerous models and updates is still Kenwood’s top seller today.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article … YEARS.html

I found the link to how to divide or extrapolate distance, this must be considered as a very easy and accessible method suitable for what could be meant by “Pass the compass”,
http://www.boatsafe.com/navigation/divide1.htm
http://americanhistory.si.edu/collectio … -compasses
I applied it to this visual representation based on two very critical points. A) the exact match of the image of City Hall as a position on a city map, B) the intersection of 200 and Grand.
I use the distance from A to B to establish the setting on the compass and the direction of the line which so happens to be 200-degrees on a circle which starts with 0-degrees at north on the map. This is extremely easy to verify and nothing too fancy, though I wouldn’t be surprised if some people are shy of using a ruler, compass, and 360-degree measurement tool.
The very first stepping of the compass lands on the bank of the historic Milwaukee Sewerage District, which is something considered to be at the lowest elevation for the purpose of sewage treatment and ease of access to river water for pumping. Could this sewer facility be the interpretation for the line that follows “pass the compass”? Is a context for a culvert? Also, does “below the bridge” lead us to the idea of “looking to the future,” as in “water under the bridge”?
After seven steps, we land in a spot which is highly consistent with walking 100 paces south east to the entrance of the park where we find a young birch and then only three more birch on our approach to a 1/5th rank statue of Brigadier General Kosciuszko.

Anything from that research to share?

Elcid

Anything from that research to share?

Elcid — I do not remember seeing anyone post about earnest attempts to do things on my list. I hope someone does this eventually; they still sound like good avenues for research.

Elcid,
Your finding may be different than mine, as Savral’s findings were, as other’s were. I would say you should take a look for yourself without knowing what anyone else thinks is important, and figure out what you think is important to look for. Coming up with theories and testing them, digging for clues in boxes of photo’s, finding that 1 thing you were looking for to confirm or dis confirm your theory…that’s what it’s all about, that’s half the fun.
The Downtown Library has a room full of historical photo’s, and the downtown historical society also has some. If you want some other sources pm me and I’m happy to point you in the right direction. Go find something new, put it to use!

erexere

“From woman, with harpshicord”
I know, this line should have it’s own thread…
Could this translate to “from a wide bench”? wide = broad = woman, harpsichord,s come with a bench. So is/was there any particularly wide benches around downtown Milwaukee?

Found it!

Im thinking more along the lines of a bleachers, tiered rows of very wide bench seating. That may tie in well with “silently playing” in terms of being spectators to the sport and not actively playing as in how the reference is used in business with the term “silent partner”.

I might have to settle on the application of a compass,
1: place one leg on the three story parking structure with a perfect view on City Hall
2: place the second leg on the 92-step rotunda at Plankington; this fixes the width
3: count the number of objects being juggled (7)
4: step the compass 7 times at 200-degrees
5: land on the bleachers of the Kosciuszco(old name?) school sports field
6: walk 100 paces to the park entrance.
I rather like the harpsichord as a two piece item, instrument and bench.

“From woman, with harpshicord”
I know, this line should have it’s own thread…
Could this translate to “from a wide bench”? wide = broad = woman, harpsichord,s come with a bench. So is/was there any particularly wide benches around downtown Milwaukee?

I stopped by our campus library this morning and got this:
…which confirms stercox’s find of Ms. Pietsch’s home address.
Wauwatosa Cemetery is in the western part of Milwaukee, just west of 76th St. So I’m afraid Ms. Pietsch is not our harpsichordist unless
At a distance in space
is interpreted very liberally.

forest_blight

Wauwatosa Cemetery is in the western part of Milwaukee, just west of 76th St. So I’m afraid Ms. Pietsch is not our harpsichordist unless
At a distance in space
is interpreted very liberally.

Well, she died after the book was published, so it would have to be a VERY liberal interpretation.

Unknown

Unknown:
I believe Fox offered up Edna Frida Pietsch (a famous German female composer born in Milwaukee)  a long time ago as our possible harpsichord woman

I heard back from the Milwaukee Historical Society, Edna Frida Pietsch lived at 3522 W. Kilbourne Avenue (which is quite a distance away from the area of interest and not in the North Point Historical district.  Its nearly downtown.  I think this may be a dead end also.  Unless FB gets conflicting information from his sources.

Maybe this will help —

Pass the compass and reach
The foot of the culvert
Below the bridge
It is a stretch to equate
culvert
with one of the ravines. When is the last time you described a ravine as a culvert? Culverts are man-made, enclosed ditches intended to carry water, whereas ravines are natural landscape features. On the other hand, my dictionary defines “culvert” as (definition 3) “bridge,” so it could just be a reference to the Lion Bridge itself. So, in the same way that
92 steps
and
grand 200
are references to the same set of stairs,
culvert
and
bridge
could refer to the same landmark (imagine a period after
culvert
just as we do after
steps
).
On the
other
other hand… I was browsing eBay for images of Lake Park today (there are dozens) and ran across something interesting. Below are three pictures of Lake Park from before the monumental landfill project that created Lincoln Memorial Drive. I can’t tell if they are based on photographs or are just very good artist’s renderings, but notice that the third one has a “culvert-shaped” thing on the bluff over our favorite ravine. The mystery object – if it is a culvert – would empty out very close to where our trees are today. Could this be our “culvert”? stercox, were the remnants of this thing (whatever it is) visible during your visit? More to the point, would it have been there in 1982?
(1905 date)
(1912 postmark)
(1909 postmark)

On second thought, maybe it’s just a rip in the postcard + wishful thinking. It’s hard to tell from a JPG image. Seems like an awfully strange place for a culvert.

Dwarves’ treasure: purple Amethyst
Imperial star of Germany
I see it like this.
View the three stories of Mitchell
The three-storey Mitchell mansion or
German Club
on West Wisconsin Ave, with its staircase adorned with 24 lions. (Map left.)
As you walk the beating of the world
West Wisconsin -> WWI -> “world war won”
At a distance in time
From three who lived there
The three men who bought the house and established the club – Winkler, Koeppen and Gugler.
At a distance in space
From woman, with harpsichord
Silently playing
The Art Museum (map right), taking you down the avenue, past the nearby Pabst Theatre with its copper sign and design matching the collar.
Step on nature
Cast in copper
Oakleaf Trail and Lincoln Memorial Drive.
Ascend the 92 steps
After climbing the grand 200
Up the drive to the Grand Staircase in Lake Park.
Pass the compass and reach
The foot of the culvert
Below the bridge
Past North Point Lighthouse to the bridge:
Walk 100 paces
Southeast over rock and soil
To the first young birch
Pass three, staying west
You’ll see a letter from the country
Of wonderstone’s hearth
On a proud, tall fifth
At its southern foot
The treasure waits
Gets hazy at this point. I’m favouring the culvert at the mo, for reasons explained in the
Milwaukee Update
thread (repetition of “foot”), but I’m not sure where it is or what it looks like. Seem to remember seeing a picture of a culvert somewhere on the forum with one of the lion bridges in the background. The juggler is kind of looking through the millstone at a bridge.

digger7

Hi,
So my idea is that perhaps the line, AT A DISTANCE IN SPACE FROM WOMAN, indicates some kind of monastery in the vicinity or another form of gender segregation.
Looking forward to sharing ideas,
digger7

Or perhaps ‘woman’ refers to the original idea of woman: Eve.
ck

nice first post digger…. Welcome to the madhouse

Hi,
My first post to this board.  I got this book a few years ago after reading about it in an article in (I think) The New York Review of Books and have been thinking it about it on an off since then so was really happy when I recently found this website.  Most of the ideas I had about the pictures have been talked about along with many that I never considered.  I especially liked the lat/lon idea.  Anyway, I have been reading the posts and something struck me about verse 8.  All of the references to it in the posts talk about A woman or THE woman but that is not what verse says.  It just says WOMAN as in womankind
woman definition
Women considered as a group; womankind: “
Woman feels the invidious distinctions of sex exactly as the black man does those of color
” (Elizabeth Cady Stanton).
Definition from yourdictionary.com
So my idea is that perhaps the line, AT A DISTANCE IN SPACE FROM WOMAN, indicates some kind of monastery in the vicinity or another form of gender segregation.
Looking forward to sharing ideas,
digger7

Looking on google earth
Once you descend from the lion bridge and travel southeast on the ravine trail there is that rock and dirt path that leads toward Lincoln memorial hwy. the actual trail path connects to the sidewalk at Lincoln but that rock path ends in a circular indentation. Looks like maybe a manhole or something round. The “millstone” is a mile down near the bridge by the grand staircase, is this maybe a second “millstone” at the end of the rock path? Has anyone been there?

Why not “a T & a T”… Ma Bell?
Any payphones around a huge mountain? Say… around McKinley somewhere?

jayheedan1

Looking on google earth
Once you descend from the lion bridge and travel southeast on the ravine trail there is that rock and dirt path that leads toward Lincoln memorial hwy. the actual trail path connects to the sidewalk at Lincoln but that rock path ends in a circular indentation. Looks like maybe a manhole or something round. The “millstone” is a mile down near the bridge by the grand staircase, is this maybe a second “millstone” at the end of the rock path? Has anyone been there?

Howdy Jay,
Yeah, they have been there. (Me too….)
There’s not a second ‘millstone’….and, the area has changed…a ton, just over the past decade and a half
(Read the past posts in the threads regarding Milwaukee from animal painter, forest blight, stercox, decibalnyc, etc, etc, etc….or, by all means, continue to look at current pics on Google Earth, ignoring all of the previous ground work.)

Millstone and wonderstone:
Millstones pulverize material by the action of turning, usually assembled as a runner over a bedstone.  The line “Of wonderstone’s hearth” may have a connection to the theme of rotation.  Wonderstone’s are known for their variegated pattern and as such are often put to polish.  When I was about 8 years old, I had a next door neighbor who would run his rock tumbler for days on end during the summer.  It was a barrel filled with a variety of stones.  He would add some type of sand and a liquid and set the thing to turning with a motor.  When he was done he had a bunch of cool looking glossy rocks.
How does this line work?  “Of” is a way of saying it’s part of or from something.  “Hearth” is either to do with the floor or lower portion of a fireplace or it’s just a way of referring to the home of something.  Possibly it’s a way of referring to where something is crafted or refined, such as how a blacksmith would forge something in a hearth.  This line may be saying “of the same process from which comes a wonderstone”.  Tumbling is synonymous to polishing in this case and not altogether different than what the process of milling achieves as it grinds and refines materials into smaller bits.  The usage of the word does have slightly different applications depending on whether we’re speaking of actual grinding verses polishing.
I’m led to consider that this line is to be understood on it’s own and doesn’t go with either adjacent lines.  I think it is simply saying “Polish”.

Exploring new ideas in the verse:
View the three stories of Mitchell
Mitchell Building (Bank) accounts/stories
As you walk the beating of the world
written on one side of the Kosciuszko Monument is “POLIS W MILWAUKEE” [walk the beat = “police”, pronounced exactly like POLIS], and on the
other side “TO THE HERO OF BOTH HEMISPHERES” [beating of the world]
At a distance in time
one hour
From three who lived there
?
At a distance in space
league = relative distance traveled in one hour, about three miles
From woman, with harpsichord
gossip, harp+string = repeating sound = twitter/chirp
Silently playing
crickets
Step on nature
hop on grass = grasshopper.  Cricket + Grasshopper = Locust Avenue?
Cast in copper
wishing well, “penny for your thoughts?”, Lincoln is on the penny
Ascend the 92 steps
The Grand Avenue Mall has a circular set of stairs (4×23=92)
After climbing the grand 200
?
Pass the compass and reach
Pass the compass 200 degrees after finding your position on the map at The Grand Avenue Mall
The foot of the culvert
?
Below the bridge
?
Walk 100 paces
Southeast over rock and soil
?
To the first young birch
Pass three, staying west
three birch’s are along the west side of Kosciuszko Park
You’ll see a letter from the country
Kosciuszko, like Lincoln, an educated man from a rural setting
Of wonderstone’s hearth
polish, a rock tumbler may be used to polish wonderstone
On a proud, tall fifth
statue’s hat, Kosciuszko is a 1-star/5-star General
At its southern foot
“southpaw”, meaning the cask is at it’s left side?
The treasure waits
waiting is often performed while sitting or standing in a line.

I am not as concerned with what the first few lines mean as long as we find the correct culvert. I know you have went through the verse in the park several times but you should try again from the culvert. If you end up back at the tree with the G on it then you have likely found the right spot. All treesd would be bigger then they were in the early ’80s. I think you should focus on the G tree and imediate are around it. Two things I would focus on and they have likely been looked at before is when was the retaining wall built and how much ivy/undergrowth was in the area at that time. Your present day photos look like they have an excessive maount of ivy and undergrowth. Next find out what you can about how the retaining wall was constructed. It is possible a construction crew dug it up and did not know what it was.
This could help us know if we got the right spot.
On my own I will look not spacificly for this hunt but in general at what sort of ground rader is avalable and if any may be useful to finding these casques.

So how do you know you have the right culvert if you don’t definitively solve the first clues.
Basically you are hoping you have the right culvert and then trying to make the rest of the clues fit the location.
Working from Verse 7 in GG park I would rate my percentage of sureness like this.
From Stone walls door = Less the 1% – cant find a stone wall with a door…
The Air Smells sweet… 90%  excellent fit with the conservatory of flowers
….
nearby high points are 3 90% excellent fit with Sutro Tower
…
Aces high but first across, 80% fit with highway 1 and crossover drive and the location of prayerbook cross
etc. etc. all of the latter clues but one are excellent fits.  but there is that darn fact that when I dig a hole there is no casque at the bottom of it.
So all my clues while great fits dont lead to the casque.  I really really want to ignore that first one and just jump into the middle of the verse.
unfortuately it didnt work, so now I am going back to the beginning, and as good as all the other clues fit. If I cant figure out that first one, I am going to assume
verse 7 is not GGpark.  Which means I have 9 more to choose from…

http://www.kylesconverter.com/length/paces-to-feet

Unknown

Unknown:
Try this on Google Maps:
– Click on Maps Labs at bottom of left panel
– Enable Distance Measuring Tool
– Save changes
– Click on ruler tool icon bottom left corner of map
– Units: Select “I’m feeling geeky”
– Select Roman double paces
on drop down box
– Click on map to place first point
– Click on second point and move to 50 or 100 double paces
– Try other units.

Cool!
Using the Google Distance measuring tool on the map…
from under the Lion Bridge…
100 paces takes you approximately 249 feet!
(100 paces=250 feet according to Malted’s Pace-converter link)
That is still on the grass at the end of the ravine…
AP
To access the Google Maps Distance Measuring feature,
I just right-clicked on the Google map and got a drop-down menu.

In general, that doesn’t sound very accurate to me. It’s not going to measure height, for one thing.
I’m just a bit puzzled…obviously, people have walked it…but I don’t know where the cross-the-road thing came from. Where Forest and co dug, is that 100 paces from under the bridge…? And that’s beside the road entrance…? What about all the other walking described in the verse…?
Besides which, I thought it’s not a birch, and I can’t think BP could possibly have written a puzzle based on a tree he couldn’t recognise…? I’m confused. Reminds me of the recent idea that he didn’t know a harp from a harpsichord. I mean, for goodness sake, let’s credit the man with
some
intelligence…

Unknown

Unknown:
I believe the solution for the Chicago treasure did incorporate trees.

Johann,  I believe you are correct.  I remember shadowrunner’s discussion of the solve and that “The end of ten by thirteen”  was actually an area defined by 10 trees in a row running perpendicular to 13 trees in a row.

erexere

The Monument to Immigrant Mothers in Cathedral Square has a woman holding a baby and standing by her side a young child.  I think the point of saying harpsichord is connected to the particular name for a smaller box style called the “Virginal” which according to Wikipedia was typically played by women.  I think the following line “Silently playing” must be connected.  In my mind I picture how someone could play a “box with strings” silently and I see a woman with her mouth closed and humming a soothing sound to comfort her child.  The “voice” is produced by vibrating muscle strings in the voice-box.  We typically see a person with their lips shut as being silent.  A statue of a woman with her lips closed isn’t enough, but in connection to holding a child it makes really good sense that she could be humming.

Wait… So its an imaginary harpsichord?
and however you convolute it, Humming is never described as playing an instrument.
Even if the statue had a large sign stating “Woman Humming”
That would be one of the least likely connections for
From woman, with harpsichord
Silently playing
anybody has put forward here
as long as we are making stuff up, Lets just imagine a statue of a woman sitting a harpsichord” call it good and go from there…

Pass the compass and reach
What if the basketball arena is the “compass”?  It’s formerly named the MECCA.  Mecca is a real place in Islamic tradition but it is also idiomatically a place of “attraction”.  Attraction is the prime principle in the workings of a compass, which is a magnetic needle being attracted to a magnetic north.
Consider also that in the game of basketball a very significant amount of “passing” and “reaching” occurs.  I believe the line is a form of double-double entendre to say “Pass where basketball players pass” or “continue to a place beyond the MECCA” but also to suggest that once in Lake Park near the Grand Stair, discover the North Point Lighthouse, “compasses” point north, and “move beyond to a distance as far as the pointer extends”.  Preiss might have simply seen this dual compass/mecca opportunity and chose a most economical way of putting it into words.
As in basketball, I think we are in a leaping situation and not bound or confined only to Lake Park.
From woman, with harpsichord
Silently playing
I believe this is a statue by Ivan Mestrovic.  He also crafted the Spearman and the Bowman of Chicago.
The Monument to Immigrant Mothers in Cathedral Square has a woman holding a baby and standing by her side a young child.  I think the point of saying harpsichord is connected to the particular name for a smaller box style called the “Virginal” which according to Wikipedia was typically played by women.  I think the following line “Silently playing” must be connected.  In my mind I picture how someone could play a “box with strings” silently and I see a woman with her mouth closed and humming a soothing sound to comfort her child.  The “voice” is produced by vibrating muscle strings in the voice-box.  We typically see a person with their lips shut as being silent.  A statue of a woman with her lips closed isn’t enough, but in connection to holding a child it makes really good sense that she could be humming.

As I continue to experiment with the idea that the Litany of the Jewels lines for purple amethysts as the Imperial star of Germany, I notice there’s a decent number of references to the Imperial Theater or the Imperial School when cross referencing either Petyr Ilych Tchaikovsky or the Nutcracker ballet.
I continue to wonder if the LotJ hint is meant to lead us to the topic of some kind of performance ala the “star” of the show. I continue to have the feeling that “imperial” has something to do with units of measurement like distance or time.

Ascend the 92 steps, is assuredly the Grand Staircase.
Could a ‘grand 200′ be considered “1000” 200s, which is basically “200,000”?’
I’m finding a lot of associations that point to the St. Josaphat Basilica.  It has a lot of copper in it’s dome.  It has two bell towers.  We see a bell shape in the palm of one of the woman’s hands in image 10.  We don’t know that there isn’t a bell in the other hand, so one hand = one bell, two hands = two bells.  200,000 tons of scrap materials were purchased for $20,000 to build it.  I wonder if there’s a historical marker or plaque at the site declaring these details…how did it get in the Wiki article?
There are four clocks in the dome, each facing a compass direction.

It looks like it was there since the pages creation, 5 Oct. 2005. The verbiage was grabbed from
http://www3.jsonline.com/desk/histwis/archive3.asp
. It also seems an “author” here
http://onmilwaukee.com/ent/articles/mamafterdarkday6.html
ripped the verbiage recently.

.

I think I’m right.
Mitchell Hall east to Grand Staircase and then west and onto Locust
south on Humboldt, turn west on Water which curves south
continue on Water past Solomon, Byron, and Daniel’s streets
merge onto 1st continuing south and turn west on Mitchell street
find the Greek columns of the old bank on 11th and turn south
stop at Becher and see the entrance of Kosciuszko Park to the east
walk south on 10th along, staying on the west side of the park
see a birch, three more, and then the tall pround 1/5th
(5-star ranks of General) statue of Kosciuszko.
Between this statue and the dome tip of St. Josaphat, there must be a way to determine the casque’s location.

My biggest exception to this is basically you are rewriting clues.
BP was a wordsmith.
He knew how to choose his words carefully and in the two solved examples we find he used exactly the words he needed to..
Then we find some of those words had hidden meaning but the words were exactly correct.
Yet the hidden meaning was secondary.

I like that words should be exactly correct.  Are you excluding homonyms?  Plain plane, world whirrled, etc?

The “beat” is colloquial for a policeman walking his route.  Perhaps this ties into the Kenwood beater for a 2:1 clue revolving around things which beat.
I’m very intent on the ‘Cast in copper’ line as a reference to the police call boxes since discovering the term ‘coppers’ refers to policemen.
However Preiss knew of the inventor of the kitchen mixer, I wonder if he delved into the inventor of the traffic light which is the brother of the man who patented these police call boxes for Milwaukee.  Oscar and Hugo Kleinsteuber.
http://patents.ic.gc.ca/opic-cipo/cpd/e … awings.pdf

Wouldnt you think that police box /traffic light connection is so obscure  and the Internet wasnt available for easily finding obscure facts such as that.
And BP specifically said the puzzles were simple and should be solved quickly,
That has nothing to do with this puzzle.

Researching a bit about the Elks Lodge at the former E. Wisconsin location (demolished in 1971) it was called the “Wonderlodge”.
I haven’t found any good photos of it, but there is a Stag mounted out front, near the waterfront.

If I were to make a list of things to quibble with about this particular puzzle, the “Marietta” clue wouldn’t even be in my top three. Sure it’s a lousy clue, but it’s between two pretty good clues. And that, to me, is what’s important. Not the significance on any one clue, but how it fits into the overall narrative. Now, if the clue in question is the “dig spot” clue, then we have a problem, and that is the problem we should focus on.
My two cents.

The reference to:
“woman, with harpsichord
Silently playing”
is no big mystery.
When you “view the three stories of Mitchell
as you walk the beating of the world”,
you see Mitchell Hall as you are walking down
Kenwood Blvd.
“
At a distance in time
From three who lived there
“
is just BP’s way of referring to streets
named for people who actually lived in
Milwaukee:
Downer, Hackett and Shepard.
At a distance in space
From woman, with harpsichord
Silently playing
As BP continued to walk down Kenwood Blvd
and passed Marietta Ave., he merely found a
way to refer to the name Marietta by doing
some research when he got home…coming
up with an obscure female renaissance painter
The reason BP said “At a distance in space”, is
because Marietta Robusti never lived in Milwaukee.
She lived in Venice.
She happened to do a self portrait standing
near a harpsichord.
(We were not supposed to know this, but could
verify it later after finding that we were on
the right track in Lake Park.)
If BP had referred to “Marietta Alboni”, he
would have chosen a different descriptor.
for a famous Italian contralto opera singer.
The woman with harpsichord, was just a way
to cover Marietta Ave.

I just want to point out that there is no linear direction to walk east or west on Kenwood Blvd. If the 3 who lived there are to denote streets named after people of Milwaukee instead of the 3 founders, what’s to say the many streets to the west like (James) Stowall Ave. (Leonard “Lenny”) Farwell Ave. and (Eliphalet) Cramer St. aren’t the 3? It could be possible that you need Marietta to know the direction, but since it’s right across the street from Lake Park, you wouldn’t need 2 lines to denote 3 other streets.
Marietta Robusti is not listed as a well known composer or Harpsichordist. I don’t think it’s a good match…not like “Rhapsodic mans soil” or “Ride the man of Oz” it’s not widely known.
I think there is something else, as Egbert said, like a bust, or a fountain, or statue…even a relief on a building…something that is a better match than Marietta Ave. Also it seems if he wanted to point out a single street he may have just used a letter like “From M, Step on nature” would have been just as cryptic.
Maybe there is something by the Statue at the entrance to lake park to represent “Woman”, maybe something around the Golf Course which would make “Silently Playing” seem more logical.

Someone really wants that Casque

Unknown

Unknown:
Ascend the 92 steps
After climbing the grand 200
Pass the compass and reach
The foot of the culvert
Below the bridge
Walk 100 paces
Southeast over rock and soil
To the first young birch
Pass three, staying west
You’ll see a letter from the country
Of wonderstone’s hearth
On a proud, tall fifth
At its southern foot
The treasure waits.

I was searching for things with 92 steps.  There are quite a bit!  The most notable is “El Castillo” in Mexico (it IS in North America):
http://www.mexperience.com/inmexico/photos/10chichen.htm
I am going to post this under Image 8 as well — the one that looks like it’s in the desert.  Please take a moment to look at the pictures of the nearby columns — they look strikingly similar to Image 8.
However, if you look at the verse, it appears that after climbing these 92 steps, you then continue your journey.  So, with “El Castillo,” or any structure that has 92 steps on it, you have nowhere to go — so it seems that the verse does not apply here.
So I started digging for paths that have 92 steps.  There is an “Alta Vista” path in Santa Barbara, California, but in order to determine if it’s the right one, someone would have to go there.  Here is the site that has it (among many other paths).  Just do a “find” on the page for “92 steps.”
http://www.internettime.com/bpwa/latest_paths.htm
Finally, here’s another place that has 92 steps — look at the entry for Aug. 11.
http://www.roamingamerica.com/travelog/michigan/michigan.html
As for “the grand 200,” it could refer to 200,000 of something (200 grand), or maybe 200 of something which are referred to as “Grand,” such as 200 Grand Pianos.

Euhirudinea

Hey now, you can’t belittle me with my own joke (Image 10 thread; Page 25; about halfway down). Find something original.

Your
joke??? I was acting out that skit as a camp counselor in Oregon 25 years ago! I’ve got first dibs!
I didn’t mean anything critical by what I was saying, and I hope you didn’t take it that way. I just think we all need to take a step back and be sure we’re not imposing our own conditions on a hunt set up by somebody else. There was somebody on here the other day who was saying that the Boston casque couldn’t be hidden in Charlesgate because it’s such an ugly area. (Was there some promise in
The Secret
that we would only be taken to attractive places?)
Imposing our own preconditions about where Preiss is taking us and what he wants to show us is a sure route to confusion. Maybe we’re going someplace nice and historic, but maybe not. We just need to follow the clues.

So…you are under the foot bridge with the big
“O”-shaped holes in it. From under the bridge, you take 100 paces in the
southeast direction.
(As you can see, the trail here is not rock and soil. It is concrete steps
and an asphalt walkway.)
If the 100 paces leave you near the concrete circular slab,
that is where you should see the “first young birch”.
Then…..you must “pass three…
staying west
” to
be able to see the proud tall 5th.
This area does not appear to follow the steps in the verse.

animal painter

So…you are under the foot bridge with the big
“O”-shaped holes in it. From under the bridge, you take 100 paces in the
southeast direction.
(As you can see, the trail here is not rock and soil. It is concrete steps
and an asphalt walkway.)
If the 100 paces leave you near the concrete circular slab,
that is where you should see the “first young birch”.
Then…..you must “pass three…
staying west
” to
be able to see the proud tall 5th.
This area does not appear to follow the steps in the verse.

The two photos you’ve got there are taken from Lincoln Memorial Drive looking west toward the footbridge. And, yes, there’s a stretch of pavement there at the bottom.
But that’s not the stretch Preiss is talking about!
You’re approaching the trail from the wrong end. Look at the map below to see the actual route.
We cross the Lake Park Footbridge, descend the culvert (at “D”), join the Locust Street Trail, and then pass under the bridge. (And that section of the trail very definitely IS made of rock and soil.) We start counting our 100 steps and get to about where the big “E” is on my map. We see our birch, pass the rest of them, and get to the treasure tree somewhere near the Hell Stone. “Staying west” just tells us to stay on this side of Lincoln Memorial Drive. If we reach the road, we’ve gone too far.
Tjgrey, can you come up with a good nickname for that footbridge? It needs a handle.

I believe that the 100 steps are supposed to start “under the bridge”.
The distance from under the bridge to the concrete steps with the
wood hand rail does not seem to be long enough to be 100 paces.
Someone may want to count that stretch

Also something else to keep in mind… There is a Square and Compass on the south side lamp post already, if we assume there was also one on the north side that has now been replaced by a modern plate, well folks then we have 2 compasses at the top of the stairs. However as I stated a long time ago, those all look like modern rivets on there…I don’t think the G’s were there in ’81, it’s possible…but even if they were on the posts in ’81, there would still be one on either side. If you go right you would never even see the golf course because you hit the bridge before you come around the front of the Lake Park Bistro.
If Lake Park is where we are looking, be it more interesting historically or not, it would be hard to say that the North Point lighthouse doesn’t represent the Compass…it’s too good of a play on words to ignore, and right along the lines of other play on words lines in other verses in the hunt.
I know it’s exciting when you think you’re on to something, but sometimes you have to step back and look at common sense…I thought I had the right spot in lake park 3 times, and could prove all 3 as a logical solution until I put the yellow lawnmower over it and found nothing.
There is very little reason for turning right or left at the top of the stairs, but you must choose one way…not knowing where to go at the top of the stairs because of a giant building blocking your view would dictate that you go to the front of the building and look again.
The ONLY way that Oregonians theory works, is if you can prove that both compasses were there in 1981, and SEEING THE BRIDGE from the top of the stairs would dictate which Compass to pass. If the Ravine Rd. Bridge is “the Bridge” then the most logical, easiest way to “reach” the road underneath would be to just walk to the top of Ravine Rd and go down, not to cross the bridge and hit a trail. Regardless of how you “reach” it, 100 paces SE from under Ravine Rd. Bridge puts you at the corner of the intersection you just crossed getting to the stairs.

Look at it this way: It’s 1983. You climb the Grand Staircase with your copy of
The Secret
in hand and then you look at Verse 8 to see what comes next. It tells you that you need to go under a bridge. So which way do you go?
Now, correct me if I’m wrong here, but I don’t think anyone can see the Lion bridges from the top of the Grand Staircase. And there’s no sign saying that there are some bridges off to the left. (Is there?) But you already KNOW that there’s a bridge directly to the right. For one thing, you might be able to see it from where you’re standing, depending on the the tree height and the season. But, for another thing,
you just passed that same bridge when you went down Lincoln Memorial Drive!!
Preiss was showing us the bridge by taking us on that route!
So anyone who has followed the instructions and made it to the top of the staircase HAS to know that there’s a bridge off to the right. And there’s nothing at all to suggest that there are also some other bridges off to the left. I don’t see how there’s any ambiguity about this at all. If you know you need a bridge and the only bridge you can see nearby is to the right, then of course you go right.
And if you know that you need to 1) go down a culvert, 2) pass under the bridge, and 3) walk southeast downhill (in that order), then the culvert has to be west of the bridge. So then it’s only a matter of scouting the southwest and northwest ends of the footbridge to find the culvert. Piece of cake.

forest_blight

Why do people keep calling that thing a millstone? It’s not a millstone! Doesn’t even look like one.

If you’ve got a better nickname, I’m open to suggestions! The concrete donut? Portal to Hell? Lake Park’s bellybutton?

Oregonian

If you’ve got a better nickname, I’m open to suggestions! The concrete donut? Portal to Hell? Lake Park’s bellybutton?

that Portal to Hell is the “Secret”! We are all sucked in!!!
Can’t wait to see the theories now on how Dante’s Inferno ties to the hunt…

Unknown

Unknown:
I know several people are reluctant to turn right at the top of the stairs because they like the idea of the red juggling balls being the tee markers on the golf course

That would be me. Because of the red balls. And the fact that this takes the Lion Bridges and the lighthouse out of the solve (two of Lake Park’s most interesting features) as well. But mostly because we now have three distinct lines in the verse that say essentially the same thing (climb the staircase), and that just seems unnecessarily redundant to me. Especially when the first line (ascend the 92 steps) is so unambiguous.
I do agree that now is a great time to do reconnaissance, despite the weather. Assuming that there isn’t too much snow on the ground. From the pictures, it looks very pretty, in a wintry kind of way. But then again, I’m a skier. Cold weather doesn’t bother me much.

Euhirudinea

That would be me. Because of the red balls. And the fact that this takes the Lion Bridges and the lighthouse out of the solve (two of Lake Park’s most interesting features) as well.

Renovator, I think you might be making the mistake of following the route you would prefer rather than the route that Preiss has given us. First you didn’t like the idea of taking a path that doubled back on itself. Then you wanted to go by the golf course to see the red spheres. And now you think we should go to the lighthouse and the Lion Bridges because they have more historical interest. It’s like the old gag about the drunk who loses his keys in one place but looks somewhere else because the light is better.
Other routes through Lake Park might have more scenery or convenience, but that’s irrelevant. All we should be using are the clues that are in the book. And the route over the Ravine Road footbridge and down the Locust Street Trail is still the only route that even comes close to meeting those instructions:
Pass the compass and reach
The foot of the culvert
Below the bridge
Walk 100 paces
Southeast over rock and soil
Plus, it has the added visual match of explaining the cicada nymph and the
millstone
portal to Hell. And I predict that, if someone makes it out there before spring, we will find the birch stump(s) as well. After 33 years, this is as good a match as we could possibly hope to find.

Oregonian

Renovator, I think you might be making the mistake of following the route you would prefer rather than the route that Preiss has given us. First you didn’t like the idea of taking a path that doubled back on itself. Then you wanted to go by the golf course to see the red spheres. And now you think we should go to the lighthouse and the Lion Bridges because they have more historical interest. It’s like the old gag about the drunk who loses his keys in one place but looks somewhere else because the light is better.
Other routes through Lake Park might have more scenery or convenience, but that’s irrelevant. All we should be using are the clues that are in the book. And the route over the Ravine Road footbridge and down the Locust Street Trail is still the only route that even comes close to meeting those instructions:
Pass the compass and reach
The foot of the culvert
Below the bridge
Walk 100 paces
Southeast over rock and soil
Plus, it has the added visual match of explaining the cicada nymph and the
millstone
portal to Hell. And I predict that, if someone makes it out there before spring, we will find the birch stump(s) as well. After 33 years, this is as good a match as we could possibly hope to find.

I don’t see that there is too much of a “preferred route” here.
You “ascend the 92 steps” (the Lake Park staircase)
“After climbing the grand 200” (again the same staircase-just reading it again as a new line)
You “pass the compass and reach…the foot of the culvert”
(here, from the text we can assume going:
left: takes you to the North Point Lighthouse and you reach the foot of the culvert below a bridge
or right: takes you by the Masonic compass and you reach the foot of the bridge at E. Ravine Rd)
So you do have a split/decision to make here. Now, I know 100 paces from the beginning/foot of the culvert has been stepped off on the Lighthouse side, but has anyone stepped it off on the E. Ravine Rd side? To me, looking at GMaps anyway, it looks like walking 100 paces
southeast
(I would check to see if it’s “rock and soil” too…) moves you back in, towards the grand stairs. Now, if you start at the foot of the ravine on the OTHER side of E. Ravine Rd (on the trail), I can see where this comes out to the Hell Stone. But, if you do take that trail southeast toward said Hell Stone, to reach a birch tree, you can’t come to another birch unless you cross a road? Do the trees match up going this route? To me, you can’t count five birch trees moving west (back towards the stairs…from Google anyway).
I personally, would check these things. If they don’t match up how the verse says, I would call this one off.

Unknown

Unknown:
It’s like the old gag about the drunk who loses his keys in one place but looks somewhere else because the light is better.

Hey now, you can’t belittle me with my own joke (Image 10 thread; Page 25; about halfway down). Find something original.
With regard to the East Ravine Road solve that you are championing, my concerns are clear, consistent, and well documented in this thread for anyone who wants to read them. They are free to use that information in any way they see fit. By the same token, there are at least three or four people in the Milwaukee area that read this forum (that I know of, and probably several more that lurk), and if any one of them is convinced by your theory, then they have all the information they need to go dig it up this spring. They may already have for all we know.
No need to take this so personally Oregonian. Ultimately, we are after the same thing.

Why do people keep calling that thing a millstone? It’s not a millstone! Doesn’t even look like one.

tjgrey

Now, I know 100 paces from the beginning/foot of the culvert has been stepped off on the Lighthouse side, but has anyone stepped it off on the E. Ravine Rd side? To me, looking at GMaps anyway, it looks like walking 100 paces
southeast
(I would check to see if it’s “rock and soil” too…) moves you back in, towards the grand stairs. Now, if you start at the foot of the ravine on the OTHER side of E. Ravine Rd (on the trail), I can see where this comes out to the Hell Stone. But, if you do take that trail southeast toward said Hell Stone, to reach a birch tree, you can’t come to another birch unless you cross a road? Do the trees match up going this route? To me, you can’t count five birch trees moving west (back towards the stairs…from Google anyway).

Hmm….
I think you might be taking the lines slightly out of order. If you turn right at the top of the stairs and pass the Masonic compass that was once on the lamppost, you will reach the Ravine Road footbridge. And at the far, northwest corner of the footbridge there’s a culvert that leads down to the Locust Street Trail. (It’s actually an official connection to the trail. I think somewhere on the city website there’s even a map that labels it as a “culvert.”)
Once you descend to
the foot of the culvert
and go
below the bridge
(on the Locust Street Trail), THEN you start counting out the
100 paces southeast over rock and soil
. The trail is definitely made of “rock and soil” and it definitely runs southeast to the Hell Stone. The birches, if they ever existed, were planted in that strip of land that runs east-west between the trail and the road. They’re gone now and we just haven’t been able to see the stumps because that area is covered with a sea of
Ailanthus
for 9 months out of the year.
You win the official Dancing Skittles Award for the term “Hell Stone.”

Ive become very comfotable with the sense that Milwaukee’s solution will incorporate a juggle type theme, meaning there is a focus on multiple objects, persons, or places in a pattern that may fit a circle as depicted in image 10.
I also feel that the verse works in an orderly fashion. Three times, the verse highlights things of three. Three stories, three who lived there, and three more (young birch) staying west. (There is the use of the word “young” btw, which works as “something from woman”, children, young.)
What if we are to discover three specific locations?
Begin with Mitchell Hall, view its three stories.
Walk for an hour, (the average walking speed of a person is 3 miles per hour).
Arrive at the penny fountain at the Arcade of 200 Grand avenue and ascend the 92 steps, a group of four things in a circle, each 23 steps.
Consider where next to go, another hour walk.
Three miles away is Kosciuszco, a “male rider” (mail writer = letter?) from Poland.
Consider the wonderstone, a fancy mineral rich rock, tumbled to achieve a fine polish. Rock tumbling is very much like juggling…turning the stones in a circle. Polish = Poland.
Hmm. I like it.

Proud…to have received an award, a medal, a rank that recognizes your achievement or success.
Tall…everyone around you is short because you have a nice plinth on which to stand, or you are sitting on a horse, or you’re just freakishly tall.
Fifth…5 somethings.

Hello, first time poster here. Realizing there are 100 pages of this thread! Has anyone taken a crack at the “proud, tall fifth” portion of this verse in context with the 1980s Milwaukee?
Thanks

3DBernieMom

Hello, first time poster here. Realizing there are 100 pages of this thread! Has anyone taken a crack at the “proud, tall fifth” portion of this verse in context with the 1980s Milwaukee?
Thanks

Hey there! Welcome
when you say “in context” that is actually the only way it can be done
so yes, people look at various portions of the verses based on how things were in the 80s
But if you have some different ideas, that’s ok too!

So now they’re looking for a lion in Milwaukee. Found one!

It’s really spooky to see videos of a full-grown lioness
sauntering through people’s yards in downtown Milwaukee…

WR, the girlscout sign with the faded background match is wicked!
The Lake Park is surely correct…or a diabolical Preissian trap.  I see what AP is talking about when she says you’ll feel like it has to be the place once your feet are actually there on the lip of a culvert.
Id like someone to take the 3 mile (precisely 3 miles!) Journey from the grand stair to the tree I’ve found at approximately 800 W. Lincoln Ave.  Look at that perspective closely and see if 30 years hasn’t completely altered the result beyond recognition.

erexere

a diabolical Preissian trap

Indeed.
More randomness…
A letter from the country of wonderstone’s
heart
h – M (GER
M
ANY)
On a proud, tall fifth – AP (
AP
ROUDTALL, first fifth of the ten letters)
Don’t suppose there are any signs with maps round there?
(I’m determined to interpret this verse as obtusely as possible.)

Lots of threes in this verse. Three stories of Mitchell. Three who lived there. Three staying west…
(the three staying west remind me of the three who stayed on West Wisconsin)
…and the three faces on the Girl Scouts logo.
“Milwau
kee
County Park System”…the key…? Maybe this shape and key position are from the sign.
Pass the compass and reach
The foot of the culvert
Below the bridge
Walk 100 paces
Southeast over rock and soil
To the first young birch
Pass three, staying west
You’ll see a letter from the country
Of wonderstone’s hearth
On a proud, tall fifth
I was wondering again about “pass three” referring to this sign on the tree. I can’t remember whether more than one of these was found, but I was looking at Stercox’s map showing the one at the top of the south ravine.
If you follow Stercox’s route as far as the top of the north ravine, interpreting this point as “the foot of the culvert [that runs] below the bridge”, could you then walk 100 paces southeast to the GS tree (circled), or thereabouts…?
Walk 100 paces
Southeast over rock and soil
To the first young birch
Pass three, staying west
You could walk to the tree, then head west. Or you could pass the three on the sign
during
the 100 paces, staying west of them. That seems to make more sense of the word “staying”. (Are the three on the correct side of the tree to be “staring west”…?)
There seems to have been something called the “Girl Scouts of Birch Trails Council” in Wisconsin, though I’m not sure exactly what it was.
Circle of fifths…harpsichord…
perfect fifths
…
P5, CG, GD, DA, AE, EB, FC

Hey all, first posting here.
I first fell down this rabbit hole about a year and a half ago. Now that I’ve read this whole board I figured I should introduce myself! Someone also just sent me an article that was published today on Vice.com today which got me excited about this again!
http://www.vice.com/read/the-35-year-lo … n-treasure
Anyway, I live on the east side about a five minute walk from where I think the casque was buried. I’m definitely up for grabbing a coffee or beer and discussing this puzzle with any other local folks.
Jackson

I’ve reconsidered the section of verse that follows the 92 steps and ends with 100 paces.  It seems to make too good of sense to continue to clime the final three steps, walk south in Lake Park to the culvert below the Lion Bridges and walk 100 paces to the Lincoln Memorial Drive.  I’m sure at least one person on this site is also in favor of that hypothesis.
The next dot to connect is “to the first young…”.  I wonder if there is a birch at all…

I keep thinking about three somethings and legs/feet.  Three stories, three who lived there, three steps after 92, pass three… should 3rd street be a consideration at some point?
And the mention of a fifth, perhaps we should look for a third…Third Ward = in the direction of three?

I’m sure that most would agree that Byron Preiss was highly educated, well read, and a bit of a pioneer in his industry. Being somewhat of the opposite, it always bothered me that he recycles words in some verses. I send emails all day long and constantly attempt to clean up my repetitive text. It seems an industry professional would rethink his writing…..unless it was done with intent.
The repeated key words are three, distance, and foot. After determining the southern foot, this provides an instruction to use a three foot distance from it when digging.
I am becoming increasingly convinced that each end spot will be manipulated in some way based on instructions or a theme in their respective puzzle.

I like.